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nurseangela
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28 Jan 2017, 4:51 am

Shahunshah wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
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Hey Nurseangela can you defend Trump giving money to Schumer, Clinton and Pelosi despite being a solid republican for nine years.


I thought he has given money to both sides. Ive been a Demo in the past (in my 20's), but not now. So that doesn't mean Trump couldn't have been a Demo at one time and changed parties later. They did say on Fox that Trump uaed to be pro-choice and is now pro-life. I was also the same on abortion - my views switched so I changed parties.

He did change views but get this. Trump gave money to them despite being a Republican. How can you justify that?

Does the guy not care about the effects these politicians might have on the people?


All I can say is that I make a mental note of these things and watch his actions. He used to be real chummy with the Clintons - I find that whole relationship weird. Didnt anyone on the Left wonder about that?


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28 Jan 2017, 4:54 am

underwater wrote:
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Personally I usually try to view claims like a judge would and rule out anything that falls under such conditions as being circumstantial evidence, anecdotal evidence, hearsay, conjecture and speculation (not to mention mountains of sensationalism). It seems like most if not all the stuff I see people accusing him of falls into those categories. Plus a great number of things said against Trump have been by way of prognostication. Now if he's as bad as many claim, it shouldn't take much time now that he's in office for there to be solid evidence. So far I haven't seen any.


Well, I'd say that one of the real worries about Trump is how he goes around pretending that he didn't say something, when the evidence is right there on Twitter. That is just damn peculiar. So the question is really; is a habitual liar, or does he really believe the stuff he's saying? Either option is worrisome.


Okay, now that's something solid if the evidence can be presented. However, I believe other presidents have been guilty of going back and forth on what they've said. So that makes less alarming to me if that's that's the case. I'd also be concerned it might have something to do with him being 70 years old and simply forgetting what he said previously.

underwater wrote:
What I sometimes find lacking when people discuss sources is that a lot of people seem to think they are capable of making judgments about things they really know nothing about. So when a fraudster like Vaknin goes around armchair diagnosing people, I don't really spend much time on it; he has no credibility and no access to Obama, so listening to him is pointless. But when people whose job is to diagnose personality disorders go about and say someone has a personality disorder, I think it's worth listening to them. They may not always be right, but I put the probability of their being right much higher than if I were to make a judgment myself.

That's what's so strange; it seems everybody is convinced they're an expert on everything. There seems to be very little openness to the idea that there is a world of things out there that we know little about but others do. What happened to asking someone who knows something?


I agree. That's why I'm always asking myself, where's the expert in whatever field making these determinations? As for qualified psychoanalysis being made, I believe some consider that unethical when that person isn't their patient and they haven't been able to perform a proper examination and conduct proper tests.



nurseangela
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28 Jan 2017, 5:11 am

EzraS wrote:
underwater wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Personally I usually try to view claims like a judge would and rule out anything that falls under such conditions as being circumstantial evidence, anecdotal evidence, hearsay, conjecture and speculation (not to mention mountains of sensationalism). It seems like most if not all the stuff I see people accusing him of falls into those categories. Plus a great number of things said against Trump have been by way of prognostication. Now if he's as bad as many claim, it shouldn't take much time now that he's in office for there to be solid evidence. So far I haven't seen any.


Well, I'd say that one of the real worries about Trump is how he goes around pretending that he didn't say something, when the evidence is right there on Twitter. That is just damn peculiar. So the question is really; is a habitual liar, or does he really believe the stuff he's saying? Either option is worrisome.


Okay, now that's something solid if the evidence can be presented. However, I believe other presidents have been guilty of going back and forth on what they've said. So that makes less alarming to me if that's that's the case. I'd also be concerned it might have something to do with him being 70 years old and simply forgetting what he said previously.

underwater wrote:
What I sometimes find lacking when people discuss sources is that a lot of people seem to think they are capable of making judgments about things they really know nothing about. So when a fraudster like Vaknin goes around armchair diagnosing people, I don't really spend much time on it; he has no credibility and no access to Obama, so listening to him is pointless. But when people whose job is to diagnose personality disorders go about and say someone has a personality disorder, I think it's worth listening to them. They may not always be right, but I put the probability of their being right much higher than if I were to make a judgment myself.

That's what's so strange; it seems everybody is convinced they're an expert on everything. There seems to be very little openness to the idea that there is a world of things out there that we know little about but others do. What happened to asking someone who knows something?


I agree. That's why I'm always asking myself, where's the expert in whatever field making these determinations? As for qualified psychoanalysis being made, I believe some consider that unethical when that person isn't their patient and they haven't been able to perform a proper examination and conduct proper tests.


Exactly. Like when all of the armchair shrinks said Trumps son had autism.


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EzraS
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28 Jan 2017, 5:15 am

nurseangela wrote:
Can you give an example of the Twitter lies because I also follow Trump on Twitter.


Yes, I would like to see comparison Tweets. I'm sure someone has compiled them if they exist. So far I haven't found anything substantial in looking, however I didn't spend much time on it.

nurseangela wrote:
Exactly. Like when all of the armchair shrinks said Trumps son had autism.


Even real shrinks really need to perform a proper examination and conduct proper tests before diagnosing someone.



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28 Jan 2017, 6:19 am

It would be nice to see a thread like this make it 6 hours before the hyperpartisanship sets in.


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28 Jan 2017, 7:54 am

You talk about real issues without hyperbole then speculate about personality disorders and other pathologies so it's hard to take serious, a real issue to me is something like immigration or trade or foreign policy not an armchair diagnosis of someone you don't know and have never interacted with. What is the implication with that line of thought, 'he's mentally defective therefor not qualified to hold office'? Do you see the issue with that? The truth is none of us know Trump personally and in the end I do not care if he is not the nicest person if he is a strong & competent leader who puts America's interests first. If that's people's biggest issue with Trump then I think its unfounded and the result of media mischaracterization and smears.



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28 Jan 2017, 8:21 am

I think he has a big ego. But I also think that will tend to be an asset in him not letting people push him around. His .predecessor seemed like too much of a pushover. Which is basically why Trump is having to fix the messed up healthcare system.



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28 Jan 2017, 8:21 am

Why are we so interested in Trump's personality?

Because he's interesting. He talks in an unusual way. He says unusual things. He's reactions are knee jerk and if he wasn't in such a powerful position his twitter account would be entertaining. You can't deny that's much more interesting than regular politicians.

Whether one likes him or not, there's some really interesting stuff going on in that head if psychology is your thing.

I do think that short attention span and black and white thinking is unusual in politics. He's like my Mum. People are either golden and wonderful to him or bad and dead to him. Things are good one day and bad the next. He is definitely dictator material.

Other politicians, or real politicians have the savvy to hide that sort of thing and portray an air of stability to the public.

I think people like the feeling that he is saying how he really thinks because he is so invested in the thing at that moment in time. That emotional reaction makes people think he cares. But that raw emotion can be a sort of side effect of a personality disorder.

People with personality disorders are like that. They're gripped in that one intense feeling without consideration for the future. That emotion about that thing is literally all they can feel and see. Consequences can go to hell.

I could never understand why my mum would get so obsessed with one thing, then her mood would change for no reason and it wouldn't matter the next moment. But now I know she has a personality disorder it helps me understand her better.

It's like my Mum is running America. (that's not a hyperbole it's a similie).

The doomsday clock has been moved two and half minutes to midnight because of his unpredictability. He was mentioned repeatedly in the report of atomic scientists. No individual has ever been mentioned like that in their report before. No one individual has affected the doomsday clock like that before.

He is different and that makes us interested... And a bit worried for our safety.



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28 Jan 2017, 8:26 am

Earthbound wrote:
nurseangela wrote:
You know whats really weird? Obama snorting coke and having sex with men during his college days.


This isn't a topic about Obama though. He isn't president anymore! Don't derail the subject because people are mentioning issues with Trump.


Considering the fact that there are things Trump is doing which is a direct result of the Obama administration, such as replacing Obamacare to name one of several, Obama is a part of the issues with Trump. Therefore demanding that Obama not be mentioned in this thread is unreasonable.



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28 Jan 2017, 9:15 am

There's a lot of issues that the Trump presidency brings to the forefront. My biggest concern right now is his comment about supporting Christian immigrants, but not Islamic. On the surface this seems like a no-brainer. The terrorists are Islamic therefore keep Muslims out. But it's an old reasoning flaw: All Islamic terrorists are Muslim, but all Muslims are not terrorists. Now it's up to the States if they choose to let people in or not, but this is a concern to me because it defines people by their religion. This is a huge step backwards and opens the door to accepting bigotry.

And Nurse, even if Obama did have sex with men and snort cocaine, of which there is no evidence, why is that a problem?



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28 Jan 2017, 9:17 am

hurtloam wrote:
Why are we so interested in Trump's personality?

Because he's interesting. He talks in an unusual way. He says unusual things. He's reactions are knee jerk and if he wasn't in such a powerful position his twitter account would be entertaining. You can't deny that's much more interesting than regular politicians.

Whether one likes him or not, there's some really interesting stuff going on in that head if psychology is your thing.

I do think that short attention span and black and white thinking is unusual in politics. He's like my Mum. People are either golden and wonderful to him or bad and dead to him. Things are good one day and bad the next. He is definitely dictator material.

Other politicians, or real politicians have the savvy to hide that sort of thing and portray an air of stability to the public.

I think people like the feeling that he is saying how he really thinks because he is so invested in the thing at that moment in time. That emotional reaction makes people think he cares. But that raw emotion can be a sort of side effect of a personality disorder.

People with personality disorders are like that. They're gripped in that one intense feeling without consideration for the future. That emotion about that thing is literally all they can feel and see. Consequences can go to hell.

I could never understand why my mum would get so obsessed with one thing, then her mood would change for no reason and it wouldn't matter the next moment. But now I know she has a personality disorder it helps me understand her better.

It's like my Mum is running America. (that's not a hyperbole it's a similie).

The doomsday clock has been moved two and half minutes to midnight because of his unpredictability. He was mentioned repeatedly in the report of atomic scientists. No individual has ever been mentioned like that in their report before. No one individual has affected the doomsday clock like that before.

He is different and that makes us interested... And a bit worried for our safety.


I think you read too much into it, there is a deliberate effort on the media's part to paint Trump as mentally unstable to undermine his legitimacy but there is no real evidence of it whatsoever. Personal observation thru the TV or twitter could not be more useless in my opinion. So much of politics is just theater and Trump is a natural at it, he's created character separate from himself that is meant for public consumption so calling him a narcissist or sociopath would be like calling The Rock or Hulk Hogan one because of the pro wrestling character they play on TV. Donald Trump is a WWE Hall of Famer by the way! :P

Everyone that meets with Trump privately comes across with a different idea of him afterwards, people don't know Donald Trump they only know the media characterization and the persona he's created for himself. Trump would not have won the presidency if he was a shrinking violet, this idea that he doesn't know what he's doing couldn't be further from the truth I think. Trump isn't where he's at by chance.



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28 Jan 2017, 9:31 am

androbot01 wrote:
There's a lot of issues that the Trump presidency brings to the forefront. My biggest concern right now is his comment about supporting Christian immigrants, but not Islamic. On the surface this seems like a no-brainer. The terrorists are Islamic therefore keep Muslims out. But it's an old reasoning flaw: All Islamic terrorists are Muslim, but all Muslims are not terrorists. Now it's up to the States if they choose to let people in or not, but this is a concern to me because it defines people by their religion. This is a huge step backwards and opens the door to accepting bigotry.

And Nurse, even if Obama did have sex with men and snort cocaine, of which there is no evidence, why is that a problem?


Middle East Christians should be protected since they are being genocidedand this is happening across the board in almost every Muslim country they are in, the other simple truth is that these Christians don't pose a threat to the US whereas Sunni Muslims in that part of the world do. Their religious beliefs and the extremist ideologies they support are antithetical to Western values, even if its not a majority it's a significant enough percentage that some sort of new vetting process needs to be created in order to keep us safe. In the end I think these Christians also have a much better chance at assimilation than their Muslim counterparts, I don't think radical Islam is compatible with our way of life and thus I don't think it should be allowed to gain a foothold in the west. Those that sympathize and believe in the most extreme forms of Islam are not owed entry to the United States, religious freedom is not a free pass to barbarism.



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28 Jan 2017, 10:01 am

Jacoby wrote:
...Christians don't pose a threat to the US whereas Sunni Muslims in that part of the world do.

I don't see Trump distinguishing between Sunni and Shia.



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28 Jan 2017, 10:14 am

nurseangela wrote:
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My issues are

- His temperament: Can he withstand enough insults from other leaders with composure?

- Whether he actually listens to the people: He seems to dismiss these peaceful protests as 'brats that are whinging'. And in some cases, this is actually the case. That being said, he should still communicate to them somehow and ask them what they are worried about and how they can move foreword from there.

- The wall: How long will it take? Will it even be done before he leaves office? Is it worth it?

- Some of his cabinet picks: Their discriminatory background is very fishy to say the least.


Peaceful protests where they light a limo on fire and Madonna wants to blow up the White House?

The Repubs must love his picks because Mitch McConnell said there should be no problem passing them through.

Trump says he has a name for the supreme court's nominee. Will broadcast next week.


No. I'm the first person to condemn those disgusting acts. I hate anarchists. I'm talking about the women's march as a whole (excluding Madonna).



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28 Jan 2017, 10:17 am

androbot01 wrote:
There's a lot of issues that the Trump presidency brings to the forefront. My biggest concern right now is his comment about supporting Christian immigrants, but not Islamic. On the surface this seems like a no-brainer. The terrorists are Islamic therefore keep Muslims out. But it's an old reasoning flaw: All Islamic terrorists are Muslim, but all Muslims are not terrorists. Now it's up to the States if they choose to let people in or not, but this is a concern to me because it defines people by their religion. This is a huge step backwards and opens the door to accepting bigotry.


Sadly, this is nothing new and i will never understand the reasoning. The former prime minister of Australia wanted to use the same method in Syria...Before he got impeached.



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28 Jan 2017, 10:30 am

Tomzy95 wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
There's a lot of issues that the Trump presidency brings to the forefront. My biggest concern right now is his comment about supporting Christian immigrants, but not Islamic. On the surface this seems like a no-brainer. The terrorists are Islamic therefore keep Muslims out. But it's an old reasoning flaw: All Islamic terrorists are Muslim, but all Muslims are not terrorists. Now it's up to the States if they choose to let people in or not, but this is a concern to me because it defines people by their religion. This is a huge step backwards and opens the door to accepting bigotry.


Sadly, this is nothing new and i will never understand the reasoning. The former prime minister of Australia wanted to use the same method in Syria...Before he got impeached.

CBC: U.S. entry ban affecting passengers as Trump, Putin set to talk

Quote:
Meanwhile, the consequences of Trump's executive order signed the previous day are now becoming apparent. Six passengers trying to fly from Cairo to New York, were barred from their flight on Saturday morning, according to officials at the Cairo airport. Five of the travellers are Iraqi, the other is from Yemen. The unidentified officials said the six were prevented from boarding an EygptAir flight to New York's John F. Kennedy Airport.
...
The New York Times reports that two Iraqi refugees were detained at JFK Airport after Trump's executive order went into effect Friday night. The Times said the pair's lawyers filed a writ of habeas corpus on Saturday in a New York court to have their clients released.