How many Trump supporters can be persuaded?

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EzraS
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05 Nov 2017, 3:07 am

auntblabby wrote:
EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
the people [like gen. Kelly] who maintain we should have "compromised" with the south, conveniently leave out the fact that such compromise could only mean maintenance and eventual expansion of slavery over the rest of America. hence, a de facto denial of slavery as a civil war issue, from a historical standpoint.


I'm just not seeing it. Kelly didn't say they should have compromised with the south. He said "The lack of an ability to compromise lead to the civil war". Isn't that just a statement of fact?

no, not at all. strictly opinion, dissembling opinion, on the part of somebody ultimately well schooled in world history who should have known better than to speak as he did.


So if a lack of ability to compromise, as in unable to compromise, because it wasn't possible, didn't lead to the civil war, then what did?



Kraichgauer
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05 Nov 2017, 3:11 am

In fact, the north had constantly compromised with the south leading up to the Civil War, such as with the Kansas/Nebraska Act, and the agreement to honor the deplorable Runaway Slave Act, and yet the south still tried seceding.


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auntblabby
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05 Nov 2017, 3:16 am

EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
the people [like gen. Kelly] who maintain we should have "compromised" with the south, conveniently leave out the fact that such compromise could only mean maintenance and eventual expansion of slavery over the rest of America. hence, a de facto denial of slavery as a civil war issue, from a historical standpoint.


I'm just not seeing it. Kelly didn't say they should have compromised with the south. He said "The lack of an ability to compromise lead to the civil war". Isn't that just a statement of fact?

no, not at all. strictly opinion, dissembling opinion, on the part of somebody ultimately well schooled in world history who should have known better than to speak as he did.


So if a lack of ability to compromise, as in unable to compromise, because it wasn't possible, didn't lead to the civil war, then what did?

going back decades to what they taught us in American history :o - the refusal of the south to limit its slavery/table any talk of slavery's expansion to the new states, was at heart of it. each state added to the union renewed arguments as to whether it would be slave or free. this was the main thing, but of course there were other cultural differences as well, which did not help things stay friendly between the sides. the only thing "compromise" could have meant to the south, was "let us keep expanding slavery wherever and whenever we want."



EzraS
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05 Nov 2017, 3:25 am

Lincoln himself said that it was an all or nothing situation. That either slavery would have to exist across the united sates or it would have to be abolished across the united states. So there was no compromise that was possible. There was a lack of ability to compromise. As in that option wasn't available.



auntblabby
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05 Nov 2017, 4:00 am

so when gen. Kelly said what he said, he was just "hablando mierde." Image



EzraS
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05 Nov 2017, 4:16 am

auntblabby wrote:
so when gen. Kelly said what he said, he was just "hablando mierde." Image


Lincoln also said, “If you look for the bad in someone expecting to find it, you surely will".

But really, it's obvious the idea is to perpetuate the idea that Trump and his administration are alt-right KKK nazis. What better way to win the next election?



auntblabby
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05 Nov 2017, 6:51 am

EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
so when gen. Kelly said what he said, he was just "hablando mierde." Image


Lincoln also said, “If you look for the bad in someone expecting to find it, you surely will".

But really, it's obvious the idea is to perpetuate the idea that Trump and his administration are alt-right KKK nazis. What better way to win the next election?

all I know is I detest his anti-working class philosophy, of taxing the 99% to benefit the 1%. just look at his latest tax plan, the working class gets their taxes raised, while everybody else gets a cut. where is the justice in THAT?



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05 Nov 2017, 6:56 am

I like how my post went entirely and 100 % ignored...anyways to reiterate what I said:

here is what I say

Sweetleaf wrote:
Perhaps all the Trump supporters who are having some of their land taken over by imminent domain to allow for the building of this wall they voted trump in to build between the U.S and Mexico can be swayed. :twisted: Just turns out some of the plans involve putting some of these peoples property on the 'mexican' side, and his supporters just can't believe it. Well you voted for him douchebag...! is what I say to those people.



Last edited by Sweetleaf on 05 Nov 2017, 6:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

auntblabby
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05 Nov 2017, 6:58 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
I like how my post went entirely and 100 % ignored...

I noticed it :mrgreen: and wish I had the courage to confront some of the local yahoos with rump signs in their yards and cars, who misbehave often.



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05 Nov 2017, 7:04 am

auntblabby wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
I like how my post went entirely and 100 % ignored...

I noticed it :mrgreen: and wish I had the courage to confront some of the local yahoos with rump signs in their yards and cars, who misbehave often.


Oh I would be defacing those signs left and right if I didn't think it would feed the delusion of right wing fundies that they are some persecuted class threatened by the very existence of immigrants and gays in this country. I don't want to feed that delusion...and destroy those delicate snowflakes.

Even on facebook today 'I don't judge, that is what god does' as he judges that homosexuals will be 'destroyed by his god' then cries persecution when people say 'hey that's f****d up to threaten people with your gods wrath.' Like it goes from righteous hate to crying 'waaa these people wont agree with me, homosexuality is legal...waaaa waaaa it should be a sin people are stoned for......this is an attack on my religion and very existence that gay marriage is legal waaaa waaa. Ok go back to the days before the U.S constitution and the salem with burnings, have fun there.



EzraS
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05 Nov 2017, 7:18 am

auntblabby wrote:
EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
so when gen. Kelly said what he said, he was just "hablando mierde." Image


Lincoln also said, “If you look for the bad in someone expecting to find it, you surely will".

But really, it's obvious the idea is to perpetuate the idea that Trump and his administration are alt-right KKK nazis. What better way to win the next election?

all I know is I detest his anti-working class philosophy, of taxing the 99% to benefit the 1%. just look at his latest tax plan, the working class gets their taxes raised, while everybody else gets a cut. where is the justice in THAT?


Not according to Forbes apparently:

LoveNotHate wrote:
Trump delivers on tax cuts.

Good news:
-The first $12,000 in income would be tax free so an immediate savings of $1,323.75 for anyone earning more than $12,000.
-The first tax bracket is 12% $12000-$45000 is mostly 3% lower than the present 15%, so $26000 is tax 3% lower which results in $780 savings for anyone earning more than $38,000.
-Non-itemizers will gain a +2000 deduction (increased standard deduction - loss of personal exemption) so a $200-250 savings

So, individual non-itemizing middle class filers will save like $2300.

While individual itemizing filers will lose deducting the local, state tax, and other deductions, so their savings will be like $1800.

The upper middle class will save more as the 28% bracket would be gone now. So, they could see savings like $4000-5000

Bad News:
The brackets will be based on the Chained CPI.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphill ... 973d24eb83


They can keep claiming the working class are going to pay higher taxes, but if they end up paying lower taxes, they'll know that was all bs.

There are certain claims that will be proven true or false by 2020:

Collusion with Russia.
Higher taxes for the middle class / working class.
More expensive health insurance for the middle class / working class.

If they're proven true, Trump will likely be out of a job.
If they're proven false, Trump will have a greater chance of being reelected.

The middle class / working class will know based on what's coming out of their pocket, which is true and which is false, no matter what CNN claims.



Sweetleaf
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05 Nov 2017, 7:24 am

EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
EzraS wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
so when gen. Kelly said what he said, he was just "hablando mierde." Image


Lincoln also said, “If you look for the bad in someone expecting to find it, you surely will".

But really, it's obvious the idea is to perpetuate the idea that Trump and his administration are alt-right KKK nazis. What better way to win the next election?

all I know is I detest his anti-working class philosophy, of taxing the 99% to benefit the 1%. just look at his latest tax plan, the working class gets their taxes raised, while everybody else gets a cut. where is the justice in THAT?


Not according to Forbes apparently:

LoveNotHate wrote:
Trump delivers on tax cuts.

Good news:
-The first $12,000 in income would be tax free so an immediate savings of $1,323.75 for anyone earning more than $12,000.
-The first tax bracket is 12% $12000-$45000 is mostly 3% lower than the present 15%, so $26000 is tax 3% lower which results in $780 savings for anyone earning more than $38,000.
-Non-itemizers will gain a +2000 deduction (increased standard deduction - loss of personal exemption) so a $200-250 savings

So, individual non-itemizing middle class filers will save like $2300.

While individual itemizing filers will lose deducting the local, state tax, and other deductions, so their savings will be like $1800.

The upper middle class will save more as the 28% bracket would be gone now. So, they could see savings like $4000-5000

Bad News:
The brackets will be based on the Chained CPI.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphill ... 973d24eb83


They can keep claiming the working class are going to pay higher taxes, but if they end up paying lower taxes, they'll know that was all bs.

There are certain claims that will be proven true or false by 2020:

Collusion with Russia.
Higher taxes for the middle class / working class.
More expensive health insurance for the middle class / working class.

If they're proven true, Trump will likely be out of a job.
If they're proven false, Trump will have a greater chance of being reelected.

The middle class / working class will know based on what's coming out of their pocket, which is true and which is false, no matter what CNN claims.


Don't forget the Trump administration does not care about people like you, who can't even verbally communicate, you've said you're non-verbal right? How do you think trump and his administration that you admire so much will help you if worst comes to worst? You really think they care about non-verbal autistic 'invalids' as they would likely consider you as. Maybe you should spend less time trying to find reasons to defend Trump and his likes and focus more on how you will survive with Trumps philosophy of how the U.S government should be ran. Invalid, non-verbals are not people that will be seen as worth protecting by this administration.

What are you going to do write trump a letter to swear you alligence so he can come back with 'oh look at this retard who can't event talk' because that is his mentality, its not like he'll say anything nice about you.

Sure trust president trump as much as you want, but why on earth do you think this would be good for you? Or are you just not thinking about that part?



EzraS
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05 Nov 2017, 7:42 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
Don't forget the Trump administration does not care about people like you, who can't even verbally communicate, you've said you're non-verbal right? How do you think trump and his administration that you admire so much will help you if worst comes to worst? You really think they care about non-verbal autistic 'invalids' as they would likely consider you as. Maybe you should spend less time trying to find reasons to defend Trump and his likes and focus more on how you will survive with Trumps philosophy of how the U.S government should be ran. Invalid, non-verbals are not people that will be seen as worth protecting by this administration.


Where did you get the idea that I admire the administration? Or even that I'm defending Trump? I'm just giving a personal evaluation of topics that are brought up.

You see, as a result of my autism, I'm detached and have little to no feelings about Trump and his administration.

And I have no idea on how the administration feels about someone like me. Without sufficient evidence that they're out to eliminate me or whatever, I have to consider such a claim to be propagandist hyperbole.

The basic overall claim seems to be, Trump: He's a megalomaniac sociopathic psychopath who is out to get anyone who's not white and wealthy and perfect.

Can you see how I find problems with certain claims that are made?



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05 Nov 2017, 1:55 pm

EzraS wrote:
Lincoln himself said that it was an all or nothing situation. That either slavery would have to exist across the united sates or it would have to be abolished across the united states. So there was no compromise that was possible. There was a lack of ability to compromise. As in that option wasn't available.


We're talking about human liberty here, where there can be no compromise. If anything, Lincoln is rightfully recognized for his social conscience that was far ahead of most people in his day.


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05 Nov 2017, 2:32 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Guess what, under Trump's plan, it's estimated even more people will pay higher health care costs with less services.


If that ends up being the case, then Trump will probably lose a sizable majority of supporters. However if they get what they consider a better plan, then that will help him get reelected. No matter what anti-Trump media says about it, what they're actually getting is what will matter to them.


Or they'll be still so enamored with Trump that they'll still vote for him, despite the fact that their doctor visits, tests, and medicine won't be covered anymore.

they'll vote for him because he pretends to hate the same people they do. i'm reminded of the words of the late great LBJ who said, “If you can convince the lowest white man he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll empty his pockets for you.”


Is that the same 'great' LBJ that helped kill millions of people in Vietnam?? And who called back US fighter jets from saving a US ship that was being bombed by Israel for 2 hours? You should be ashamed.


It's the LBJ who fought to give the vote to millions of African Americans who were disenfranchised, and who declared war on poverty for all races.


Do you even absorb what I write? He killed millions of people and was guilty of treason.


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