Questions For Occultists

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You could read a few books and easily find all the answers to these questions.

I suggest you look up three things to start you out:

1-scientism

2-who ensures quality control on empirical scientific studies

3-quantum physics

Then I would go back to your occultism questions. I’d maybe read a book about alchemy first, and then read about aleister crowley. I’d take a break then and recover. Go spend a week sitting in a field of flowers and thinking nice things. When you’ve recovered, take a look at BF skinner and jack parsons. After that you can read Bill Coopers Behold a Pale Horse.

Then you can do your best to forget everything you’ve read and pretend you’re living in a normal world.

Hardy har har. Seriously, it’s not nice stuff to know about, kiddo. I have THROWN AWAY my books about all that, in the trash can, because I don’t want my son reading them. That’s how bad it is.

I had the chance to read Crowley at length (Gems of the Equinox) and even got my Minerval in the OTO a couple years ago. Crowley pretty much just put punk rock patches on the ToL, made it edgy in the way that LaVey tried to dress up his own brand of libertarian atheism. OTO and AA tend to draw people who love solving games and puzzles (board games nights are usually good there but they see everything Crowley wrote as blend of Kabbalisms and Kaufmann-esque trolling, I tend to by and large agree).

If there is anyone I can think of on scaring people it would probably be Julius Evola - ie. the only guy to criticize Mussolini from a place to the right of him for not being right-wing enough.

Maybe I'll break my rule earlier and say one sincere thing:

Why I practice.

I take the possibility that we're immortal seriously. I consider that if that's the case, where I end up next time I'm born and what kinds of faculties I'll have, what kinds of tools I'll have, what kinds of fundamental tendencies and proclivities I'll have, and it will set the stage for how things go forward for the span of likely 80 years or better. To top it off childhood is an incredibly vulnerable time and if you aren't set up with the right faculties or find yourself among monsters you suffer terribly and have your whole life from then forward significantly altered.

For me that set of concerns makes accurate thinking critical. It makes integrity critical. It makes knowing what's consequential about the universe I live in - from day to day consequence out to consequences in areas that many people here declare 'woo' - critical.

I see this world is filled with suffering. It's about all people know how to do, mistakes multiply it, and I figure about all I can do for myself is figure out what mistakes I'm making and how to fix them. By extension when I fix my own mistakes I become one less problem for other people and there ends up being some remote chance that I might even be able to exert a positive influence, eventually, over and above just not being a negative one.

That's where I think a lot of people get this stuff confused. There have been members in the past, when I posted lists of books on the topic, who asked me 'What are these - self-help books or books people use to cast spells to get things?'. Both scenarios really omit the lion's share of what this stuff is about, especially if you go the mystery tradition route where it's somewhat (although not properly) the first and clearly the second is prosperity-doctrine fluff which tends to demonstrate a degree of immaturity and entitlement which is a trait that usually demonstrates that you should steer clear of esotericism, mysticism, etc. because if you're doing that right you'll encounter yourself in profound ways, not be ready, and ultimately get shattered as such.

There was an injunction inscribed at Delphi - Know thyself and you will know the universe and the gods.

That's really the idea. To really pursue this stuff isn't just to look for external mistakes and fix them but do a deep internal search for them and when calling on gods, goddesses, archangels, demons, etc. once is best served asking for their intersession where you come to the limits of your own know-how in terms of solving problems, finding your way through problems with integrity, and you feel like you need to be shown things or lead to situations that bring to the surface or help synthesize what you weren't able to do or take a behavioral/habitual prescription on just on your own thinking.

I think the real problem Christianity would have with this stuff is that it's individualized (ie. not yoked by authority structure) and like most little-g gnostic paths along with Hinduism and Buddhism it would be considered Pelegian in its underlying assumptions about human capacities. Through the ages that the Catholic church had martial authority that was enough for things to go pretty much exactly as it did, and it goes along the same lines that you don't cross state or government unless you know beyond the shadow of doubt that you have an unusually good reason for doing so.

I would respect occultists more if they were more like chaos magic practitioners.

Chaos magic actually has a complex philosophy behind it. It encourages self-discovery through psychedelic drug use. Also, most chaos magic practitioners know a great deal about psychology and the history of anarchism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_magic

Most occultists have a belief system that is overly simplistic. It's like they're just trying to make Harry Potter real. There's really no philosophical depth to it. Snore.

This is a little off topic but maybe not. My husband came home yesterday with exciting news that the OG Nightstalker was apprehended (Golden State Killer). I didn’t remember him until my husband mentioned the “micropenis” detail.

Last year, I threw away a couple boxes of serial killer and occult books and VHS tapes from the 1990s. Stuff we had to order from underground “gore-core” catalogs they were called back then, before the Internet. Life happened, I really saw some of that stuff, unfortunately, and now have a limited ability to tolerate it. But I still have a large amount of knowledge about it. More than I’m comfortable admitting.

I threw it away because I didn’t want my kid reading it or seeing it, ever.

So my husband and I were talking about it and how you kind of expect people who look a certain way (and are perhaps also of a certain age) to know about this stuff, but it’s disturbing when the wrong kind of person does. It gets your hackles up.

Years ago, a professor at my school was telling a group of 18-19 year old girls about “I spit on your grave”. By far, not the worst thing I’ve seen, but an example of something I don’t think normal people should watch. It’s traumatic. It makes you feel bad. Why would my normal looking professor be talking about it like it was Pulp Fiction? It was irresponsible to trick normal young girls into watching that.

Turned out that professor had been abusing girls for 20-30 years. He killed himself to escape charges and public shame. He looked normal as a trick but knew about stuff that a normal looking person should not be interested in. If you have weird interests, at least have the decency to look weird so people understand what you are.

This heavy stuff is just not for regular people to know. I discourage people from knowing about it whenever possible. If you keep looking despite fair warning, it’s on you to have the knowledge.

^^^
First of all, to be clear, I'm back for I've become A Topic of Conversation here again.

Specifically, on Topic, if we may discuss the actual topic here as brought up by the Op:

From Wiki:

"Chaos magic, also spelled chaos magick, is a contemporary magical practice which
emphasizes the pragmatic use of belief systems and the creation of new and
unorthodox methods.[1][2]"

Perhaps, I should Highlight Unorthodox but that shouldn't be necessary
for I Practice 'Unorthodoxy' Regularly; ironically, considering the Topic
at Hand here as Chaos; Religiously as a Routine to Bind Pragmatism
With Chaos to Create the Effect of Life I enjoy in using Belief as a
Tool By Flowing with so-called Chaos that other wise according
to 'Chaos Magic' may be named the Tao or God
for what goes beyond "Twitter Talk 101";
or in other Words, the 'smaller talk' of Life that
is Pre-Planned and not achieved through "Ecstatic Gnosis" in Flow
of releasing the Subconscious Mind to come to play as my Favorite Way of Free
Flowing Trance Dance reaching this "Samadhi" as what Buddhism Terms as an Eighth Noble Path for
Liberation of the Human "Soul"; and sure, i use Tantric 'Sensuality', and generate Extreme Emotions through
Free Verse Poetry Generating Emotions through Language with the Assistance of YouTube Music Videos too
but the Great thing about Dance is it requires no Cultural Clothes at all and can be done Fully Clothed too in
Public while other folks shuffle through stores consuming 'stuff' as a Religion of life of Material Goods; or
whatever it is folks 'think' they must do according to Cultural Rules, Spoon-Fed From Birth, like reaching
the entire side of the Page instead of Making Language a Work of Art and 'Religion' that Feels and
Senses in Binds and Bonds of Emotions and Sensuality more than just 'concrete' words alone.
Smiles; 'i'; yes, the small i or 'Bigger Self' of my iNtuition supPoses that Chaos or God
is Smiling down uPon me for JusT the kind of Magic that the Op here says
he respects in Occult as 'Chaos Magic' is 'precisely' what i described
in my own Unorthodox Way of Making Magic and Chaos Pragmatic
through Relative Free Will of Exercising Belief as a Tool to
Reach the desired effects in life; sure, like most everyone
smiling at me wherever i go for the Ecstatic
Gnostic Generating State of Mindful and
BodyFull Awareness i Create in
Public Dance Life everywhere i
Go in life that generates all
this Creativity in
Empirical Measure
of Production too. And sure;
2000 Plus Beautiful Young Women Smiling
with me in Selfie Autographs for the Joy of Life I bring
to them in Dance doesn't Hurt for what really counts in
Life as the Loving Human Connection of Free Spirits bound
by nothing more than the Loving Touch of Life. That's truly
A Miracle at Close to 58 years of age now; considering, before I started
using Belief Pragmatically in Unorthodox ways of Poetry and Dance, I was a shut-in
in my Home in my Bedroom for 66 Months with 19 Medical Disorders that the Professionals
could only explain as a Miracle as all those Disorders Melted Away with the Force of Love of What
most folks so-call Chaos or God or the Tao of what works with and as me now more for the
Big "I" of self as Ego Actor and A Symbol as Simple as an Exclamation Point! to represent
Chaos and or God or the Tao or whatever you wanna call 'what' Leads me on as LiGHT.
Sure; if you wanna Name God Chaos, Dark, or Tao or an Exclamation Point! of that yes
i am a Lord and
Master of and
as that is
real now
as the most
real 'thing'/
NoW Force
tHere is
JusT NoW
is as NoW Real.
The Empirical Measures
of what i've accomplished
in the last 56 Months Proves 'This Force' 'Works' for me.
And i suppose, considering that the Op brought a Phrase
that Describes what I've done for the Last 56 Months and more
as 'Chaos Magic' in a way that Op unwittingly works for me too; hehe.
Anyway, occasionally i come by here to see if anyone 'out of the box' can
teach me something 'new' and while obviously the Op doesn't understand
how 'Chaos Magic' really 'works' for if he did he might have 2000 Plus Beautiful
Women standing at his side, too; And he might be named as a Dance Legend by
the General Public too; never making a penny off his 'Dance Career' that might mean
that all that adhering to Social-Norms to get Financially Independent Might Help First
at age 47; like what I did a Decade ago to move to the Magic of Life as Art with God more;
once again, also known as the Tao and Chaos and Even the DArk too and Perhaps DArk Matter
too and the rest of all that is too; but reAlly what counts from the first to last bLink of life is what
Generates the Best Results in Effects/Affects of Life Joy and that's what i Master Best, Joy, for one can call
most anyone where I live in the Pensacola Metro Area of Florida and just ask about the Big Dude with Shades who
Dances
and they
will re-collect
now who used to be
A Shut-in in His Bedroom;
Hunchback of Notre Dame
or a Phantom of the Opera
but Hey; Joy lives as me NoW in LiGHT oF LoVE inCarNaTe
for the SMiLes i BRing to others with links to all of that Furnished
on request for Proof; for I don't leave 'home' without the Evidence FULLY iN ToW.
Okay, so now back to Heaven off this Wrong Planet until I am Summoned again As
A 'DaRK Lord' here.
Lucifred
Works
Fine for
me as Metaphorus
oN Course iN LiGHT BRinGinG too.
And to be clear I really don't come back
here unless specifically Summoned as Kraftie
Kortie said he missed my Humor some months
ago and I came back to play for you see when you
live life like me all of Life is a Play Ground oF Free;
Yes, 'Strictly' in unorthodox and ironically
Very
Pragmatic
Means of
Achieving
'A' Desired Result of
UltiMate Joy NoW aka Heaven; (Nirvana or Whatever)
NoW 'Pretty' Much aLL 'the' SMiLes say iT aLL NoW ReaL.
And for Metaphor too, if Aleister Crowley is SGT Pepper;
i am Captain Salt.
iN other words, i Have A FuLL LiViNG heART out of 'That' dARk.
(Moon Child or Whatever)
Like 'they' 'Say', 'Be Careful What you Wish For' now for we Become what We ArE NoW.

Thank you, Padre.

On the topic this guy seems pretty interesting. He was a Romanian national, per what I understand practicing magician, taught at University of Chicago, and was mentored by Mercia Eliade. He was murdered at the school in 1991 and it seems like it had to do with his involvement with and criticism of Romanian politics.

Ioan Petru Culianu:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ioan_Petru_Culianu

An enjoyable chat I'm listening to between Gordon and Jason. Good and informative listen so far as are most of Gordon's shows.

I just realized something.

How come occultists never educate people about evolution and prehistory? It seems like the only people who care about that sort of thing are atheists, liberal Christians and liberal Jews.

To be honest, I don't know any occultists or new agers who care about prehistory at all. They seem to completely disregard the topic.

To be honest, these fluffy-headed magical hippie types don't seem to care about science at all. They never mention science except to bash mainstream medicine. They claim that their beliefs are compatible with science, but they do very little to demonstrate this. How is astrology compatible with modern astrophysics at all?

Occultists are just hippies who are trying too hard to be edgy ... and hippies are stupid.

I'd argue that when your threads get interesting they become so despite your involvement, not on account of it.