Duel/Disloyalty claims - Jews getting it from both sides

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Charges of duel and disloyalty of been a common anti-Semitic trope. It was the key argument in The Protocols of the Elders of Zion. A variation of it is Jew controlled media or the Rothschild's are running the world. The most infamous variation of it was the charge by Hitler that Jews stabbed Germany in the back causing them to lose WWI. The more recent “Great Replacement theory” believed by recent mass shooters posits that blacks are replacing whites and since blacks are too dumb to know how to do it is the insidious Jews controlling the whole thing.

America has a long history of questioning the loyalty of its citizens. The interment of Japanese-Americans during WWII is a prime example, during the McCarthy era being an entertainment figure often got you blacklisted for suspected loyalty to world communism, anti-Vietnam war protesters were often thought of as traitors. Trump seems to think everybody who does not agree with him is disloyal.

Enter 2019. Rep Ilhan Omar tweeted “It’s all about the Benjamins Baby” which many though was an implicit way of saying Jews control American politics via bribery. When it was revealed that in 2012 Omar had said Israel memorizes the world implying the world domination trope their own party was tied up in knots figuring out how to react and some elements of the party provided open support. When Senators Marc Rubio and Jim Risch sponsored anti boycott, divestment, and sanctions bill Congresswomen Rashida Tlaib noted the Senators ”forgot what country they came from”.

Over the next several months the two Congresswomen alleged anti-Semitism and the alleged enabling of it became a conservative talking point and then a Trump talking point.

The two congresswomen decided they wanted to visit Israeli occupied territories. Israel after prodding from Trump denied them entry a decision that was criticized even by pro Netanyahu neo-cons. The National Review columnist David French discovered that their trip was sponsored by Miftah. The organization has published a number of anti-Semitic articles. It published an article claiming that “the Jews [of using] the blood of Christians in the Jewish Passover." which they later apologized for. It also re published an article by an American white supremacist organization the National Alliance entitled “Who Rules America: The Alien Grip on Our News and Entertainment Media Must Be Broken”. The aliens of course are the Jews.

Then Trump opened his phone and wrote that any Jew who votes for the Democrats are "either a total lack of knowledge or great disloyalty".

I must note here I am not a mind reader. I don’t know if the congresswomen or Trump are anti-Semites. Explanations that the congresswomen are talking specifically about Israel and not Jews is plausible as is the explanation that Trump was not talking about Jews as a whole but Jewish Democrats.

With the congresswomen they have stepped in so much s**t I find it difficult to believe they are not anti-Semites. But at least the congresswomen anti-semitism if that what it is IMPLICIT. Trump’s disloyalty claim is EXPLICIT. Trump’s assumption that Jews must be loyal to Israel and the Israeli government is exactly what anti-Semites commonly say. Supporting Israel and unquestioned loyalty that Trump expects are two different things.

The silence from conservatives that have been screaming over the past few months that the Democrats/Progressives are anti-Semites or their enablers is deafening. They are also the anti-semitism enablers now.

Let's be real here. The situation for Jews in America is far better than it has been for Jews in any diaspora country ever. The chance of facing job discrimination is minute, Jewish holidays are widely acknowledged and accepted. Driving while Jew is not likely to become a thing, Jews are not likely to be interned never mind exterminated by the American government. That said the situation is not as good as it recently was. A few years ago one did not have to think about getting murdered in a synagogue while the chances are minute it is something to think about now and now anti-Semitic canards have entered the political mainstream. While the extreme is unlikely one can not know how bad this can get.

I think this slightly misses the mark. Trump was talking about Jewish Democrats, but that doesn't make his remarks any less anti-Semitic.

The argument could be made that while these comments are anti-Semitic, the individual making them is not. Given the individuals in question, I think that is stretching credibility somewhat - but I am aware that you are probably being deliberately generous.

But yes, it is a real concern. We have a big problem with anti-Semitism on the left in the UK. The difference is that our version of "the squad" is in control of the Labour Party. Imagine, if you will, if Tlaib became the leader of the Democrats in Congress, then Omar said she'd been wrong to apologise for remarks that were seen as anti-Semitic, and then Tlaib suspended Omar, let her back in after a few months, then suspended her again.

Our establishment right is considerably more politically savvy than Trump or our left, but I don't doubt for a second that the Tommy Robinson supporters of the world are every bit as anti-Semitic as the Chris Williamson supporters of the world and probably at least as open about it, just with less coverage because we expect them to be like that. When Ed Miliband was leader of the Labour Party, the right-wing press mocked him for looking uncomfortable eating a bacon sandwich - another anti-Semitic trope. This is an issue that cuts across society and it is as a society that we must tackle it.

I pass for Jewish.

In this paragraph I am talking about why the people in question may not be personally antisemitic and found that Trump's targeting of specifically Jewish Democrats is a plausible explanation for why he might not be personally antisemitic. While I did not specifically say it (bad Autistic) further down I said that what Trump said was worse because it was explicit.



I agree that the situation for Jews in the UK and Europe in general is much worse for Jews than for Jews in America.

Omar and Tlaib are not antisemitic. They have genuine criticisms of the right-wing Israeli government, particularly its inhumane treatment of the Palestinians, and its lobbying organizations in the US. Their criticisms fit within a context of a general criticism of money in politics as part of both of them being Justice Democrats. The Justice Democrats, who I support, are fighting to get money out of politics in general, to go up against the influence of wealthy donors and big corporations on our government at the expense of the people, which has arguably made our country an oligarchy in practice:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng- ... ney-series

Criticizing lobbyists for the right-wing Israeli government is but one part of that effort. Anyone who does not mention this context either doesn't understand or is misrepresenting Omar's and Tlaib's views on the matter.

Antisemitism and playing on Jewish bugbears are never OK, but you must be able to discuss the human rights violations committed by the Israeli government and any attempts by that government and its allies to prevent the Palestinians from being able to peaceably seek relief:

https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2019/c ... /palestine

And ASPartOfMe, about that 2012 tweet, I have this from Wiki:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilhan_Oma ... n_conflict

Looking at the overall context of what they say and her background, I believe Omar's apology.

And yeah, Trump thinks a lot of American Jews are "disloyal" because they have sympathy for the Palestinians. Newsflash, Trump. Jews are not a monolith:

https://www.jstor.org/stable/10.2979/is ... b_contents

Like I said I am no mind reader but the two representatives have on more than one occasion for whatever context used the canards that are the subject of this thread and agreed to be sponsored by an organization that published those things and honored people that engaged in operations that resulted in children s deaths. Maybe they had no clue about their sponsors, but they are now elected officials that is part of their job. At some point credulity has to be lost.

With Trump, I don't think he thinks Jewish Democrats are disloyal because they are sympathetic to the Palestinians, but because they are disloyal to him.

You mean this group?



And then this important thing at the end gets at what I'm talking about, too:


https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video ... ights.html

Miftah has sponsored Congressional trips in the past, according to this feed from Politico:


https://www.politico.com/newsletters/pl ... hem-470084

So how notable is Omar and Tlaib getting a trip to Palestine from Miftah?

It was a problem but nobody appearently noticed

The problem seems overblown to me, and as stated by Peter Beinart, a contributor to the The Atlantic (quoted above), it's being used to distract from the violations of basic human rights for Palestinians.

I noted in my OP that the congresswomen's tropes were talking points for both Trump and conservatives and how silent they were when Trump said worse.

Trump said worse, they are being taken out of context, other congresspeople were sponsored the same organization etc is distracting from what they said. I can play this game too. All this slavery talk and focusing on regrettable racist things people have said is distracting from states rights(sarcasm).

They are creating distractions from their own cause and their opponents are glad to help them.

In his remarks Trump sounded like he was being an ass-bleep. But it turns out that he was not being an ass-bleep, but that he was being an idiot....except that he was also being a different kind of ass-bleep too.

He said that Jews who vote Democrat are "disloyal" (without elaborating). That made it sound like he was repeating the age old antisemetic trope about jews being disloyal to the nation state in which they reside- because it sounded like he was talking about Jews being more loyal to Israel than to America. But what he actually meant was that that Jews who vote Democrat are being disloyal to Israel (and/or to their own Judaism, or something like that).

Trump was too ignorant to realize that combining the words "Jew" with "disloyal" in the same sentence is an historic trigger. He shouldn't have said it, or if he HAD to say it he should have gone all of the way and at least completed his thought in words- and specified what kind of "disloyality" he was talking about.

But ...now that we know what he actually meant...we now know that he is wrapping himself in the flag of Israel, and is implying that any American Jew who votes against him is voting against Judaism itself. And that combined with his later tweets about he himself being Israel's savior, makes it look like he is gone off his rocker. But putting aside the issue of Trump's possible delusions of messiahhood aside: saying to Jews that "a vote against me is a vote against Judaism" is just as asinine as saying to Gentile voters that "a vote against me is a vote against Christ".

Well, I've just been browsing Omar's and Tlaib's Twitter feeds, and I'm seeing a lot of stuff condemning Trump for his "disloyal" comment in reference to Jews, a call for Jews and Muslims to meet up, and even a condemnation of the Palestinian Authority for attacks on LGBTQ Palestinians.

If you want, I can link to them when I get home today, but I trust you can find them yourself.

EDIT: About the tropes:



https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilhan_Omar

Did Trump ever apologize for his use of anti-Semitic tropes?

Did Trump ever apologize for anything at anytime? Rhetorical question.

How many of his supporters or republicans conservatives are condemning him? Not many. There is Lee Zeldin a republican Jewish congressmen that is all I could find for now. My intention in creating the OP was to call out the hypocrisy in calling out the congresswomen and not Trump. In doing so I am not obligated to shut up for the greater good and ignore tropes from the left because they are not as bad or were unintentional or they were meant to say something good.

Oh, so that was the purpose of your OP. Got it.