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Dox47
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24 Jan 2022, 3:44 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
While there are way too many of those types of people in this world they are not enough for him to win an election. It is he is the lesser of two evils people that put him over the top in 2016 and the way things are going will be responsible for his upcoming landslide win in 2024.


Let's be honest here, Joe Biden and the Democrats are making that an easy call, Trump could run Biden's "hiding in the basement" campaign and win at this point, in fact it might work better than if here were out and about saying things to remind people of what he's actually like.


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Dox47
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24 Jan 2022, 3:49 am

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He did plenty of awful things. Just nothing you give a s**t about, apparently.


So, what are these awful things he did? I mean, I do have my share of complaints about the guy, quite a few in fact, but I'm not a joiner, and this forum is already full of inchoate Trump bashing without my contribution.


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24 Jan 2022, 9:46 am

The thing I do not understand is why do people who hate Trump still obsess with him, even though he is not President anymore? He's gone and the people got what they wanted, yet they still obsess over him.

It's like how when you hear stories of people in abusive relationships, and they get out of them but then they cannot help but obsess over the abuser and cannot ever get over them, and the always think about them. Why are people like that with Trump, when he's no longer President?



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24 Jan 2022, 12:32 pm

ironpony wrote:
The thing I do not understand is why do people who hate Trump still obsess with him, even though he is not President anymore? He's gone and the people got what they wanted, yet they still obsess over him.

I don't think about him every day, I just happened to see the question here, posted my ideas, then started getting topic reply notification emails, clicked them, found people were saying things that didn't look quite right to me, and asking me questions, so I added a few more comments. Once I'm done with this reply I'll probably not think about Trump again till next time I see a notification.

I think the main concern about Trump is that there's a real danger he'll get back in. And he's a right-winger, a rich man, and therefore somewhat dangerous to anybody of below average wealth. Added to that is the sheer insult of having to tolerate a vulgar slob at the top of the pecking order, the insult of having seen him successfully pull off his con trick of posing as working class. It's rather disturbing to see strong evidence that society is so brainwashed that it can fall for these ruses and perpetuate the inequalities that help to make the world such a brutal place.



Dox47
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24 Jan 2022, 3:14 pm

ironpony wrote:
The thing I do not understand is why do people who hate Trump still obsess with him, even though he is not President anymore? He's gone and the people got what they wanted, yet they still obsess over him.


That is the question, isn't it? It has an obvious answer for the media, he's great for ratings, and for Democrats, the mere sight of him riles up their base, so they want to try and invoke him as the face of the GOP at ever turn (e.g. last year's Virginia elections), but as to individuals, I'm not so sure. Mostly I think bringing him up lets them feel superior, that they aren't in the thrall of this vulgar slob, but I don't want to try and mind read too much, that's a bit of a pet peeve of mine so I try and avoid doing it myself.


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ToughDiamond
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24 Jan 2022, 4:58 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Mostly I think bringing him up lets them feel superior, that they aren't in the thrall of this vulgar slob, but I don't want to try and mind read too much, that's a bit of a pet peeve of mine so I try and avoid doing it myself.

I suspect it's more a case of not feeling inferior, than feeling superior. It's very little credit to a person's sense, to be able to see through such a transparent con trick. Some of his opponents were shocked when he won the election. They'd always felt that there are a lot of gullible people in the USA, and a lot of people who don't have much of a problem choosing such a horrible man as their leader, but before he won they didn't think there could possibly be THAT many of them. Even after he won, whenever his behaviour was spectacularly appalling, there was a feeling that surely he'd just put a big nail into his own coffin and that his support base would crumble. But it didn't.

But some of his fans just didn't see the obvious. There was some group who put it about that a few days after the last election he was going to give a signal to the military who would arrest a load of Democrats and reinstate him as president by force. There was no "we think this might happen," they were certain it would. When it didn't, the group's followers didn't leave that group in droves. It's like when the Jehovah's Witnesses used to confidently predict the end of the world. Their followers never seemed to notice when history proved them completely wrong every time.



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24 Jan 2022, 5:36 pm

ToughDiamond wrote:
I suspect it's more a case of not feeling inferior, than feeling superior. It's very little credit to a person's sense, to be able to see through such a transparent con trick. Some of his opponents were shocked when he won the election. They'd always felt that there are a lot of gullible people in the USA, and a lot of people who don't have much of a problem choosing such a horrible man as their leader, but before he won they didn't think there could possibly be THAT many of them. Even after he won, whenever his behaviour was spectacularly appalling, there was a feeling that surely he'd just put a big nail into his own coffin and that his support base would crumble. But it didn't.


See, the problem here is that you still think his base is not aware of who he is, when that is largely not true, they like that he's crude and uncouth and destructive to the system of government they hate, that's a feature, not a bug. The more you point out his flaws, the more they like him, because he's a living middle finger to people like you, that's his purpose, to offend people they feel have been condescending to them for years and meddling with their lives, Trump is payback.


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24 Jan 2022, 5:49 pm

Dox47 wrote:
ToughDiamond wrote:
I suspect it's more a case of not feeling inferior, than feeling superior. It's very little credit to a person's sense, to be able to see through such a transparent con trick. Some of his opponents were shocked when he won the election. They'd always felt that there are a lot of gullible people in the USA, and a lot of people who don't have much of a problem choosing such a horrible man as their leader, but before he won they didn't think there could possibly be THAT many of them. Even after he won, whenever his behaviour was spectacularly appalling, there was a feeling that surely he'd just put a big nail into his own coffin and that his support base would crumble. But it didn't.
See, the problem here is that you still think his base is not aware of who he is, when that is largely not true, they like that he's crude and uncouth and destructive to the system of government they hate, that's a feature, not a bug. The more you point out his flaws, the more they like him, because he's a living middle finger to people like you, that's his purpose, to offend people they feel have been condescending to them for years and meddling with their lives, Trump is payback.
I find myself siding with you again.  Trump is the kind of loud-mouthed lightning-rod that white evangelical Christians wish they could be and still call themselves "Christians".



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24 Jan 2022, 5:59 pm

Dox47 wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
While there are way too many of those types of people in this world they are not enough for him to win an election. It is he is the lesser of two evils people that put him over the top in 2016 and the way things are going will be responsible for his upcoming landslide win in 2024.


Let's be honest here, Joe Biden and the Democrats are making that an easy call, Trump could run Biden's "hiding in the basement" campaign and win at this point, in fact it might work better than if here were out and about saying things to remind people of what he's actually like.

Trump running from his basement just will not be happening, although I doubt it Trump running from his prison cell might. Either way my prediction stands. And how will the left react to such a humiliating rebuke? Serious reassessment are you kidding? They will triple down on wokeism more convinced then ever America is irredeemably bigoted.


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24 Jan 2022, 8:05 pm

ToughDiamond wrote:
ironpony wrote:
The thing I do not understand is why do people who hate Trump still obsess with him, even though he is not President anymore? He's gone and the people got what they wanted, yet they still obsess over him.

I don't think about him every day, I just happened to see the question here, posted my ideas, then started getting topic reply notification emails, clicked them, found people were saying things that didn't look quite right to me, and asking me questions, so I added a few more comments. Once I'm done with this reply I'll probably not think about Trump again till next time I see a notification.

I think the main concern about Trump is that there's a real danger he'll get back in. And he's a right-winger, a rich man, and therefore somewhat dangerous to anybody of below average wealth. Added to that is the sheer insult of having to tolerate a vulgar slob at the top of the pecking order, the insult of having seen him successfully pull off his con trick of posing as working class. It's rather disturbing to see strong evidence that society is so brainwashed that it can fall for these ruses and perpetuate the inequalities that help to make the world such a brutal place.


Even if he does get back in it would only be for four years and what would he really do to ruin the country really? Try rebuilding a wall he was never able to get off the ground much anyway? Plus it's not like the rich can actually take money. Biden got a bunch of people fired from oil pipeline jobs for example, so he is he any less dangerous when it comes to trying to take away options for non-rich people... It seems like it wouldn't be that bad if Trump got in for four years again. Sure you have to deal with some vulgarity, but why does everyone have to get their panties in a twist over that, so to speak?



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24 Jan 2022, 8:07 pm

ironpony wrote:
The thing I do not understand is why do people who hate Trump still obsess with him, even though he is not President anymore? He's gone and the people got what they wanted, yet they still obsess over him.

Because of his ongoing coup attempt. Pretending like he's no longer a threat would be a huge mistake. 40% of the republican party still believes he won the election.





If Trump succeeds in 2022 & 2024, mark my words, the US will likely become a one-party state. Kiss goodbye to many of your individual rights. If Trump fails in 2024 we are still in for trouble. We're going to see lots of stochastic terrorism from far-right militia cells.



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24 Jan 2022, 8:14 pm

RushKing wrote:
ironpony wrote:
The thing I do not understand is why do people who hate Trump still obsess with him, even though he is not President anymore? He's gone and the people got what they wanted, yet they still obsess over him.

Because of his ongoing coup attempt. Pretending like he's no longer a threat would be a huge mistake. 40% of the republican party still believes he won the election.





If Trump succeeds in 2022 & 2024, mark my words, the US will likely become a one-party state. Kiss goodbye to many of your individual rights. If Trump fails in 2024 we are still in for trouble. We're going to see lots of stochastic terrorism from far-right militia cells.


The coup attempt would have happened anyway regardless of whether or not Trump said anything. There was evidence of the culprits already having planned it before Trump said anything. So I think people put too much weight on Trump being responsible, as it would have happened regardless. Plus if Trump became President again, then there wouldn't be another coup attempt likely.



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24 Jan 2022, 8:46 pm

ironpony wrote:


Trump's intentions have been very clear, if he had his way the coup would have happened then and there. He's still the head of the republican party. I don't think anyone is overreacting right now.



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24 Jan 2022, 9:02 pm

Dox47 wrote:
See, the problem here is that you still think his base is not aware of who he is, when that is largely not true, they like that he's crude and uncouth and destructive to the system of government they hate, that's a feature, not a bug. The more you point out his flaws, the more they like him, because he's a living middle finger to people like you, that's his purpose, to offend people they feel have been condescending to them for years and meddling with their lives, Trump is payback.

Except that the "pleasure" of watching him spit on the snobs' carpet was the only thing they got out of him. Populists deliver little material benefit to their supporters. The shock for some of the Lefties is that so many people have such a shallow thinking style as not to see that. A lot of the support for him is purely emotional. Politicians dupe people by appealing to emotion and bypassing critical thinking. He's even convinced them that Covid is harmless, so that they go around catching it and spreading it, risking their lives because to them it's nothing more than a leftie conspiracy to get them under control.

I've only met 3 people who I know support him. One admits Trump is odious but believes that he's the only one who will get rid of the immigrants, who the guy sees as the reason why everything is going wrong in the country. Another seems to think Trump is a decent man. That one blames everything on left-wing ideology. The other I know less about, except that she can't understand why the Left puts so much energy into attacking him, and admires him for such things as not having taken the presidential salary - she apparently doesn't see that the billionaire can afford such a gesture and has likely grabbed a lot more money than that from less obvious sources by virtue of being president anyway. All three are fairly mild-mannered, friendly, generous people, as long as you're white and heterosexual.



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24 Jan 2022, 9:15 pm

RushKing wrote:
ironpony wrote:


Trump's intentions have been very clear, if he had his way the coup would have happened then and there. He's still the head of the republican party. I don't think anyone is overreacting right now.


What makes you think the coup would have happened if he had his way? What do you mean by 'having his way'?



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24 Jan 2022, 9:16 pm

ironpony wrote:
Even if he does get back in it would only be for four years and what would he really do to ruin the country really? Try rebuilding a wall he was never able to get off the ground much anyway? Plus it's not like the rich can actually take money. Biden got a bunch of people fired from oil pipeline jobs for example, so he is he any less dangerous when it comes to trying to take away options for non-rich people... It seems like it wouldn't be that bad if Trump got in for four years again. Sure you have to deal with some vulgarity, but why does everyone have to get their panties in a twist over that, so to speak?

Well, if nothing else, he's a Republican, and Republican ideology is against levelling the rich-poor divide any more than they have to in order to keep a lid on public anger. Certainly I wouldn't trust the Democrats to do much to help the poor either, and I doubt anything is going to get better under the current 2-party system. My objection to Trump as a person is probably more emotional than logical, more a case of adding insult to injury, though it's really not very relaxing to keep seeing a right-winger gloating like he does. More of a logical problem, he's shown he's mad enough to try to circumvent the entire system to stay in power in perpetuo. They're all dangerous, but some are more dangerous than others.