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Shahunshah
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10 Nov 2018, 5:56 am

auntblabby wrote:
they never claimed to care about anybody's lives outside of their tribe.
I don't think that is true. But I feel sad nowadays. One of the most disgusting and disheartening things to see in politics is someone who formerly had a nuanced perspective be completely taken into an ideology through the propaganda of lies, smears and ridiculous claims.

I see that being the case with Rossane Bar. Back in 2012, she voted for Obama. Yet in 2016 she was taken into all of Right Wing conspiracy theories about pizza gate and ended up supporting him. And the worst part is that it made me come to the conclusion that had Mitt Romney been a little less honorable with the truth, he would have won. We Democrats should never underestimate the gullibility of voters, and when we are smeared we need to hit back strongly no matter the claim.

But I understand what you are saying. Sometimes when I talk to Right Wingers, I want to discuss things like Gerrymandering or Brian Kemp's voter suppression and not have them laugh when I suggest with evidence that they may have a racial element. But just have them acknowledge that they either don't know enough or accept the possibility that it may be a legitimate issue.



auntblabby
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10 Nov 2018, 6:25 am

Shahunshah wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
they never claimed to care about anybody's lives outside of their tribe.
I don't think that is true. But I feel sad nowadays. One of the most disgusting and disheartening things to see in politics is someone who formerly had a nuanced perspective be completely taken into an ideology through the propaganda of lies, smears and ridiculous claims. I see that being the case with Rosanne Barr. Back in 2012, she voted for Obama. Yet in 2016 she was taken into all of Right Wing conspiracy theories about pizza gate and ended up supporting him. And the worst part is that it made me come to the conclusion that had Mitt Romney been a little less honorable with the truth, he would have won. We Democrats should never underestimate the gullibility of voters, and when we are smeared we need to hit back strongly no matter the claim. But I understand what you are saying. Sometimes when I talk to Right Wingers, I want to discuss things like Gerrymandering or Brian Kemp's voter suppression and not have them laugh when I suggest with evidence that they may have a racial element. But just have them acknowledge that they either don't know enough or accept the possibility that it may be a legitimate issue.

the fact that they would poo-poo your evidence tells me either they are just being bloodyminded, or that they are ignoramuses, or that they are in on it. that is why I believe that they are atavistically tribal.



Shahunshah
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10 Nov 2018, 7:15 am

auntblabby wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
they never claimed to care about anybody's lives outside of their tribe.
I don't think that is true. But I feel sad nowadays. One of the most disgusting and disheartening things to see in politics is someone who formerly had a nuanced perspective be completely taken into an ideology through the propaganda of lies, smears and ridiculous claims. I see that being the case with Rosanne Barr. Back in 2012, she voted for Obama. Yet in 2016 she was taken into all of Right Wing conspiracy theories about pizza gate and ended up supporting him. And the worst part is that it made me come to the conclusion that had Mitt Romney been a little less honorable with the truth, he would have won. We Democrats should never underestimate the gullibility of voters, and when we are smeared we need to hit back strongly no matter the claim. But I understand what you are saying. Sometimes when I talk to Right Wingers, I want to discuss things like Gerrymandering or Brian Kemp's voter suppression and not have them laugh when I suggest with evidence that they may have a racial element. But just have them acknowledge that they either don't know enough or accept the possibility that it may be a legitimate issue.

the fact that they would poo-poo your evidence tells me either they are just being bloodyminded, or that they are ignoramuses, or that they are in on it. that is why I believe that they are atavistically tribal.
I do think there is a coherent philosophy behind many Republican and Democratic voters and that people vote on that principle. I just think that people need to realize that people will sometimes ignore following these principles to such an extent if it gives them power. Hence why so many evangelicals decided to back Trump. I think that when you strip away the partisanship from many people, I think you will find that voters are genuinely intelligent and logical people.

A significant amount of conservatives I do talk to, actually agree with me that gerrymandering and voter suppression is wrong, even on the right. A larger than expected number of Republicans (40%) even agreed that forced separations were wrong. It's just that sometimes, a propaganda message gets so deeply ingrained that nuanced messages get forgotten.



Shahunshah
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10 Nov 2018, 8:00 am

And I would like to say that with the midterms, I was struck by just how logical the average American voter could be. And to see them vote to expand Medicaid, denounce Gerrymandering, and allow ex-felons to vote in the reddest of states gave me confidence in these people. They really want to change their society for the better.



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10 Nov 2018, 5:51 pm

Trump wants to lower US drug prices by basing their cost on other countries' drug prices.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-pres ... m-updates/

Pelosi sees common ground with Trump to get it done
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/4 ... rug-prices

“I think we could find common ground on reducing the cost of prescription drugs, if the president is serious about his saying that he wants to do that,” Pelosi said during an interview on PBS NewsHour.


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Shahunshah
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10 Nov 2018, 6:30 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Trump wants to lower US drug prices by basing their cost on other countries' drug prices.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-pres ... m-updates/

Pelosi sees common ground with Trump to get it done
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/4 ... rug-prices

“I think we could find common ground on reducing the cost of prescription drugs, if the president is serious about his saying that he wants to do that,” Pelosi said during an interview on PBS NewsHour.

This would really help millions of people.



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10 Nov 2018, 9:50 pm

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auntblabby
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11 Nov 2018, 1:05 am

Shahunshah wrote:
And I would like to say that with the midterms, I was struck by just how logical the average American voter could be. And to see them vote to expand Medicaid, denounce Gerrymandering, and allow ex-felons to vote in the reddest of states gave me confidence in these people. They really want to change their society for the better.

then why would these same voters send to the senate a man trying his best to deny affordable health care to the working class people?



Shahunshah
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11 Nov 2018, 2:28 am

auntblabby wrote:
Shahunshah wrote:
And I would like to say that with the midterms, I was struck by just how logical the average American voter could be. And to see them vote to expand Medicaid, denounce Gerrymandering, and allow ex-felons to vote in the reddest of states gave me confidence in these people. They really want to change their society for the better.

then why would these same voters send to the senate a man trying his best to deny affordable health care to the working class people?

All the Republicans that were sent to the Senate did so on the platform of protecting preexisting conditions and didn't fanatically aim to repeal Obamacare care.

And actually, most Democratic Senators were re-elected including many in the Red States. A good example Joe Manchin in West Virginia, who despite Trump winning 67% of the vote there, cruised to reelection. He did so on a platform of protecting healthcare rights. And I think this commercial shows this strongly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7d_5vwqVNws



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11 Nov 2018, 4:59 am

being that our GOP has a century-long opposition to universal health care, I can't believe them when they say they care about pre-existing conditions, they are only paying "lip service" to the rest of us. they take us for suckers, and, by and large, we are.



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11 Nov 2018, 11:09 am

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Darmok
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15 Nov 2018, 9:55 pm

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15 Nov 2018, 11:26 pm

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16 Nov 2018, 8:18 am

:lol:


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18 Nov 2018, 10:00 pm

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19 Nov 2018, 1:37 am

Bill Nelson concedes Florida Senate race to Rick Scott

Andrew Gillum Concedes to Ron DeSantis in Florida Governor’s Race


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