Japan managed to win its war on drugs. Why can't we?

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Crimadella
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15 Mar 2019, 9:45 am

Antrax wrote:
magz wrote:
There is a racial issue with alcohol - East Asians typically produce way less alcohol dehydrogenase than Europeans, resulting in less capacity for alcohol consumption. They get drunk easier and they have worse hangovers.
But I know of nothing similar about marijuana.

I was in Netherlands where it has been legal for quite a while, and I didn't come into any situation similar to description.
I also thougth - would it be any different if those guys weren't smoking weed but drinking booze instead?

No, in my opinion the problem is not about the substance.


The difference between smoking and drinking in my opinion is that if another individual is drinking and I walk past them it does not make me ingest alcohol. If another person is smoking and I walk past them I am forced to inhale their substance (I try to hold my breath if I see them coming, but this is only partially effective).


You will not inhale enough to get a buzz or for it to show up in your system, do you hold your breath when a car passes you or avoid high traffic areas? Car emissions are much more dangerous than passing someone smoking a joint.



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15 Mar 2019, 11:07 am

Crimadella wrote:
I change my position after watching this amazing evidence that has surfaced....

Then again, to catch a doper you must first, become a smoker, lol.


That was a good movie. The 2005 remake, on the other hand...


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16 Mar 2019, 10:18 pm

KomoDomo wrote:
As for Japan's stance on the matter of its prohibition, as much as it might seem essential to their functionality that invites us to admire their culture, it's worth noting how there are a couple of things they are far more lax about which our conservatives would surely find far more incompatible with their ideal of an orderly society than the use of any drugs. An example would be the sexualized depictions of minors found in many mangas that are readily accessible, and only in recent years did it become an offense to be in possession of any material showing real kids like that. This along with the phenomena of hikikomori, burakumin, and a high suicide rate might be enough for us to think twice before going full weeb and deciding to imitate their society just because of some anime we like.


You mean we'd be nuts to think we could imitate where they've avoided our vices without new vices appearing, just like they have their own vices which we largely have avoided?

They might think child pornography and suicide are perfectly normal, but at least they don't smoke the devil's cabbage. #weeblogic :lol:


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18 Mar 2019, 1:49 pm

If marijuana becomes legal nationwide, can public nudity be the next thing we legalize?


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auntblabby
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18 Mar 2019, 11:08 pm

let's hope so.



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25 Mar 2019, 1:25 pm

Why are we wasting effort and money and human resources on a war on drugs anyways? It doesn't appear to have benefits that outweigh the costs. It's inherently misguided, like talking about a war against your own feet; what victory condition would actually be beneficial? :?


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06 May 2019, 8:46 am

@techstep and his 6-plant hippies

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kriskrane/ ... join-next/
http://archive.is/eFtNJ

Cannabis Attracts Big Tobacco, Alcohol, and Pharma. Which Big Industries Will Join Next?

The big news in cannabis over the past couple of weeks has been the announcement that Altria, the world’s largest tobacco company and owner of Philip Morris and Marlboro cigarettes, made a $1.8 billion investment in Canadian cannabis producer Cronos for 45% of the company. The deal comes with warrants for Altria to provide an additional $1.05 billion for a 55% stake in Cronos.
Then, just yesterday, Tilray announced an expanded strategic partnership with Novartis, the pharmaceutical giant, to work on medical cannabis products in legal markets.
These developments of course come on the heels of the other major news from earlier this year, when alcohol giant Constellation Brands bought a 38% stake in the largest Canadian cannabis company, Canopy Growth, for $4 billion. This deal, which was preceded by a smaller investment in October 2017 by Constellation into Canopy, similarly came with warrants that will allow Constellation, the maker of Corona beer and Svedka vodka, to buy a majority interest in Canopy.
The ramifications of this are clear and stark. By the end of 2019, there is a realistic chance that two of the largest cannabis companies in the world will be owned by two of the largest alcohol and tobacco companies in the world. The era of big business entering cannabis officially began in 2018 .
The year also saw other major companies dip a toe in the cannabis market. Molson (a subsidiary of Coors) announced a partnership with Hydropothecary to create a line of non-alcoholic cannabis infused beer. Coca-Cola is rumored to be exploring a partnership with Aurora that would allow them to make CBD-infused beverages, something that may be closer to a reality with CBD-hemp production and extraction becoming legal as part of the recently passed Farm Bill.
We also saw a major increase in merger-and-acquisition activity among American cannabis operators in the past year, which may also portend the entry of major industry players in cannabis as multi-state operators position themselves as attractive acquisition targets for big moneyed players from outside the industry. Just this year we saw the announced mergers of industry heavyweights MedMen and Pharmacann, iAnthus and MPX, and my own company 4Front with Cannex. This happened during a flurry of smaller and mom-and-pop operators being acquired by the larger multi-state companies.
Looking towards the future, this consolidation makes sense. On an operational level, companies are able to build economies of scale with more licenses in more states, and are largely rewarded by investors and the public markets for doing so. But these companies are also well positioned to be acquired by much larger companies from other sectors once federal cannabis prohibition ends and these companies feel comfortable entering the multi-billion dollar American cannabis market. When companies with billions of dollars to spend on acquisitions decide they want in on the U.S. cannabis market, some of them may not want to do the grinding hard work of rolling up dozens of smaller operators across multiple states. Instead, many will likely look for larger companies with developed brands, capabilities and existing distribution networks.
So who are these companies waiting in the wings to jump into the American cannabis market? We’ve already seen alcohol and tobacco get involved in Canada, and there’s no doubt they’re keeping similar tabs on the United States. Altria may have been the first tobacco company to buy a stake in a cannabis license, but you can be certain its competitors will ensure that they are not the last. Similarly, Constellation and Molson will certainly be joined by other alcohol manufacturers in partnering with and acquiring American cannabis businesses once there is an adequate change in federal law. Some will be large deals like Constellation’s with Canopy, while others may see craft brewers and micro-distillers teaming up with craft cannabis producers to create a truly high-end user experience for fans of both products.
But alcohol and tobacco are hardly the only industries set to expand into the growing cannabis economy. Other industries like pharma, agriculture, and non-alcoholic beverages can all benefit from an end to cannabis prohibition.

Big Pharma
The pharma industry is the most profitable industry in the United States today, and its members no doubt have interest in the healing properties contained in cannabis, as evidence by Novartis’ recent partnership with Tilray.
Cannabis has been part of the U.S. pharmacopeia dating back to the founding of the country, and only became shunned by the medical community after cannabis became outlawed federally in 1937 over the objections of the American Medical Association. But since 1996, Americans have been able to treat conditions from glaucoma to multiple sclerosis to insomnia with cannabis.
While pharma companies can’t patent whole smoked cannabis as pharmaceutical drugs, they can and will create drugs based on the cannabinoids and terpenes found in this healing plant. GW Pharmaceuticals, a British-based company focused on the development of cannabinoid based medications had a breakthrough this year when the FDA approved Epidiolex, a CBD-based drug derived from the cannabis plant, as a prescription medication in the United States. The company’s first product, Sativex, has already been available in pharmacies across Europe and Canada for nearly a decade.
No doubt major pharma companies like Pfizer and Bayer are watching the cannabis industry closely and exploring the possibility of following GW’s lead in developing a new generation of life-altering, cannabinoid-based medications.

Agriculture
Of course, cannabis is an agricultural crop, which means it must have the attention of large-scale commercial agriculture companies. When federal prohibition ends, and once interstate commerce and cross-border imports have fully opened up, most cannabis cultivation will likely move to massive scale fields with large drops in wholesale pricing. Most experts agree that cannabis production will commoditize, and as this happens agriculture giants will be best positioned to bring their efficiencies at scale to this industry, as well as their technology for optimizing genetics, propagation, and other techniques not currently available in the cannabis industry. We’ve already seen Scotts Miracle-Gro embrace the cannabis industry. It seems to be only a matter of time before companies like Monsanto enter the fray.

Food & Beverage Companies
We’ve seen a recent trend towards cannabis-infused drinks and compound formulations for infusion into other products. Coca Cola looking at CBD-infused beverages is likely only the beginning. It would seem a natural fit for companies like Coca Cola or Pepsi to eventually partner with companies like Dixie Elixers or Keef Cola to create entire skews of cannabis-infused beverages. Similarly, chocolate makers like Hershey and Nestle must be intrigued by the success of Kiva Chocolates, Incredibles, and other successful cannabis confectioners.

Technology & Ancillary Service Providers
On the technology side, companies like MJ Freeway, Biotrack and Greenbits would make great acquisition targets for large-scale, point-of-sale companies from other industries. Delivery companies like Eaze and Meadow would make natural partners or acquisition targets for Uber Eats or DoorDash. Companies that aggregate cannabis industry data like BDS Analytics and New Frontier would make great partners for major business data aggregators like Bloomberg and Neilson.
While 2018 marked the first stage of some pioneering companies in traditional industries entering the cannabis market, the coming years will involve more partnerships, mergers, and acquisitions between cannabis operators and major companies from other industries. Of course, federal cannabis prohibition remains a major impediment to traditional companies’ full-scale embrace of cannabis in the United States, but when prohibition does end, there is going to be a large influx of traditional companies getting into cannabis. This article only scratches the surface; the market will surely come with plenty of surprises.


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auntblabby
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07 May 2019, 2:45 am

i wish the green tabacky worked for me. but i don't seem to have the genes.



RetroGamer87
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07 May 2019, 4:05 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Why are we wasting effort and money and human resources on a war on drugs anyways? It doesn't appear to have benefits that outweigh the costs. It's inherently misguided, like talking about a war against your own feet; what victory condition would actually be beneficial? :?

If the costs outweigh the benefits, we should think of a way to get the same benefits at lower costs. Imaging you've just become the manager of an ailing business. The best way to get back in the black would be to lower your expenses.


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auntblabby
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07 May 2019, 4:25 am

if only we amuuuricans would just get wise and forget about policing citizens' drug use and instead spend the money we waste in the futility of being the morality police and instead concentrate on education and therapy.



funeralxempire
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07 May 2019, 12:25 pm

RetroGamer87 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Why are we wasting effort and money and human resources on a war on drugs anyways? It doesn't appear to have benefits that outweigh the costs. It's inherently misguided, like talking about a war against your own feet; what victory condition would actually be beneficial? :?

If the costs outweigh the benefits, we should think of a way to get the same benefits at lower costs. Imaging you've just become the manager of an ailing business. The best way to get back in the black would be to lower your expenses.


I'd favour 'lowering our expenses' in this regard by adopting a similar approach to Czechia.


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techstepgenr8tion
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10 May 2019, 8:41 pm

An interesting interview about Australia's NSW system, and I think a lot of what's said toward the end here pretty much applies anywhere that the economics are like this.


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11 May 2019, 12:48 am

Seems as though some people in this thread took the movie Reefer Madness seriously.... :roll:

Also Denver just decriminalized shrooms.... :twisted:

and I am going to smoke smoke some marijuana right now.


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11 May 2019, 1:00 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
Seems as though some people in this thread took the movie Reefer Madness seriously.... :roll:

Also Denver just decriminalized shrooms.... :twisted:

and I am going to smoke smoke some marijuana right now.


Likewise! :lol:


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11 May 2019, 1:32 am

smoke smoke smoke that mary-j-
puff puff puff on it
you'll smoke yourself to death!
tell st. peter at the golden gates,
that you hates to make him wait
but you just gotta have another mary-j