The White House wants your doctor to teach you about global

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AspieUtah
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25 Jun 2015, 12:20 pm

DailyCaller.com wrote:
...The Obama administration has been hard at work trying to draw a link between global warming and public health issues. The summit included the U.S. Surgeon General, top administration officials, and public health experts from around the country telling doctors, nurses and other conference goers how to talk about global warming with their patients....

DailyCaller.com: "The White House wants your doctor to teach you about global " (June 25, 2015)
http://www.dailycaller.com/2015/06/25/t ... al-warming )

Great. Even more propaganda to avoid at my medical examinations.


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Janissy
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25 Jun 2015, 12:47 pm

At first I was going to be outraged because doctors see patients for minutes at a time and that is purely a waste. I am already annoyed at being asked if my home has a smoke alarm every time I go for a checkup. If this is so crucial to a checklist, why not put it in my medical record? And if it's not in my medical record because it's not actually medical information about me, then stop wasting time asking me.

Anyhoo, I googled. The New York Times has a somewhat calmer take on it.

http://www.nytimes.com/cwire/2011/06/15/15climatewire-doctors-prepare-their-professions-to-explain-8660.html?pagewanted=all

Quote:
"I don't go on a soapbox making a scientific case, but by the time patients come to my office, they pretty much understand something is going on," he said. "They want to know why they are wheezing, why they have watery eyes and why their throats are swelling up. They understand the pollen season is worse this year."


So it isn't that a short climate change lecture is supposed to now accompany the "eat more vegetables" lecture that doctors routinely deliver patients. It's that doctors, particularly allergists, may start giving "climate change" as an answer when patients ask why their pollen allergies are so much worse these days.

There is this important thought.
Quote:
But for some physicians, these types of conversations -- on climate change and a host of other topics -- are also fraught with concerns about espousing political views that may alienate patients, she said.

"It is a common theme that physicians really are not in favor of using their office as an opportunity to communicate a political agenda. I think physicians are really geared toward focusing on patient care and trying not to be judgmental on political views," she said


Physicians are stepping out on shaky ground and they know it. Even giving "climate change" as an answer to why there is more pollen and therefore worse pollen allergies is fraught. What if their pollen allergies are worse for a different reason? What if the high pollen count is because of something else? And even if they are correct and it is climate change, they need to be prepared to drop the subject immediately if the patient says "I don't think so, climate change isn't real".

Even though I have smoke alarms in my home, I am curious what the doctor would do if I said I didn't. Give me a lecture on fire safety? Tell me to go buy one as soon as I leave the office. Would it be patient non-compliance if I didn't?



Fugu
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25 Jun 2015, 12:53 pm

Janissy wrote:
At first I was going to be outraged because doctors see patients for minutes at a time and that is purely a waste. I am already annoyed at being asked if my home has a smoke alarm every time I go for a checkup. If this is so crucial to a checklist, why not put it in my medical record? And if it's not in my medical record because it's not actually medical information about me, then stop wasting time asking me.

Anyhoo, I googled. The New York Times has a somewhat calmer take on it.

http://www.nytimes.com/cwire/2011/06/15/15climatewire-doctors-prepare-their-professions-to-explain-8660.html?pagewanted=all

Quote:
"I don't go on a soapbox making a scientific case, but by the time patients come to my office, they pretty much understand something is going on," he said. "They want to know why they are wheezing, why they have watery eyes and why their throats are swelling up. They understand the pollen season is worse this year."


So it isn't that a short climate change lecture is supposed to now accompany the "eat more vegetables" lecture that doctors routinely deliver patients. It's that doctors, particularly allergists, may start giving "climate change" as an answer when patients ask why their pollen allergies are so much worse these days.

There is this important thought.
Quote:
But for some physicians, these types of conversations -- on climate change and a host of other topics -- are also fraught with concerns about espousing political views that may alienate patients, she said.

"It is a common theme that physicians really are not in favor of using their office as an opportunity to communicate a political agenda. I think physicians are really geared toward focusing on patient care and trying not to be judgmental on political views," she said


Physicians are stepping out on shaky ground and they know it. Even giving "climate change" as an answer to why there is more pollen and therefore worse pollen allergies is fraught. What if their pollen allergies are worse for a different reason? What if the high pollen count is because of something else? And even if they are correct and it is climate change, they need to be prepared to drop the subject immediately if the patient says "I don't think so, climate change isn't real".

Even though I have smoke alarms in my home, I am curious what the doctor would do if I said I didn't. Give me a lecture on fire safety? Tell me to go buy one as soon as I leave the office. Would it be patient non-compliance if I didn't?
that's not the best comparison tbh, climate change affects the entire planet, someone's house burning down doesn't.

it's pretty easy to see why there's more pollen. water from the melting ice caps is helping more plants grow = more pollen



Janissy
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25 Jun 2015, 1:21 pm

Fugu wrote:
Janissy wrote:
At first I was going to be outraged because doctors see patients for minutes at a time and that is purely a waste. I am already annoyed at being asked if my home has a smoke alarm every time I go for a checkup. If this is so crucial to a checklist, why not put it in my medical record? And if it's not in my medical record because it's not actually medical information about me, then stop wasting time asking me.

Anyhoo, I googled. The New York Times has a somewhat calmer take on it.

http://www.nytimes.com/cwire/2011/06/15/15climatewire-doctors-prepare-their-professions-to-explain-8660.html?pagewanted=all

Quote:
"I don't go on a soapbox making a scientific case, but by the time patients come to my office, they pretty much understand something is going on," he said. "They want to know why they are wheezing, why they have watery eyes and why their throats are swelling up. They understand the pollen season is worse this year."


So it isn't that a short climate change lecture is supposed to now accompany the "eat more vegetables" lecture that doctors routinely deliver patients. It's that doctors, particularly allergists, may start giving "climate change" as an answer when patients ask why their pollen allergies are so much worse these days.

There is this important thought.
Quote:
But for some physicians, these types of conversations -- on climate change and a host of other topics -- are also fraught with concerns about espousing political views that may alienate patients, she said.

"It is a common theme that physicians really are not in favor of using their office as an opportunity to communicate a political agenda. I think physicians are really geared toward focusing on patient care and trying not to be judgmental on political views," she said


Physicians are stepping out on shaky ground and they know it. Even giving "climate change" as an answer to why there is more pollen and therefore worse pollen allergies is fraught. What if their pollen allergies are worse for a different reason? What if the high pollen count is because of something else? And even if they are correct and it is climate change, they need to be prepared to drop the subject immediately if the patient says "I don't think so, climate change isn't real".

Even though I have smoke alarms in my home, I am curious what the doctor would do if I said I didn't. Give me a lecture on fire safety? Tell me to go buy one as soon as I leave the office. Would it be patient non-compliance if I didn't?
that's not the best comparison tbh, climate change affects the entire planet, someone's house burning down doesn't.

it's pretty easy to see why there's more pollen. water from the melting ice caps is helping more plants grow = more pollen


Somebody's house burning down doesn't affect the whole planet but affecting the whole planet shouldn't be the point in a doctor's office. The doctor's office should be reserved for things very specific to that patient. Time is short and expensive. I brought up the annual question about smoke alarms because I see it as a waste of time checking on general safety. There is a very long list of things that affect safety and a 15 minute office visit is not the time or place. "Climate change" is a better answer to the question of "doctor,why is there more pollen this year?" than "I don't know". But it needs to end there. Both to save time and to not overstep the doctor's role. I also think that asking about the setup of my home (smoke alarms or not) is overstepping.

I have no problem whatsoever with doctors writing articles and giving lectures to each other and the public about how climate change affects health. I just don't think that has a place in individual office visits.



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25 Jun 2015, 1:24 pm

Politics has no place in the exam room not to mention most doctors probably lean conservative so this is a double fail on the Obama administration, I don't think anybody wants their doc to lecture them about what they should believe regardless of their beliefs. As great man once said "know your role and shut your mouth jabroni!" :P



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25 Jun 2015, 1:26 pm

Janissy wrote:
Fugu wrote:
Janissy wrote:
At first I was going to be outraged because doctors see patients for minutes at a time and that is purely a waste. I am already annoyed at being asked if my home has a smoke alarm every time I go for a checkup. If this is so crucial to a checklist, why not put it in my medical record? And if it's not in my medical record because it's not actually medical information about me, then stop wasting time asking me.

Anyhoo, I googled. The New York Times has a somewhat calmer take on it.

http://www.nytimes.com/cwire/2011/06/15/15climatewire-doctors-prepare-their-professions-to-explain-8660.html?pagewanted=all

Quote:
"I don't go on a soapbox making a scientific case, but by the time patients come to my office, they pretty much understand something is going on," he said. "They want to know why they are wheezing, why they have watery eyes and why their throats are swelling up. They understand the pollen season is worse this year."


So it isn't that a short climate change lecture is supposed to now accompany the "eat more vegetables" lecture that doctors routinely deliver patients. It's that doctors, particularly allergists, may start giving "climate change" as an answer when patients ask why their pollen allergies are so much worse these days.

There is this important thought.
Quote:
But for some physicians, these types of conversations -- on climate change and a host of other topics -- are also fraught with concerns about espousing political views that may alienate patients, she said.

"It is a common theme that physicians really are not in favor of using their office as an opportunity to communicate a political agenda. I think physicians are really geared toward focusing on patient care and trying not to be judgmental on political views," she said


Physicians are stepping out on shaky ground and they know it. Even giving "climate change" as an answer to why there is more pollen and therefore worse pollen allergies is fraught. What if their pollen allergies are worse for a different reason? What if the high pollen count is because of something else? And even if they are correct and it is climate change, they need to be prepared to drop the subject immediately if the patient says "I don't think so, climate change isn't real".

Even though I have smoke alarms in my home, I am curious what the doctor would do if I said I didn't. Give me a lecture on fire safety? Tell me to go buy one as soon as I leave the office. Would it be patient non-compliance if I didn't?
that's not the best comparison tbh, climate change affects the entire planet, someone's house burning down doesn't.

it's pretty easy to see why there's more pollen. water from the melting ice caps is helping more plants grow = more pollen


Somebody's house burning down doesn't affect the whole planet but affecting the whole planet shouldn't be the point in a doctor's office. The doctor's office should be reserved for things very specific to that patient. Time is short and expensive. I brought up the annual question about smoke alarms because I see it as a waste of time checking on general safety. There is a very long list of things that affect safety and a 15 minute office visit is not the time or place. "Climate change" is a better answer to the question of "doctor,why is there more pollen this year?" than "I don't know". But it needs to end there. Both to save time and to not overstep the doctor's role. I also think that asking about the setup of my home (smoke alarms or not) is overstepping.

I have no problem whatsoever with doctors writing articles and giving lectures to each other and the public about how climate change affects health. I just don't think that has a place in individual office visits.
I can see your point, but for most people, their doc is going to be considered something of an authority on science(and by extension the Climate)



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25 Jun 2015, 1:27 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Politics has no place in the exam room not to mention most doctors probably lean conservative so this is a double fail on the Obama administration, I don't think anybody wants their doc to lecture them about what they should believe regardless of their beliefs. As great man once said "know your role and shut your mouth jabroni!" :P
good point. the closest thing to an authority on science that most people will see shouldn't talk about science. ever. :roll:



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25 Jun 2015, 1:36 pm

If doctors start lecturing their patients about climate change for what are transparently political motives, they'll probably end up having to see a doctor themselves for a broken nose.

On the subject of lectures on climate change, the Pope's latest encyclical, 'Laudato si' on the environment is well worth reading.



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25 Jun 2015, 2:10 pm

Fugu wrote:
Jacoby wrote:
Politics has no place in the exam room not to mention most doctors probably lean conservative so this is a double fail on the Obama administration, I don't think anybody wants their doc to lecture them about what they should believe regardless of their beliefs. As great man once said "know your role and shut your mouth jabroni!" :P
good point. the closest thing to an authority on science that most people will see shouldn't talk about science. ever. :roll:


Perhaps you should ask your doctors opinion on welfare or government regulation and then maybe you wouldn't feel so comfortable with them lecturing patients on politics. Why would a medical doctor know anything more about global warming than the normal layperson? You do realize these people are individuals with their own opinions and political beliefs right? Again, doctors in America are more typically conservative "pull yourself by your bootstraps" types(in my experience) so I really have to ask why you think this is a good idea? BTW, just because what they do is "science" doesn't mean they know literally all science so why would I care what they have to say about global warming unless they actually studied the climate? Because they're smart and went to college so just trust them?



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25 Jun 2015, 2:24 pm

Well, pollen counts have increased every year for the past few decades.

Since plants are largely at the mercy of their environment, it's reasonable to correlate that trend with observed climate trends.

If your allergies seem worse this year, it is likely that this is due to increased pollen, which is likely due to climate change.

Whether you care to believe it is your business i guess, but the data are considerably in favor of this conclusion whether or not it fits your chosen ideology.



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25 Jun 2015, 3:01 pm

On the political leanings of U.S. doctors, it seems to differ by specialty.

Image


Allergists, the doctors most likely to have patients wondering about increased pollen counts, seem to fall in the absolute center of the U.S, political spectrum. But if it is your child who is wheezing, their doctor is probably a liberal. Pediatric medicine seems to skew liberal everywhere but the orthopedic surgeons.

But those leanings are something that should not be relevant to an office visit.



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25 Jun 2015, 3:20 pm

Janissy wrote:
On the political leanings of U.S. doctors, it seems to differ by specialty.

Image


Allergists, the doctors most likely to have patients wondering about increased pollen counts, seem to fall in the absolute center of the U.S, political spectrum. But if it is your child who is wheezing, their doctor is probably a liberal. Pediatric medicine seems to skew liberal everywhere but the orthopedic surgeons.

But those leanings are something that should not be relevant to an office visit.


Hopefully it never will be, politics should stay out of the exam room. Period!

The graph is interesting, couple trends jump out

the higher paid are more conservative while the lower paid more liberal

Pediatrics is very liberal while surgeons are very conservative, I suspect that this is probably evidence in part of pretty big sex divide in those positions as surgeons are overwhelmingly male whereas women make up the majority of pediatricians nowadays.

I do wonder what "more conservative" and "more liberal" means, relative to what? The public, doctors?



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25 Jun 2015, 3:35 pm

I fail to see anything sinister in what I read.

I think what we are seeing here is people looking for any reason at all to condemn Obama.



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25 Jun 2015, 6:10 pm

Jacoby wrote:
Hopefully it never will be, politics should stay out of the exam room. Period!

Impossible. Healthcare is inherently political.

Whether it's getting hotter or not isn't.

Rather than saying "it's because of climate change", perhaps doctors could say "it's because it's getting warmer earlier in the year and so plants are releasing pollen earlier". Of course, those are the same thing, but the latter seems less likely to cause political controversy.

In any case, I don't think any doctor is going to be saying "we can cure you, we just need to implement a 100% tax on oil and erect a giant wind turbine in every garden".



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25 Jun 2015, 6:23 pm

All my physicians know that I refuse to discuss anything other than the reason(s) about which I attend their offices.

Seat belts? I refuse to answer. Tobacco, drugs, alcohol? I refuse to answer. Anyone in my family who does these things? I refuse to answer. Any colds or flu since the last time you visited? I refuse to answer. What are you here for today? Well, thank you for asking!


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25 Jun 2015, 6:28 pm

AspieUtah wrote:
All my physicians know that I refuse to discuss anything other than the reason(s) about which I attend their offices.

Seat belts? I refuse to answer. Tobacco, drugs, alcohol? I refuse to answer. Anyone in my family who does these things? I refuse to answer. Any colds or flu since the last time you visited? I refuse to answer. What are you here for today? Well, thank you for asking!
2 3 and 4 are medically relevant, so you're wasting your own time and that of your GP's