Why do some people feel the need to denigrate the religious?

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Aaron Rhodes
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03 Dec 2017, 9:16 pm

There's no winning against someone that says "I'm right because I believe I'm right", or "logic doesn't apply to my situation, therefore you can't prove me wrong". It's like dealing with a little kid. Logic is always applicable, what matters is whether it is used properly. Religious people make up their own rules and guidelines for applying logic in such a way that their beliefs will always be proven true. This is obviously a grave misuse and misunderstanding of logic. I took an ethics class in college, and the professor's approach to using logic was to ignore anything that disproved his desired conclusion, or he would simply claim that it did not apply, which is awfully convenient. Despite that major flaw, he was still able to make some decent points through normal logical means. This proves that logic as we know it is applicable to religious beliefs, but that isn't to say that it will ultimately disprove those beliefs.

Logic mainly applies when making statements or developing concepts. In most other areas, it is much more difficult to visualize and/or prove the role that it plays, but that does not necessarily mean that it does not apply. Since beliefs are primarily concepts and ideas, logic definitely applies.



Aaron Rhodes
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03 Dec 2017, 10:41 pm

For the sake of clarity, I will refer to two different groups: people who are devoted to their beliefs (including atheists), and people who have chosen not to strictly follow any belief, religious or otherwise. Within the former group, false criticisms will occur with very little provocation, since each group is set in their ways and their beliefs do not apply to each other. However, an interaction between both the former and the latter group will have more mixed and varying results. Depending on the topics discussed, the results will range from mutual agreements to very heated arguments. The more intense the arguments, the more likely someone will become frustrated. The more frustrated they are, the more likely they will resort to using insults and belittlement in place of rational arguments. Now, there is a sub category of the latter group, which consists of people who criticize and insult others without any discernible reason other than to cause harm and disputes. This is the only group that does not resort to denigrating others through circumstantial means; in other words, they are the only ones that actually feel a need to falsely criticize or ridicule people's beliefs.



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04 Dec 2017, 1:03 am

On a side note this is a really interesting podcast. Barely touches magic actually and starts off with Gordon's dismay with left-right politics, postmodernism, and he goes on to play a lengthy discourse by an animal researcher dismantling human exceptionalism among animals as well as discussing the kinds of 19th century and previous odd assumptions sitting that the bottom of the stack of academia while, at the same time, they attempt to dismantle human exceptionalism while still assuming all of the logical conclusions that imply human exceptionalism.


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04 Dec 2017, 2:50 am

I must admit that I have no problem with people who denigrate Sociology. I consider that to be a fake religion of no value whatsoever.



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04 Dec 2017, 4:16 am

"Sociology"????????????????????

You must have made a typo, and meant "Scientology"

Scientology is the worldwide cult that exploits the tax exempt status of churches, and like that.

Sociology is just a subject in school.



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04 Dec 2017, 2:15 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
"Sociology"????????????????????

You must have made a typo, and meant "Scientology"

Scientology is the worldwide cult that exploits the tax exempt status of churches, and like that.

Sociology is just a subject in school.


Oops! You are correct.

I did mean Scientology.



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04 Dec 2017, 2:38 pm

The Musings Of The Lost wrote:
Like some people seem to seek out religious people just to tell them they are wrong, they are idiots etc.
On the flipside there are some religious people who do the same to those of other religions or no religion at all.
I do think these people are just a loud, annoying minority in both sides.

Why do you think they do this? I see no purpose in it. Why can't people just be decent to each other, in your opinion?


If the religious were more peaceful and moral, no one would bother them.

Truth is that the religious have cause the worst evil that this world has seen, and the religious continue to harm gays and women thanks to their immoral homophobic and misogynous ways.

If you are a Christian, or Muslim, why did you complain against people above who push their views verbally, as compared to your religious ancestors who used the sword instead of decent arguments?

Are the religious not the worst offenders of the offence you purport goes to the other side?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxoxPapPxXk

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04 Dec 2017, 2:41 pm

VIDEODROME wrote:
A central reason is probably for a long time religion has felt it gets a special respect for beliefs that are 'sacred' and it has been sort of socially taboo to challenge them. I think some people have decided it's time for this to end and go out of their way to pop that bubble of perceived immunity from being challenged. Some use more tact while others skip civil debate and go straight into insults.


I see more religious do that than their interlocutors.

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kokopelli
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04 Dec 2017, 2:43 pm

For some religions, believers of that religion are "validated" by everyone else being in the same religion. For many of those believers, anyone who refuses to join their religion are seen as being blasphemous enemies who don't deserve to live.

Guess which religion is most like that today.



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04 Dec 2017, 2:45 pm

The Musings Of The Lost wrote:
VIDEODROME wrote:
A central reason is probably for a long time religion has felt it gets a special respect for beliefs that are 'sacred' and it has been sort of socially taboo to challenge them. I think some people have decided it's time for this to end and go out of their way to pop that bubble of perceived immunity from being challenged. Some use more tact while others skip civil debate and go straight into insults.


Good theory. From my persepctive theres nothing wrong with a debate, as long as basic respect is shown to the opposite side.


Tell me please how one shows respect to those who adore a genocidal son murdering God and is supporting a church that used Inquisitions to end the life of those who could not respect their ideology?

How can you respect me when I hate your God for all the crimes against humanity that he has visited us with?

Do you show respect for those who promote the KKK?

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04 Dec 2017, 2:49 pm

kokopelli wrote:
For some religions, believers of that religion are "validated" by everyone else being in the same religion. For many of those believers, anyone who refuses to join their religion are seen as being blasphemous enemies who don't deserve to live.

Guess which religion is most like that today.


I agree that many let their tribalism needs trump their moral sense and stay in religions that have poor moral codes.

As to your last.

Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/theft-values/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxoxPapPxXk

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04 Dec 2017, 2:55 pm

C2V wrote:
The likes of Richard Dawkins. Yuck.
It always struck me that the motivation of many of these people (the ones who are not interested in debate, in exchange of ideas and perspectives, etc - the people who just want to aggressively attack religious people of all kinds) comes from insecurity masquerading as superiority. They need to prove that they are superior - usually intellectually superior - to these "idiot" religious people, an do that by denigrating them. Because fundamentally they don't believe they're very bright, and have a hell of a lot to prove.
That's not everyone guilty of that attitude - there are many complex conditions which may lead to the same behaviour - but sadly it does seem to account for a large chunk of that group.


The intellectually and morally dissonant people are the religious, so I find it strange that you would see them as the intellectuals. when they have yet to put away the things of children as scriptures say it, and believe in all kinds of supernatural garbage.

Not too bright that. Right?

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04 Dec 2017, 2:59 pm

leejosepho wrote:
I believe it all ultimately boils down to people trying to prove themselves self-sufficient and equal with, greater than or at least having no need for the Creator...and then they attack anything and everything related to religion in order to try to drown out the reminders and/or all evidence to the contrary.


Why do you feel the need to adore a genocidal son murdering creator if not out of fear?

Religions are attacked for their actions, no9t their beliefs, unless those beliefs are immoral and then it is to moral people to try to show the religious the errors of their ways.

That is how Christianity's more killer wings were clipped by a more just secular law.

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04 Dec 2017, 3:05 pm

underwater wrote:
I've noticed that some atheists are quite as dogmatic as some religious people. It's charmless either way.

I feel that the atheists do less damage to others, though.

A lot of people have had very bad childhood experiences with religion, and this can fuel some bad feelings.

I have a strong distrust of religion myself. That doesn't mean I feel entitled to tell others how to live. It worries me that a lot of the religious people I know don't exercise the same restraint.


I agree with you on these issues but if others, because they are the majority, are denigrating and discriminating against gays and women, why would you not think of the women and gays that will pop up in your family and try to change the conditions that will have them degraded by homophobic and misogynous religions.

That is the long form of, for evil to grow all good people need do is not " tell others how to live."

They are trying to show you an evil way and it is your duty to all to fight their homophobia and misogyny.

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04 Dec 2017, 3:10 pm

GoSensGo wrote:
I'm all for debating ideas but what is there to debate on the religious front? And why would you want to take someone's faith away from them?

If people of faith try to impose their faith onto others, by all means fight back, but a person's spirituality isn't something we "move forward" on.


You seem completely oblivious to the damage religions have and continue to do to mankind.

Their past and current harm is what there is to discuss.

As any gay or woman in your family who has been tainted by religious homophobia and misogyny.

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04 Dec 2017, 3:15 pm

Michael829 wrote:
The Musings Of The Lost wrote:
Like some people seem to seek out religious people just to tell them they are wrong, they are idiots etc.
On the flipside there are some religious people who do the same to those of other religions or no religion at all.
I do think these people are just a loud, annoying minority in both sides.

Why do you think they do this? I see no purpose in it. Why can't people just be decent to each other, in your opinion?


That need to criticize the beliefs of others results from a need to believe in and assert their superiority. ...probably resulting from an inferiority-complex, or some other personal problem or unhappiness. In general, aggressive attack results from personal unhappiness.

I don't bother criticizing others' beliefs, including those of the people we're referring to here. I couldn't care less what they believe. I criticize only their behavior.

Michael829


Quite a narrow view given that Christian and Muslim beliefs have gifted us with Inquisitions and Jihads.

Let their immoral ideologies stand as beliefs and more of their destruction will find many of us.

The belief or ideology must die before the religious persecution and killings stops.

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DL