How much longer until mass shootings make us hermits?

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SpiralingCrow
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08 Jun 2022, 6:59 am

naturalplastic wrote:
Pepe wrote:
SpiralingCrow wrote:
Mikah wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
How many mass murderers were also meth users?. Or any kind of drug user?


Almost all of them are on something. It's usually marijuana. https://attackersmokedcannabis.com/

naturalplastic wrote:
Ive never heard drugs linked to the Columbine killers, or Sandy Hook, or the Las Vegas shooter, etc.


These were all potentially linked to mind-altering legally prescribed drugs: - Columbine to anti-depressants, drugs known to cause insane and suicidal behaviour in a minority of users. The Las Vegas shooter had copious amounts of Valium in his blood - Valium users usually take other similar drugs. Sandy Hook is a bit murkier - it was announced that Lanza had no drugs in his system at the time of the shooting but for some reason authorities refused to release his psychiatric/drug history, so a bit of an unknown.

naturalplastic wrote:
And historically drugs were even less controlled than guns in American history. In the Nineteenth Century you could buy patent medicine off of the shelf that contained opium, or cocaine.


True, but usage of illegal drugs / prescription of legal mind-altering drugs have both rocketed to the moon in recent decades.


More likely the drugs, whether given by professional or self administered, were trying to treat underlying psychological issues. It was those psyche issues that were the real cause of the violence. Certainly not marijuana or valium. Those are feel good drugs. People use those to relax and feel calm not go on shooting sprees.


There is a strong connection between marijuana and schizophrenia. 8)

Yes...his drug theory has problems. First off is what you're all saying. The chicken-egg question. Do folks dose themselves (or get dosed by licensed physicians) because they are nuts, or do they go nuts because they use (either under the counter, or over the counter)drugs? BTW I know a guy who is an example of both, but he is not a spree shooter.

Second- other industrialized countries have hash, and XTC, and evey other illegal drug that we have, and they have the same legal but controlled psychotropic meds that docs prescribe- just like the US does. But other countries dont have mass shootings as often as we do.


I'm saying psychological issues regardless of whether someone is self medicating or on prescribed medication is most likely at the root of the shootings. Internet, social media and the culture also have a big impact in my opinion.

You do bring up a very good point though. Other countries do not have this same issue. If it was purely a drug related issue you should see more of this behavior elsewhere. The US is unique in that way.



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08 Jun 2022, 9:00 am

The United States has 330 MIL people. It's the third most populous country in the world. I don't feel mass shootings are so numerous that they'll put a dent in the overall population.

IMO, our country is too big and there's no community or safety net. In homes that are authoritarian and/or neglectful, children especially feel helpless and hopeless. That drives people to the IDGAF stage. I've known a lot of young people who have voiced, "No one cares about me, so why should I care about anyone else?"

Additionally, "If it bleeds, it leads" has been the motto for news outlets for a very long time. Violence sells so it's what we see when we open our web browsers or turn on televisions.

But people in general have made me a hermit, not mass shootings.


ASPartOfMe wrote:
Two more multiple fatality mass shootings last night.

Right now despite all the talk and anguish it is not affecting much. Public gathering places are crowded, schools that are not out for summer vacation are still open. People seem to understand that their chances of being victim of a mass shooter are smaller that many other daily activities.

The hope is like in the past, the wave will crest and semi normalcy will return until the next wave. This time seems different. The mass shootings are more lethal, more often and with many different motivations. Even in attacks targeted at individuals the shooters do not seem to care what innocent people are collateral damage.

Regular old crime has messed up the economy and led to desolate streets plenty of times before. I think we are closer to the tipping point where a significant number of people do start to hibernate then realized. When schools reopen in September how many attacks will it take for parents to conclude America is simply unable to protect their children, we go back to optional in person learning certain school districts throw up their hands and close schools? After all the angst and fighting over COVID to get schools it gets undone. Catastrophic for a whole generation.

Even if the worst happens their are positive scenarios.

One is that the economy shutting down finally forces the politicians to act.

Two is that we show fortitude like the British during the blitz or Israelis during terrorist waves. Debris, blood, and bodies cleaned up, everybody carries on with daily life.

I see nothing to indicate those happening here.



ASPartOfMe
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08 Jun 2022, 10:02 am

H_Taterz wrote:
The United States has 330 MIL people. It's the third most populous country in the world. I don't feel mass shootings are so numerous that they'll put a dent in the overall population.

IMO, our country is too big and there's no community or safety net. In homes that are authoritarian and/or neglectful, children especially feel helpless and hopeless. That drives people to the IDGAF stage. I've known a lot of young people who have voiced, "No one cares about me, so why should I care about anyone else?"

Additionally, "If it bleeds, it leads" has been the motto for news outlets for a very long time. Violence sells so it's what we see when we open our web browsers or turn on televisions.

But people in general have made me a hermit, not mass shootings.

It is absolutely true that the risk of being harmed by a mass shooter is minuscule compared to many activities people do without giving it a thought. By logic mass shootings should be a minor priority at most. Peoples minds are not logical. Gruesome deaths from car accidents, are normal. Accidents involving 16-21 year old drivers are common. But there is no consideration being given to banning driving until you are 22. Your own bathroom is one of the most dangerous places you can be. No law mandating grab bars and life saver alert devices in bathrooms. These accidents are normal and expected so people do not fear using their own bathrooms or driving.

Mass shootings because they are not accidents, random and sudden and involve multiple deaths at once create illogical fear. Anything involving children is going to cause great instinctual fear.


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Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 08 Jun 2022, 2:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Misslizard
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08 Jun 2022, 10:04 am

Google Machete attacks. 8O


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H_Taterz
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08 Jun 2022, 10:50 am

:lol: :lol: :lol:

When we were driving outside of Seattle, we actually saw a random dude with two machetes walking down the road.
Just rubbing and clanking them together. It was one of those WTF moments.
Just keep driving..........

Misslizard wrote:
Google Machete attacks. 8O



kitesandtrainsandcats
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08 Jun 2022, 12:48 pm

Corpus Christi Caller-Times
Politicians search for solutions after mass shooting. Experts say we’ve already found them
Jolie McCullough and James Barragán
Mon, June 6, 2022 at 2:56 PM·9 min read
https://news.yahoo.com/politicians-sear ... 26287.html
and
https://www.caller.com/story/news/2022/ ... 536301001/

Quote:
... "A challenge we face here is that everybody is looking for one answer, one thing. That doesn’t exist,” said Jaclyn Schildkraut, associate professor of criminal justice at State University of New York at Oswego. “We’re dealing with very complex phenomena that go in spider webs in so many different directions but all weaved together.” ...


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aghogday
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08 Jun 2022, 4:39 pm



Well Considering Over 1 MiLLioN Folks Died in A Deadly
Pandemic And Where i LiVE iN 'Trump/DeSaTaNiS' 'Trademark
God Town USA,' During the Peak of the Deadly Delta Variant, Folks Acted

Like There Was NO Pandemic At All, Except for the Employees at
Walmart And Target And the Corporate Protected AS Such; And True,
Give the Priests And the Deacons Credit for Wearing A Mask Delivering

Communion;

Yet not the Congregation,
Giving Them the Freedom of Choice
With No Requirements For Social Distancing;

Yet What Really Worked For Vaccinations Was When
Personal FRiEnDS And Family Members Close Started

To Actually DROP LIKE
FLIES FROM THE PANDEMIC;
DEAD, DEAD, DEAD, A WAKE
UP CALL OF DEATH FOR THEM.

Small Attention Spans Make Small
Plans for Safety

until

DEATH
DEATH
DEATH

WAKES FOLK UP.

GIVE me LIBERTY And GIVE me FREEDOM

GIVE US IGNORANCE AND THE BODY COUNTS
CONTINUE TO RISE in more Harming, Raping, Maiming,

Killing Ways As That's The HiSToRY of the Worst Pandemic That
the Human AS A SPECIES Delivers to the Rest of Nature out of Balance in
Killing Ways as 1 in 8 Animal And Plant Species are assessed as destined to

Extinction
By the Human
Hand of Erasure
in Coming Decades
OUT of Balance Now With
Living Nature on this Planet;

Yet ONLY As Long as We Are Here;

And Now We Are Raising Up LoWeRinG Down Children
That And Who Slaughter Children; Not A Good Look for Any

Social Animal
Species Really
That And Who
Wants to continue to Exist;

Yet Nature Culls What offends
in Balance; It is REAL Karma in Terms of Simple Actions
And Consequences That Humans Are Surely Not Exempt

From Now Or Ever Will Be Now As Classically Evolved, So 'We'

Turn The Other Cheek in Trump Towns USA As The Zombie
Apocalypse of the Face of Nature That is Also Us WE EAT That We
Have no Way to Escape on this Planet Slowly And Steadily Growing
By Human Zombie Armies
Now in Larger Armed

Size Ways; Yep,

Propagating Smaller

Offenders of Pandemics

As We Spiral Down the Path
That Imbalance Naturally Brings;

Less of Us in every way Still to come and go away...

In Short, considering How So Many Folks in the United
States Were Able to Look the Other Way, While A Million
Folks in the United States Died A Horrible Death of Suffocation

That a Respiratory
Deadly Pandemic Brings;

Nah, There Won't Be Many Hermits

Here; It'll Take A Lot More Pain And Suffering

AND DEATH For Folks to Stay Inside; Yet What if they

Showed the Photos of the Bodies More than the Faces of the

Zombies Eating the Face of Humankind; People Around Here Would Just Look Away

After A Few Views
As iF iT Ain't in THeir
Backyard It's Out of View...

Yet Really People Are Just Too Damn
Busy With the Complexity of Our Culture
For even Surviving at All; Most Folks Are Just Treading

Water Trying
To Survive
As They Are Today...

As 50 Percent Making 50 to 100 Thousand
Dollars NoW Assessed as Living Pay Check
to Pay Check; And Yes, 40 Percent Reaching
Middle Upper Class Well Over 100 Thousand
Dollars Living Pay Check to Pay Check; Where
The Price of Gas Going Up to 5 Dollars A Gallon
For Every Person Living Pay Check to Pay Check

Seems Like A Worst Natural Human Disaster they
Are Currently Coping With Out of Balance With A Mind

For Financial Management too; Oh, the First World Problems;

Not Many Folks Even Have the
Capacity Left in Their Arsenal
of Human (Empathy And The Such) Juice to FREaKiN' Care At All...

So Goes A Human Condition Out of Balance With the Rest of Nature;

And Truly It's Up to People Who Have What it Takes to Pay Attention to Do

Something
Anything
At All to Save
Our Ship From TOTALLy Sinking...

It'll Probably Take a Few More Decades
to Totally Sink; Perhaps i'll See it, Perhaps i Won't...

Never The Less, Over Here in 'Trump Town USA', Where Most
Folks Act and Look Like Each Other And Attend a Church of Some
Kind on Sunday; i Can't imagine Currently A More Ignorant And Safe Place to Live;

See How
This Works?

As Long As It Works
This Way For Them
And Even me We are
Gonna Survive And Thrive in Paradise The Best We Can And Will;

All The Retired Baby Boomers Moving Down Here to Soak Up the
Sun And Buy Up The Rest of the Real Estate At High Prices While

The Younger
Folks Get
Lost For Some
Place to Live And
Raise Perhaps, Even
A Family; Yes The Pot
Is Stirring Here too; So Far

Peace Exists For me to Stay in Bliss...

And It's True, i Give Credit to the Tradition
At Hand; Good For Short Term Survival So Far;

Yet Some of We Will See What Ignorance Added
to The Soup Does in

the Longer

Run for
Eden
Down Here...

Down Here
In 'Hooterville' And Paradise too...

Tradition Brings Safety and Ignorance

Ironically the Two Work Hand in Hand For
A While it Seems at least...

Till Change
And the
Next
Tradition
That Brings
Safety Enough
to Survive and
Even Thrive Takes 'Residence' again...

Yet What Happens When All The Traditions

Melt Away; What Happens When Humans No Longer
Stand Together As a Group With Common Meaning And Purpose

Voila:

Mass Shootings

Increasing Human
Carnage, Year by Year;

Younger People Lonelier than

Ever Before; And Older People Left
Without Caregivers too; There is Room

For So Much More Misery and Suffering; Yes, So Much
More Than Just the Most Publicized Offenses of Humanity...

Meanwhile i'll Do 'Liberal' online
And Keep 'Conservative' Folks

Close as
my Safety
Net to Continue
to THRiVE iN Eden...

Generally Speaking
'Realists' Make A 'Better' Living...

I'm Not suggesting Many of the Other
Folks Are REALLY Thriving With Their
Current Ignorant Ways of Life; Yet they
Are Surviving...

We Do
What
Works;
It's What Nature Does;

Yawn, i Play, it's What
The Rest of
Nature

Does...

-me



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Pepe
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08 Jun 2022, 10:22 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Pepe wrote:
SpiralingCrow wrote:
Mikah wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
How many mass murderers were also meth users?. Or any kind of drug user?


Almost all of them are on something. It's usually marijuana. https://attackersmokedcannabis.com/

naturalplastic wrote:
Ive never heard drugs linked to the Columbine killers, or Sandy Hook, or the Las Vegas shooter, etc.


These were all potentially linked to mind-altering legally prescribed drugs: - Columbine to anti-depressants, drugs known to cause insane and suicidal behaviour in a minority of users. The Las Vegas shooter had copious amounts of Valium in his blood - Valium users usually take other similar drugs. Sandy Hook is a bit murkier - it was announced that Lanza had no drugs in his system at the time of the shooting but for some reason authorities refused to release his psychiatric/drug history, so a bit of an unknown.

naturalplastic wrote:
And historically drugs were even less controlled than guns in American history. In the Nineteenth Century you could buy patent medicine off of the shelf that contained opium, or cocaine.


True, but usage of illegal drugs / prescription of legal mind-altering drugs have both rocketed to the moon in recent decades.


More likely the drugs, whether given by professional or self administered, were trying to treat underlying psychological issues. It was those psyche issues that were the real cause of the violence. Certainly not marijuana or valium. Those are feel good drugs. People use those to relax and feel calm not go on shooting sprees.


There is a strong connection between marijuana and schizophrenia. 8)

Yes...his drug theory has problems. First off is what you're all saying. The chicken-egg question. Do folks dose themselves (or get dosed by licensed physicians) because they are nuts, or do they go nuts because they use (either under the counter, or over the counter)drugs? BTW I know a guy who is an example of both, but he is not a spree shooter.


I know a guy that doesn't take any drugs, but he has crazy eyes. 8O
I found it amusing that you took one individual out of billions, to make a point. ;)

naturalplastic wrote:
Second- other industrialized countries have hash, and XTC, and evey other illegal drug that we have, and they have the same legal but controlled psychotropic meds that docs prescribe- just like the US does. But other countries dont have mass shootings as often as we do.


I can't think of any other country that has access to guns the way AAmuria does.
Don't we all agree that this is a major factor?

But the other thing to consider, that most refuse to consider, is "the man behind the curtains" manipulating these puppet sociopaths, through electronic harassment technology. 8)

Once again, there is an attempt to disarm the entire citizenry of the world through these obscene methods.
How can't people see that? :scratch:

Having said that, I still think AAmurians should surrender and change the 2nd amendment. :shrug:



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08 Jun 2022, 10:31 pm

H_Taterz wrote:
The United States has 330 MIL people. It's the third most populous country in the world. I don't feel mass shootings are so numerous that they'll put a dent in the overall population.

IMO, our country is too big and there's no community or safety net. In homes that are authoritarian and/or neglectful, children especially feel helpless and hopeless. That drives people to the IDGAF stage. I've known a lot of young people who have voiced, "No one cares about me, so why should I care about anyone else?"

Additionally, "If it bleeds, it leads" has been the motto for news outlets for a very long time. Violence sells so it's what we see when we open our web browsers or turn on televisions.

But people in general have made me a hermit, not mass shootings.


Mental health issues are *the* major problem with these mass shootings.
Without it, it wouldn't happen.

I would think that anyone who engages in this clearly qualifies as being "Mentally Ill", surely.
Keep in mind the context I am using here. 8)

Crackdown on the bullying in society that creates these sociopaths.
These thugs have blood on their hands. :skull:



Pepe
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08 Jun 2022, 10:36 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
It is absolutely true that the risk of being harmed by a mass shooter is minuscule compared to many activities people do without giving it a thought. By logic mass shootings should be a minor priority at most. Peoples minds are not logical. Gruesome deaths from car accidents, are normal. Accidents involving 16-21 year old drivers are common. But there is no consideration being given to banning driving until you are 22. Your own bathroom is one of the most dangerous places you can be. No law mandating grab bars and life saver alert devices in bathrooms. These accidents are normal and expected so people do not fear using their own bathrooms or driving.

Mass shootings because they are not accidents, random and sudden and involve multiple deaths at once create illogical fear. Anything involving children is going to cause great instinctual fear.


Agreed.
The difference is, that there is a covert agenda, beyond the social one, to disarm the citizenry of the world.
It is easier to "organise" humanity when it can't fight back. 8O



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08 Jun 2022, 11:28 pm

Pepe wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
Pepe wrote:
SpiralingCrow wrote:
[quote=":

What are you babbling about? How did I "use one person to prove any point"?



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09 Jun 2022, 5:47 am

Pepe wrote:
But the other thing to consider, that most refuse to consider, is "the man behind the curtains" manipulating these puppet sociopaths, through electronic harassment technology. 8)
Is there anything reputable published to support this allegation? That may be a reason why people "refuse" to consider it.

Pepe wrote:
I can't think of any other country that has access to guns the way AAmuria does.
Don't we all agree that this is a major factor?
Pepe wrote:
Mental health issues are *the* major problem with these mass shootings.
Without it, it wouldn't happen.
So there can be mass shootings without guns? :scratch: Isn't the unlimited presence of guns the primary contributor to, uh, gun deaths?


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naturalplastic
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10 Jun 2022, 2:03 am

To answer the question- mass shootings- and being a hermit- have nothing to do with each other.

Even if you have an hysterical and exaggerated fear of mass shootings it wouldnt change your propensity to go out.



ironpony
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10 Jun 2022, 5:34 pm

What are the motivations for these mass shootings? People say it's people being bullied but is it being bullied over anything particular, or just anything randomly?



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10 Jun 2022, 7:15 pm

ironpony wrote:
What are the motivations for these mass shootings? People say it's people being bullied but is it being bullied over anything particular, or just anything randomly?

I thought you from Canada. But apparently you fell to earth from planet X.

you're a grown man. you're 37. Havent you ever read a book, a magazine article, or read news on the internet, or taken a sociology course?

Why do you rely so much on the population of WP to keep you informed? We cant pat you on the back and burp you like a baby. You gotta do some things on your own.

You should know enough to know that ...not much is really known- by society - about why these folks turn spree killer.

You have the Columbine boys who were misfit teens. Maybe bullied. But then you have that Arab couple in San Bernidino California who became workplace spree killers -mowing down coworkers- ostensibly in the name of Islam, and ISIS. And other folks in America turn killer ostensibly for political extremism (American righwingers or leftwingers or KKK or BLM, or some crazy gunning for a Supreme Court Justice whatever) as well. But folks who do it for politics may REALLY be doing it for some other deep seated reason (like they were bullied).

Then there is the Las Vegas shooter who mowed down like fifty people at that country music concert a couple of years ago. A middle aged native born White guy. Not a Muslim immigrant. Not a teen like the Columbine shooters. Had no obvious political motivation. Not known to be political extremist. He was long out of school so he wasnt a recent victim of school bullying. So what motivated him? No one yet knows.

The "original" American spree killer was that rifle sniper in the Sixties who murdered people by shooting folks from a steeple on a college campus. It turned out that he had a tumor in his brain that -may -or may not-have had something to do with him becoming homocidal.

So you tell me...do you see a pattern in it?



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10 Jun 2022, 9:19 pm

Most people don’t even remember this one.Pre-Columbine.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westsid ... l_shooting


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