White privilege isn't real - Jordan Peterson

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I think Jungian psychology embraces diversity whereas JP overlays/injects his conservative values into his ideas and theories.

I am surprised he doesn't point to discrepancy between the success of Asian Americans, African immigrants and white privilege theory. Certainly the right has been pointing to disgruntled "tiger moms" who's kids have missed out on college admissions as evidence of too much concessions given to non-white non-asian minorities.

Not sure if any JP fans would like to point out if he ever addressed this issue?

Arts and Philosopher? How one can become a research scientist with that?

I would rather expect sociologists and economists to do research on a such thing.

TERFs?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TERF

https://www.snhu.edu/about-us/newsroom/ ... -a-science

That's the one.

I assume Fnord is talking about Peggy McIntosh, and your question is a good one, Boo. She doesn’t sound like any sort of “scientist” to me.





Peggy McIntosh, with her two degrees in English, is not even a "social scientist", let a alone a “scientist” in the way most people understand. Even actual social scientists are not really scientists in the way physicists and chemists are, since social scientists cannot help but be influenced by and want to influence the object that they are studying (ie, society). When Peggy McIntosh codified the term apparently criticizing her own race, she would have been influenced by theories from other social scientists (including non-white ones), and by the way the wind was blowing in the wider society (all the while trying to further her career).

As for your appeals to authority (which I believe Cornflake has alluded to), I would say by way of example – well, Leo Kanner coined the term “autism” and he blamed the condition on lack of maternal warmth. Presumably you would allow us to disagree with his theory of autism even though he was the one who coined the term.

And personally I don’t really care if the person who coined the term “white privilege” was white. There are plenty of people who critique their own groups in a way that I suspect a lot of people in here would not agree with, eg.

“There is no female Mozart because there is no female Jack the Ripper.” Camille Paglia, who is a woman.

“Black folks don’t know how to run no nation”, Pastor James Manning, who is black.

"American Jewry makes any debate on whether the 'Protocols of the Elders of Zion' are an authentic document or a forgery irrelevant. American Jews do control the world.", Gilad Atzmon, who is Jewish

As I already pointed out Peggy McIntosh did not "codify" the term "white privilege," she only popularized it. The term was widely used in various civil rights movement circles for at least a decade before then. I remember encountering it in various feminist and lesbian/gay rights periodicals in around 1980.

Take it up with Fnord, then. He is clearly talking about Peggy McIntosh: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peggy_McIntosh

The Wikipedia article is incorrect. Unfortunately I don't have time right now to go to a library and dig up old civil rights periodicals to find earlier instances of the term "white privilege," but I have very clear memories of running into that term in around 1980.

EDIT: I just now found White Privilege: A History of the Concept by Jacob Bennett, documenting various earlier uses of the term "white privilege."

But Bennett still credits Peggy McIntosh with coining the present-day meaning of the term, involving a largely unconscious cultural consensus among white people. It's not my impression that even that is original with her, but I'm not prepared to prove this at the present time.

I'm not disputing that the term was in use before Peggy McIntosh used it herself (and neither does the wikpedia entry on Peggy McIntosh as far as I can see). I was just pointing out to you that the person Fnord is quoting as an authority on the subject, the "white woman with a Bachelor of Arts degree from Radcliffe (Summa Cum Laude in English) ... etc", is clearly Peggy McIntosh (as one can see by looking at her biographical information on Wikipedia), and before that I was just pointing out to the forum why appealing to the authority of Peggy McIntosh fails to impress me.

I don't know exactly what Fnord meant by "codify", and I don't know who was the first to use the term "white privilege" (as interesting as that question is), but that's not really what I was focusing on.

Yes. That's why the field of scientific psychology plainly dismisses C.G.Jung.
His theories are unfalsifiable and they add up to something akin to a religious belief system.

Jung called it "analytic psychology". Anyone can call anything any name. That doesn't mean it adheres to the same standards.
Scientology called it religion something sciency sounding. That doesn't make it science.

Jung's writing is about as open to interpretation as any other religious text.
It's not like you can test anything he says through experiment. Peterson is free to project his conservative values into it, because it doesn't have any fixed meaning.
Oh, yeah, Peterson is pretty postmodern in his method.

"Jungian" in other Words

Life isn't Rational

In Fact the

Rationality

Is the

Hallucination

We Create According

To Neuroscience Now

Deal With it

Better

Yet Create it

Make it more

EPiC Than Ever BeFoRE ALL NoW

Verily Yes Perhaps Just As A Hobby

Now No Different Really than A Feral

Cat That/Who Continues to Play

At 20 Years-Old just to Survive

And Thrive Hmm... Wonder What That

Would Look Like For A 60 Year-Old Human

Wanna

See

Rhetorical

Question of Course

'Play Privilege' With

No Rules Written

Before Indeed

'Chaos Magic' Among

Many Other Jungian

Totally Sober Psychedelic Metaphors too hehe

Master of Tides Flow Now With No 'Mind' at All Essence of Free...Play

Jordan Peterson isn't real.

Oh wait, he is. Damn.

Some things just won't simply go away no matter how much you wish they would.

White people certainly have advantages over minorities when all other factors are equal.

But if we compare a disabled white person to an able non-white person, or a queer white person to a heterosexual non-white person; we'd find that both possess certain privileges the other does not.

And surely no rational person actually believes that a homeless white person has more privileges than a non-white middle class person.

I think what goes wrong in many conversations about privilege is many people don't understand the difference between demographics and individuals.

I take the path of least resistance (mostly).

However, I realize such an attitude can be detrimental.