Florida’s “Don’t say gay” law

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Well, I'm certainly glad that provision was pulled, because that is horrifying. Not everyone is fortunate enough to come from an accepting home and to out a student against their will to a family that could potentially throw them out of their house is awful.



Personally, the term lifestyle, it often rubs me the wrong way. I know it's a small thing to complain about, but to me a lifestyle is if I were to buy a luxury yacht and travel around, not merely existing as a gay person.

Listen. Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying I want explicit content taught to kids who are too young to learn such content, but to go to the lengths stated in other proposals - such as banning books because they mention something gay - that's going too far. Oftentimes it seems to be built on the belief that if kids are shielded from the existence of gay people, then none of them will be gay when they grow up. It's a belief that I've heard time and time again. As if gay adults just spawn into existence.

I grew up as a closeted lesbian. Throughout high school, the people around me would always talk as if it were given that everyone in the room was straight. I went to high school during a time where marriage equality was a big topic and people would often debate it in class. Avoiding the subject wasn't really possible. Even in classes such as learning German, I had assignments where I had to talk about my ideal partner. I hated that task because I didn't want to talk about such things at that stage. Of course I wrote he because I didn't want to come out. Even in a different language it felt odd to say and I didn't enjoy working on it.

Romance and sex make up big parts of our culture. Such discussions should always be age appropriate. However, to not have them at all isn't really an option. From the moment a baby looks around the world, the expectation that they are straight is placed upon them. You see toddlers wearing T-shirts that say 'Ladies' man' or 'Princess looking for her Prince'. Disney movies with big romances. Cooties. Poetry in English class. The conversation is always there. Ingrained in everything we do. Kids learn about gender roles and expectations from a very young age. I can understand why. After all, most people are cisgender and straight. However, not everyone fits that description. Even those that do, they may not fit neatly into such expectations.

So, it begs the question, how much influence should parents have over their child's education? It's a controversial question. To shield a child completely from the subject of romance seems impossible. Mother's day, Father's day, Valentine's day...I don't know about your school, but I had to make cards for such events as a kid. As same-sex parenting becomes more socially accepted, you are bound to have a couple of kids in school who might want to make two Mother's day cards or two Father's day cards and so on (although I suppose you could tell them to stick with the same card and simply move the apostrophe - it would double as a good excuse for a lesson in punctuation). Even kids with a dad and a mum but they're divorced, you might have a situation where they want to wish their mum a happy mother's day and their step mum the same. One solution would be scrapping the whole making cards activity, which would save on paper. Still, kids are curious about the world and if another kid in their class has two mums or two dads, then they might want to ask about it. "Ah, sorry, I can't answer that, it's too political".

This fightback from republicans is over having to accommodate gay students. I am actually amazed why the LGBTQI community isn't doing more to fight back given this is directed at them?

Teachers nowadays are having to wear many hats. Most probably don't ask their students about their lifestyles or consider sexuality. The last thing they need is a MAGA moron screaming at them about some made up claim of indocrinating their kids.

How is the age range relevant ?

These same aged children are exposed to heterosexual existence all the time.

My fundamental argument is: A 4 year old doesn't know what "sex" is, let alone what sexual orientation they are.
They need to find themselves through an "organic" process rather than through political activism.

Teacher: "You need to keep your mind open about what your sexual identity is."
4 year old child: "What the f**k are you talking about, biatch?"

You bring up a point.
Not all teachers are "moron" regressive progressives.

In the classroom?
Why is that?
"Arithmetic" is male and "Reading" is female?

Here's the thing: It's not about sex. Certainly not in the demographic we are discussing.


Much like how a boy experiencing his first crush on a girl is not sexual, neither is a girl crushing on another girl or a boy crushing on another boy. I very much doubt that anyone wants your hypothetical situation to occur. However, a complete ban of all discussions is not the way to go. Let me ask you this - if a primary school aged kid asked why another kid in their class has two mums or two dads to a teacher, how would you want them to respond? Should they tell the child not to ask such questions?

For a start, you have changed the context to "Primary Skool".

I am not a parent or teacher, so my view is probably unrealistically simplistic, but I would advise them to speak to their parents first unless the parents have specifically stated they are ok about teacher involvement.

There are countless children’s stories about families with a mother, father, and children in the household. Not all
Families look like that. Some have two moms, others have two dads, others are single parents or grandparents etc.

Why pretend gay people and gay relationships don’t exist when age appropriate (and sometimes inappropriate) heterosexual normative stuff is taught to kids of all ages?

That’s not how public school curriculums work. All relevant things are taught to all kids because they need to learn them in order to understand the world around them. Parents don’t just get to opt their kids out of science class because they believe the earth is a mere few thousand years old.

Exactly.
The words I used to explain homosexuality to my 5yo daughter were "fall in love".
"Gays are men who fall in love with other men, not women."

There's enough romance in mainstream culture, even for small children, to make them easily understand this concept, without any unnecessary or age-inappropriate details.

Context:
Very young children.

I am not convinced by what you have said.

And who decides what is relevant?
Political activist teachers?

Why can't parents teach their kids about the world around them?

One more time ***:
For young children, teach the 3R's, let them be children, and don't indoctrinate them into political activism.

<Shake head>
Who is suggesting this?

One more time ***:
Let young children be young children.
Don't involve them in political activism.
If they ask questions outside the skool curriculum, let the parents answer unless the parents have specifically given the teacher permission.
How can this be confusing?

Last edited by Pepe on 16 Mar 2022, 4:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

What is "political activism"?
Here:
110 years ago, teaching Polish was political activism.
40 years ago, explaining what democracy is was political activism.
3 years ago, a workshop about our Constitution was banned as "dragging kids into political activism"

Right now, there is a joke in Russia:
K: Mom, when will we go to McDonalds?
M: I'm not interested in politics.

Absolutely, it's not about sex - just mummies + mummies and daddies + daddies and falling in love, explained in no more detail than for heterosexual relationships.
Attempts at making it political and about something it's clearly not betrays ulterior motives, IMO.