To the religious: has your faith interacted with your ASD?

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31 Jan 2020, 8:10 pm

I'm curious about how spirituality interacts with ASD. I've talked about my religion before with regards to ASD, I'm curious as to others' (or more varied traditions') perspectives.

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Greatshield17
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31 Jan 2020, 8:43 pm

Whale_Tuune wrote:

I'm curious about how spirituality interacts with ASD. I've talked about my religion before with regards to ASD, I'm curious as to others' (or more varied traditions') perspectives.

Mostly social anxiety, I have a hard time socializing at my local parish, (which is hard enough as it is, considering it's not the most reverent of Catholic parishes out there.) I do better online, especially on one online forum in particular, (I also had experience on an online forum that was the exact opposite of the one just mentioned.) though I am still very self-conscience on said forums and am scared of looking awkward. In regards to other practices like praying and meditating, apart from overthinking things and sins of the intellect, I haven't really notice any interaction between my Aspergers and practicing my Faith. Though, that's mostly because I don't keep an eye open for it, because I'm focusing more on just doing it and saving my soul and the souls of others.

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salad
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31 Jan 2020, 8:56 pm

Whale_Tuune wrote:

I'm curious about how spirituality interacts with ASD. I've talked about my religion before with regards to ASD, I'm curious as to others' (or more varied traditions') perspectives.

My ASD made me both appreciate and resonate with Islam even while not being 100% religious right now and not being 100% muslim (it's a long and complicated story that I dont feel like getting into). Islam is a very puritanical religion in that there are many prohibitions and injunctions on avoiding all manners of immorality such as fornication (sex before marriage), dating, drinking, gambling, smoking, looking lustfully at the opposite gender, etc. As an Aspie I get very anxious about things that bother me and just about most above the above immoralities sicken me to the point that I feel like Islam's boundaries and parameters act as a shield and barrier that keeps me safe from all manner of intrusive moral pathogens I would rather have nothing to do with. Also Islam has many purifying rituals, words and mantras to recite, as well as all manner of ceremonies that create order and structure that my Aspie brain finds comfort in. It also doesn't hurt that Islam has literal ablution rituals and purifying rituals that allay my distress and inner turmoil, such as an elaborate body washing and shower ritual that makes me feel clean and pure.

Granted there are things about Islam my Aspie brain doesn't resonate with but has dissonance with. Islam is against music and instruments when I love certain relaxing songs and instrumental OSTs that relax me and help me calm down (which im listening to right now as I type this). also islam allows concubinage (owning sex slaves) which I find disgusting and impure. as I said above my relationship with islam is complicated, but for the most part I find many parts of the religion to resonate with myself because of my Aspergers, with other parts I completely eschew or find uncomfortable because of my Aspergers. again, its complicated

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31 Jan 2020, 9:06 pm

Quaker practice works well for me. Meetings are silent except for occasional spirit-led messages. There are no priests or ministers to stand between me and Spirit. Quakers listen to Spirit/God/whatever rather than talk to or worship. Quakers in general are accepting of all. Quakers focus more on what God/Spirit/whatever wants us to do in this life, rather than the afterlife. Quakers emphasize Revelation rather than salvation. This all fits pretty well for me.

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salad
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31 Jan 2020, 9:11 pm

blazingstar wrote:

I know the Quakers gave birth to the anti racism, abolitionist and humanitarian Americans that made America a more compassionate and moral society, so my utmost respect to them. The fact that in the 1600s the Quakers spearheaded the crusade against slavery and racism at a time in history when such an idea was radical for a white supremacist society makes Quakers among the few Christian sects I have nothing but respect for. Some christian sects are built on sanctimony and neglect the oppression of others, while the Quakers walked the walk and actually embodied the message of love and kindness Jesus lived by. Respect

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31 Jan 2020, 9:17 pm

^ We aren't saints. Quakers did own slaves. They treated slaves well, but it took quite a while before Meetings decided it was wrong. Once they made that decision, they were active with abolitionists and the Underground Railway. But we are also compulsively honest which is why I had to clarify.

We are all humans and sometimes it takes time for humans to sort things out.

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salad
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31 Jan 2020, 9:22 pm

blazingstar wrote:

I respect your honesty. this is the 1st time I've ever heard someone from a religious denomination clarify praise they were given out of complete devotion to the truth, even if part of the truth is in their favor and the clarification made them seem fallible in a way that wasnt even known. even more respect now

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31 Jan 2020, 9:33 pm

^ an inability to lie is also an aspie trait. I'm not sure I can take credit for something that is part of my neurological wiring.

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Greatshield17
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31 Jan 2020, 9:57 pm

salad wrote:

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention scrupulosity, I struggled with that and Aspergers probably played a role in it. I actually had a bit of scrupulosity back when I was a Deist, prior to my reversion. I discovered I was enslaved to certain sinful behaviour and felt guilty over it, so one of the things I did was wash my hands excessively, which I still do today. :lol:

(albeit, not so much out of guilt now, just simply as an obsession with keeping clean, and not wanting to get grease or what have you on my books and other stuff.) After reverting to the Catholic Faith, I had a tendency to take certain moral teaching with extreme precision and got confused, worried, and frustrated, when lines between mortal and venial sin didn't appear as clear to me as they did for other people.

Fortunately, I have a huge devotion to Our Lady, and Marian devotion helps a lot in overcoming scrupulosity. Other devotions and practices like Divine Mercy and St. Therese's Little Way have also helped; and one thing that helped a lot which I learned early on, was St. Alphonsus' advice for scrupulous people. He taught that when a scrupulous person is unsure whether one is in venial or mortal sin, he/she should assume that he or she is not in a state of mortal sin and receive Holy Communion, trusting in God's Mercy.

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31 Jan 2020, 10:39 pm

Most religions contradict each other and a few versatile ones contradict themselves. However, if there is a contradiction, then: a) it is not from God, or b) God can lie.
If God can lie, then (a) he is not all good. Therefore he would not be God.

We exist to fulfill our purpose.
Our purpose is to know, love, and serve God.
Therefore we exist to know, love, and serve God.

Getting serious now, isn't it!

We know, love & serve God through following his commandments.
His commandments call for the practice of religion.
Therefore we k. l. & s. through the practice of religion.

There are many religions in the world.
If they contradict then they are different religions.
Therefore the religions of the world are different.

Different religions have conflicting doctrines.
Contradictions are either( both wrong ) or ( only one is right)
Therefore different religions are either all false, or there is only one true one.

Truth cannot contradict itself.
The true religion is true.
Therefore true religion cannot contradict itself.

True religion does not contradict itself.
The noncontradictory religion is Catholicism.
Therefore Catholicism is the true religion.

Catholicism is full of horrid people.
Horrid people do not a religion make.
Therefore horrid people are not part of Catholicism.

(It makes sense in the context of study but there is a ton of information on Catholicism out there. If you want something good, read Peter Kreeft's Apologetics. Do not ask me as I am not a perfect Catholic by any stretch of the imagination. I am practicing. That doesn't mean I am good at it yet.)

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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 134 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 72 of 200
You are very likely neurodiverse (Aspie)

Greatshield17
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31 Jan 2020, 11:41 pm

blazingstar wrote:

I’ve beer meaning to asking you, in your practice, is your spirituality oriented towards God, Spirit, whatever, or a fourth object of adoration?

techstepgenr8tion
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31 Jan 2020, 11:49 pm

My most intense relationship is probably with my inner self.

I think Mansur Al Hallaj nailed it:

I saw my Lord with the eye of my heart
I said: who are you? He said: You
“Where” with you has nowhere
And there is nowhere where you are
Illusion with you has no illusion

Can illusion know where you are?
You are the one who gathers every “where”
To nowhere, so where are you?
In my annihilation my annihilation perished

And in my annihilation I found you
In the effacement of my name and the outline of my form
I asked about me so I said: You.
My inmost secret pointed to you

Until I was annihilated to myself, and you remained
You are my life and my heart’s secret
Wherever I may be, you are.
You encompass everything with knowledge
All that I see is you

So grant forgiveness my God
For there is nothing I wish for other than you

A song that hits me *very* hard in this direction:

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01 Feb 2020, 12:15 am

More or less.

On the fundamentalist level; I'm the 'question and doubt everything' type than the 'follow the rules' type of autistic. I wasn't the anxious type nor the lonely type either, so I have a lot of guts to rebel and deviate from any practice.
So it won't be easy for me to get conditioned to 'believe' in religion, even if I wasn't that much of a logical/rational/empirical type of person. And only can go as far as respecting another one's culture, no different towards other familiar yet never felt at home parts of the NT culture.
As far as this is concerned, I'm, at best, more like intellectually being open about the idea that most people's idea of what gods are exists.
Otherwise, I don't to rituals, I don't read scriptures. I take things literally, words and contexts distracts me, several things don't make sense. I can only imagine whatever possible contexts exists within anything to do with religion and beliefs.

I don't like the idea of surrender, I don't like the idea of forgiveness, I'm more of a sinner than a saint, etc. ASD had nothing to do with it.

On the mysticism level --
It made several 'ridiculous' things 'sense', from religion to varying forms of beliefs.
To me, whatever that experience means, it means the world became so much smaller and bigger st the same time.
To which varying logical contradictions and paradoxes makes sense.
The scriptures made sense, the rituals made sense, the virtues made sense. And as to why I can't always get it because my mind is very loud and my ego is very strong.
It was then I understood what forgiveness IS, what gratitude IS, and what love IS -- therefore had a glimpse of what truth IS, what life IS, and what God IS.

ASD or not, it's a very personal experience. It took me experiences before 'believing'. I've had a very tightly closed-off heart for most of my early life, which may or may not lead me incline to the paradigms of service to self.
I still do, until I completely decided to just drop the crap, as it is and always be an open option to me.

Actually, I don't 'believe' in spirituality as much as I don't 'believe' in science per se -- as much as I don't have to 'believe' that the sky is blue or that the brain literally exists in people's skulls. I don't 'believe' in karma as much as I don't 'believe' in the simple logics of cause and effect.

This is my current conclusion.

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01 Feb 2020, 9:54 pm

Greatshield17 wrote:

blazingstar wrote:

I’ve beer meaning to asking you, in your practice, is your spirituality oriented towards God, Spirit, whatever, or a fourth object of adoration?

It doesn't matter. After years of working with terminally ill people, what came over them, be it God, Spirit, Allah, Higher Power, Fred...was the same. I knew I was in the presence of something. And it doesn't matter what you call it.

I take that back, to most people, what they call it is important. I have learned that essence, connection, presence...it defies human understanding and naming. In general, I try to use the terminology most comfortable to whomever is listening.

That is why I use God/spirit/whatever in my posts, so that the conversation doesn't get bogged down in nomenclature.

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Last edited by blazingstar on 01 Feb 2020, 9:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

IsabellaLinton
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01 Feb 2020, 9:55 pm

blazingstar wrote:

Greatshield17 wrote:

blazingstar wrote:

I’ve beer meaning to asking you, in your practice, is your spirituality oriented towards God, Spirit, whatever, or a fourth object of adoration?

It doesn't matter. After years of working with terminally ill people, what came over them, be it God, Spirit, Allah, Higher Power, Fred...was the same. I knew I was in the presence of something. And it doesn't matter what you call it.

I take that back, to most people, what they call it is important. I have learned that essence, connection, presence...it defies human understanding and naming. In general, I try to use the terminology most comfortable to whoever is listening.

That is why I use God/spirit/whatever in my posts, so that the conversation doesn't get bogged down in nomenclature.

What a beautiful answer, blaze. :heart:

Thank you for sharing.

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Greatshield17
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01 Feb 2020, 10:03 pm

blazingstar wrote:

Greatshield17 wrote:

blazingstar wrote:

I’ve beer meaning to asking you, in your practice, is your spirituality oriented towards God, Spirit, whatever, or a fourth object of adoration?

I see, don’t take this as an accusatory tone, (I’m engaging in a Socratic dialogue here, not a debate) may I ask that you’re saying that this Presence is in some way beyond relational identity?

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