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VegetableMan
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31 Jul 2021, 1:02 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
The Democrats did nothing to really fight Trump's SC picks. They approved them all. They are worthless!

Given that the Democrats were a minority in the Senate, there wasn't much they could do to stop Trump's SC picks. But where did you get the idea that the Democrats actually voted to "approve" them???


Being the minority doesn't excuse them. They won't break a sweat to take on the opposing party? Why? Because they're part of the same corruption and criminality as the Republicans.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/10/ ... ges-895168

The moratorium on evictions is set to expire at midnight Sunday. If Biden cared about the sufferring of people in this country he could have at least broke a sweat fighting for them. He should be up on his bully pulpit until the last hour. But he isn't, because he doesn't give a s**t.


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VegetableMan
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31 Jul 2021, 1:07 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
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The only real hope for the U.S. is a massive grassroots movement behind a third-party.

Agreed on the need for a massive grassroots movement, but I don't think a third party is the answer.

We just need more a lot more successful elections of progressive Democrats like AOC, in Congress, in state legislatures, and various local offices. Once there are enough progressive Democrats elected to Congress and various local offices, it will then become feasible to elect one as President as well -- at least if we don't have a right wing coup.

But electing enough progressives to political office will be possible only if there is a massive, well-organized grassroots progressive movement independent of any political party apparatus.



But the alledged progressives in the Democratic Party don't do anything. They fall in line with the corporate Dems at every turn.

If enough progressives get elected to Congress, you might be right. That will not likely happen, though.


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VegetableMan
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31 Jul 2021, 1:12 pm

I would love to be proven wrong about everything I've said in this thread. I truly would.


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IsabellaLinton
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31 Jul 2021, 1:16 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
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Mona Pereth wrote:
Really? I don't think I've ever known anyone who "worships" Biden. It's my impression that most moderate and left-leaning people see Biden as just a normal politician, with normal politician flaws, whereas Trump was glaringly unfit for office.


Maybe that was too strong of a word, but that's the impression I get as a non-American. It was even more pronounced when he first took office. It's nice to know he's considered as a normal politician with flaws. Everyone is only human.

A lot of people passionately supported Biden, but mainly just because he wasn't Trump. The election was a fight between those who hated Trump and those who loved Trump. In either case, it was all about Trump.


I get that, and I totally understand the need to replace Trump. During the election and immediately afterward, however, it seemed like many people were so excited by the change of president / party, and by getting rid of Trump, they acted like Biden could change the world or fix pretty much everything. Maybe the idea was that the Dems / Harris would change everything and not specifically Biden ... but as the figurehead he was certainly revered. Sure he's better than Trump, and I admit I don't really know squat about American politics, but I noticed many people defending Biden no matter what he did in these past few months because of the "He's better than Trump" caveat -- which has grown old really fast.



kraftiekortie
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31 Jul 2021, 1:53 pm

I certainly don’t worship the guy…..



funeralxempire
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31 Jul 2021, 1:55 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I certainly don’t worship the guy…..


Does anyone? I think most people just like the sense of normalcy and any appearance of love or worship is just exuberance over feeling less stress.

Which is also why it won't last. Eventually enough people will remember how bad things were before Trump and how they wanted change, just sane, competent change that isn't focused on refilling the swamp with even worse.


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IsabellaLinton
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31 Jul 2021, 2:12 pm

Is it ever conceivable that America could get rid of the two-party system entirely, and just elect the best and most qualified people for the job? That would include the senate and the Supreme Court, over time. Call me naive. Call me an idealist. I just don't understand why it needs to be structured in two teams which change their position on issues all the time, and which don't seem very different when actually in office.



kraftiekortie
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31 Jul 2021, 2:45 pm

Yep….that would be swell!



MaxE
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31 Jul 2021, 2:50 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Is it ever conceivable that America could get rid of the two-party system entirely, and just elect the best and most qualified people for the job? That would include the senate and the Supreme Court, over time. Call me naive. Call me an idealist. I just don't understand why it needs to be structured in two teams which change their position on issues all the time, and which don't seem very different when actually in office.

That's impossible. The US Constitution is sacred. What you suggest would be like editing the Gospel of St. John for logical consistency.


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VegetableMan
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31 Jul 2021, 3:24 pm

In reality, we have a one-party system, since there is no fundamental difference between Dems and Pubs.

There's really no way to vote against corporate interests. A vote for Biden is a vote for Wall Street, the fossil fuel industry, the health insurance industry, big pharm, etc.

But we keep playing the game. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. That's where we are, now. We're emersed in total insanity, hoping that some corporate sucking politician will come to our rescue. It's not going to happen.

I've been watching this s**t show for 40 years. No saviour is coming to save us. It's up to us.


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31 Jul 2021, 3:25 pm

MaxE wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Is it ever conceivable that America could get rid of the two-party system entirely, and just elect the best and most qualified people for the job? That would include the senate and the Supreme Court, over time. Call me naive. Call me an idealist. I just don't understand why it needs to be structured in two teams which change their position on issues all the time, and which don't seem very different when actually in office.

That's impossible. The US Constitution is sacred. What you suggest would be like editing the Gospel of St. John for logical consistency.

Well, the US constitution is 7,502 words long, of which 3,097 words (41.3 %) are amendments and 4.405 words (58.7 %) is the original "sacred" text.

The Gospel of St. John is 15,635 words long, so if a similar percentage volume for amendments was to be allowed here, one could add 10,992 words to the Gospel... equivalent to 22 pages of single line size 12 text in MSWord ... or almost the entire Gospel of Mark.



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31 Jul 2021, 3:47 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Is it ever conceivable that America could get rid of the two-party system entirely, and just elect the best and most qualified people for the job? That would include the senate and the Supreme Court, over time. Call me naive. Call me an idealist. I just don't understand why it needs to be structured in two teams which change their position on issues all the time, and which don't seem very different when actually in office.

That’s why in county elections I occasionally vote republican.I know the person and feel they are more qualified.
It’s a small community ,around 7,000.


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IsabellaLinton
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31 Jul 2021, 3:53 pm

Misslizard wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Is it ever conceivable that America could get rid of the two-party system entirely, and just elect the best and most qualified people for the job? That would include the senate and the Supreme Court, over time. Call me naive. Call me an idealist. I just don't understand why it needs to be structured in two teams which change their position on issues all the time, and which don't seem very different when actually in office.

That’s why in county elections I occasionally vote republican.I know the person and feel they are more qualified.
It’s a small community ,around 7,000.


Exactly. I'm the same way where I live. I vote for my local MPs based on their merit and experience. Sometimes I'll vote for a party based on one or two national issues, or I'll vote strategically for a minority government / alliance etc. I don't believe in strict party loyalty because it's pretty much a crap-shoot no matter who is elected. The issues change, and there's so much patronage / nepotism in politics that I could never identify with a party based on propaganda or rhetoric.



kraftiekortie
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31 Jul 2021, 4:14 pm

I’m a grass-roots guy myself.



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IsabellaLinton
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31 Jul 2021, 4:41 pm

I'm not trying to derail the topic about Biden, but I sincerely want to know what happened with the sexual assault allegations against him? I heard about them during his campaign and I remember being told that they wouldn't investigate until the election was over. Has he stood trial? Were the charges dropped? I feel like the story just vanished in the excitement of his election and the hype of getting rid of Trump.