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ASPartOfMe
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08 Feb 2023, 8:07 pm

John Podhoretz

Quote:
Go ahead, call me—a conservative journalist for more than 40 years and speechwriter to Ronald Reagan—a RINO if you like, but I’ve never been more embarrassed to be associated with the Republican party than in the middle of the State of the Union when House members started openly heckling the president of the United States.

They screamed “liar and “bulls—” in the House chamber when Biden said there were Republican proposals to “sunset” Social Security and Medicare.

In point of fact, Biden is narrowly correct here. Sen. Rick Scott of Florida issued a weird proposal to make all federal legislation sunset after five years. That would include Social Security and Medicare. It was a stupid and ill-considered proposal, in part because it opened up the GOP to exactly the attack Biden staged last night.

And these barbaric House members fell right into Biden’s trap. Rather than shaking their heads, as Speaker Kevin McCarthy did behind Biden, they behaved goonishly. That’s exactly what Biden wanted. In yelling at him like drunken attendees at a WWF match who seem not to know the proceedings are fake, Marjorie Taylor Greene and her hearty band of repellent maniacs provided Biden and the Democrats with visuals and sounds they can use for the next two years to rally their own troops—and independent voters sickened by the bad behavior of politicians generally—against Republican crassness and incivility.

Polling data over the past couple of weeks have made it clear that Biden remains a highly problematic candidate for reelection. He spent most of the time in his State of the Union trying to convince Americans that he has done good things that are making their lives better or are going to make their lives better pretty soon. It’s pretty clear the American people aren’t buying it. Biden’s positive case for himself will only resonate with Democrats who would vote for any Democrat.

But what Biden and his people do seem to understand is that what saved Democrats in 2022 from the chopping block might save them in 2024: the fear among voters who will decide Biden’s fate—and the fate of Democrats running down ballot—that too many Republican politicians are weird, unpleasant, and crazy.

Biden’s speech was risible in parts, and often spectacularly beside the point. What on earth was the president of the United States doing, spending several minutes talking about resort fees paid by hotel guests, for example?
Biden devoted 271 words to the Junk Fee Protection Act. Then he disposed of America’s conflict with China in 182 words. Of those, only fifteen—“if China threatens our sovereignty, we will act to protect our country. And we did”—dealt with the balloon incursion last week, a matter so serious it forced the postponement of an official visit to China from our secretary of state.

This was not a serious speech. It was a pretty silly one, in fact. But the only thing people are going to remember is Greene screeching. It used to anger me when people insulted the GOP by adopting the old British term for the Tories—“the stupid party.” Still, better that than the “embarrassing party,” which has the advantage of being at least partly true.

Mr. Podhoretz was way way too kind. "The Insurrectionist Party" is more like it. The heckling was just a continuation of their norm-breaking for the purpose of replacing our Republic with some sort of Orbanist authoritarianism. With a few exceptions, there are two types of Republicans these days 1. Those actively seeking to destroy the Republic. 2. Cowardly selfish enablers of category 1.


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Minder
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08 Feb 2023, 9:04 pm

I have to admit that I'm getting really tired of these "moderate" Republicans lamenting how embarrassed they are to be associated with the GOP.

The GOP's been the party of goons for a pretty long time now. Ever since Trump, the party's largely been fine with embracing the rude, the boorish, and the ill-informed. We've seen this over and over again, most tellingly in the COVID pandemic.

To people like Podhoretz: what did you think was going to happen? If you're actually embarrassed and dismayed by the behavior of the GOP, then leave. Abstain from voting, or vote for a third party if you can't bring yourself to vote Democrat. Follow your conscience. Because all this hand-wringing is tiresome, and has been for a long time. Nobody will believe you're that disturbed unless you take action and do something about it.



funeralxempire
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08 Feb 2023, 9:19 pm

Minder wrote:
I have to admit that I'm getting really tired of these "moderate" Republicans lamenting how embarrassed they are to be associated with the GOP.



Agreed.

Minder wrote:
The GOP's been the party of goons for a pretty long time now. Ever since Trump, the party's largely been fine with embracing the rude, the boorish, and the ill-informed.


I thought the Tea Party movement was when they invited the crazies to take over.


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blazingstar
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08 Feb 2023, 9:23 pm

funeralxempire wrote:

I thought the Tea Party movement was when they invited the crazies to take over.


Agreed.


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08 Feb 2023, 9:25 pm

I am so leery of the fringe right; you can't use dialog with them. First - their point-of-view is the only correct one and then if they don't get their way they'll threaten violence



Pepe
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09 Feb 2023, 12:20 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
John Podhoretz
Quote:
Go ahead, call me—a conservative journalist for more than 40 years and speechwriter to Ronald Reagan—a RINO if you like, but I’ve never been more embarrassed to be associated with the Republican party than in the middle of the State of the Union when House members started openly heckling the president of the United States.

They screamed “liar and “bulls—” in the House chamber when Biden said there were Republican proposals to “sunset” Social Security and Medicare.

In point of fact, Biden is narrowly correct here. Sen. Rick Scott of Florida issued a weird proposal to make all federal legislation sunset after five years. That would include Social Security and Medicare. It was a stupid and ill-considered proposal, in part because it opened up the GOP to exactly the attack Biden staged last night.

And these barbaric House members fell right into Biden’s trap. Rather than shaking their heads, as Speaker Kevin McCarthy did behind Biden, they behaved goonishly. That’s exactly what Biden wanted. In yelling at him like drunken attendees at a WWF match who seem not to know the proceedings are fake, Marjorie Taylor Greene and her hearty band of repellent maniacs provided Biden and the Democrats with visuals and sounds they can use for the next two years to rally their own troops—and independent voters sickened by the bad behavior of politicians generally—against Republican crassness and incivility.

Polling data over the past couple of weeks have made it clear that Biden remains a highly problematic candidate for reelection. He spent most of the time in his State of the Union trying to convince Americans that he has done good things that are making their lives better or are going to make their lives better pretty soon. It’s pretty clear the American people aren’t buying it. Biden’s positive case for himself will only resonate with Democrats who would vote for any Democrat.

But what Biden and his people do seem to understand is that what saved Democrats in 2022 from the chopping block might save them in 2024: the fear among voters who will decide Biden’s fate—and the fate of Democrats running down ballot—that too many Republican politicians are weird, unpleasant, and crazy.

Biden’s speech was risible in parts, and often spectacularly beside the point. What on earth was the president of the United States doing, spending several minutes talking about resort fees paid by hotel guests, for example?
Biden devoted 271 words to the Junk Fee Protection Act. Then he disposed of America’s conflict with China in 182 words. Of those, only fifteen—“if China threatens our sovereignty, we will act to protect our country. And we did”—dealt with the balloon incursion last week, a matter so serious it forced the postponement of an official visit to China from our secretary of state.

This was not a serious speech. It was a pretty silly one, in fact. But the only thing people are going to remember is Greene screeching. It used to anger me when people insulted the GOP by adopting the old British term for the Tories—“the stupid party.” Still, better that than the “embarrassing party,” which has the advantage of being at least partly true.


Well, that is ONE opinion.
My biased right-wing source sees it differently.
But whatever. <shrug>


ASPartOfMe wrote:
Mr. Podhoretz was way way too kind. "The Insurrectionist Party" is more like it. The heckling was just a continuation of their norm-breaking for the purpose of replacing our Republic with some sort of Orbanist authoritarianism. With a few exceptions, there are two types of Republicans these days 1. Those actively seeking to destroy the Republic. 2. Cowardly selfish enablers of category 1.


This is not the balanced approach I have come to expect from you.
"Interesting". 8)



Pepe
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09 Feb 2023, 12:28 am

Minder wrote:
I have to admit that I'm getting really tired of these "moderate" Republicans lamenting how embarrassed they are to be associated with the GOP.

The GOP's been the party of goons for a pretty long time now. Ever since Trump, the party's largely been fine with embracing the rude, the boorish, and the ill-informed. We've seen this over and over again, most tellingly in the COVID pandemic.


Hillary didn't gain any credibility points for calling the Republicans "deplorable".
I am not sure the "goon" label is going to do much better. 8O

Let us gain a bit of objectivity in this progressive-dominated thread.

I find that there are disreputable ppl on either side of the political divide.
I hope you aren't denying this self-evident Truth. 8)



Pepe
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09 Feb 2023, 12:30 am

Aspinator wrote:
I am so leery of the fringe right; you can't use dialog with them. First - their point-of-view is the only correct one and then if they don't get their way they'll threaten violence


This applies to the extremists on the left, also. 8)



Dengashinobi
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09 Feb 2023, 5:31 am

funeralxempire wrote:
I thought the Tea Party movement was when they invited the crazies to take over.


Yes, you can call them that from a really ignorant point of view. Because lowering taxes, reducing government spending and lowering the national debt is really crazy if you are an economic illiterate.



kraftiekortie
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09 Feb 2023, 5:50 am

Some people like Marjorie Taylor Greene believe in the QAnon nonsense. Have we forgotten about this nonsense ?

We need more “moderate” Republicans.

The Republicans today are primarily reactionaries, and offer no solutions.

Podhoretz is a long-time conservative. He believes in civilized discourse, not banana-republic type crap.



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09 Feb 2023, 6:49 am

I think we need fewer Republicans.


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kraftiekortie
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09 Feb 2023, 7:45 am

What we need is more cooperation in Congress, rather than legislators strutting around like peacocks.



JimJohn
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09 Feb 2023, 10:04 am

Apparently the insurrectionists got what they wanted and then turned around and went home. They accomplished nothing other than take some selfies.

Apparently, they didn’t do enough damage to the building to require repairs other than a broken window or two. It wasn’t closed for business. They didn’t have to switch to another building.

They caught no one at the scene of the crime. They relied on selfies and Facebook to catch people.

ANTIFA are insurrectionists by their own definition. They wear masks. I think you can rely on insurrectionists to self label?

I understand you have to befriend people for making such points or at least call them names that end in IST. It is crazy anyway you slice it left or right.



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09 Feb 2023, 10:20 am

Pepe wrote:
Minder wrote:
I have to admit that I'm getting really tired of these "moderate" Republicans lamenting how embarrassed they are to be associated with the GOP.

The GOP's been the party of goons for a pretty long time now. Ever since Trump, the party's largely been fine with embracing the rude, the boorish, and the ill-informed. We've seen this over and over again, most tellingly in the COVID pandemic.


Hillary didn't gain any credibility points for calling the Republicans "deplorable".
I am not sure the "goon" label is going to do much better. 8O
)


I can't stand Hillary, but that's not exactly what she said. She called a portion of Trump supporters "deplorables." Not exactly what a candidate for president should be doing; rather it's far better to reach out to voters to give them a reason to vote for them. That statement, along with calling Bernie supporters "basement dwellers" cost her the election. That kind of arrogance is bound to turn off voters.


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09 Feb 2023, 10:59 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Minder wrote:
I have to admit that I'm getting really tired of these "moderate" Republicans lamenting how embarrassed they are to be associated with the GOP.



Agreed.

Minder wrote:
The GOP's been the party of goons for a pretty long time now. Ever since Trump, the party's largely been fine with embracing the rude, the boorish, and the ill-informed.


I thought the Tea Party movement was when they invited the crazies to take over.


Some say they've been far right since Nixon.

To me, it was when the Tea Party movement started. I wouldn't call Reagan and the Bushes far-right. In fact. they would all be called "socialists" by the MAGAs.


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Tim_Tex
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09 Feb 2023, 11:09 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
Some people like Marjorie Taylor Greene believe in the QAnon nonsense. Have we forgotten about this nonsense ?

We need more “moderate” Republicans.

The Republicans today are primarily reactionaries, and offer no solutions.

Podhoretz is a long-time conservative. He believes in civilized discourse, not banana-republic type crap.


The GOP had a sane candidate in the 2020 primaries. His name was Bill Weld. But outside the Northeast, people like him can't get elected, because they don't play into the white/straight/male/Christian persecution complexes that dominate the Deep South and places like Utah and Idaho.

Where are the Nelson Rockefellers, Bill Welds, Lowell Weickers, and George Patakis in the GOP now?


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