Tone of law talking guys & former prosecutors has changed

Page 1 of 6 [ 86 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

goldfish21
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 19,874
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

13 Mar 2023, 3:45 pm

When it comes to talking about the former guy.

They're no longer blah blah blahing about whether or not they think he'll be indicted. Now the conversations have shifted to whether or not he'll see prison time for one or multiple convictions, with some saying 50/50 chance, others Hoping he sees the inside of a jail cell, and former fixer Michael Cohen figuring that he'll get house arrest - not because he deserves to sit at home and watch Netflix and order DoorDash, but rather because he received daily intelligence briefings during his tenure as potus and there's too high of a security risk of trump blabbing secrets inside a jail where it would be easy to get spies close to him.. Cohen makes a good point when he says trump would sell national secrets in jail for a can of tuna or whatever he wanted & could get on the inside and wouldn't care one bit about hurting national security.. hence his prediction that trumpty dumpty serves his time at home.

Interesting change in tone. They all seem to figure he's not only bound to be hit with multiple indictments in the not so distant future, possibly including state/federal RICO charges, but that he'll receive multiple convictions and then some form of punishment.

Lawd bebe jebuz I hope they're righ! Especially Jamie Raskin - mostly because he thinks trump will end up behind bars. :D

:ketchup chips:


_________________
No :heart: for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.


ASPartOfMe
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Age: 65
Gender: Male
Posts: 31,931
Location: Long Island, New York

13 Mar 2023, 8:37 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
When it comes to talking about the former guy.

They're no longer blah blah blahing about whether or not they think he'll be indicted. Now the conversations have shifted to whether or not he'll see prison time for one or multiple convictions, with some saying 50/50 chance, others Hoping he sees the inside of a jail cell, and former fixer Michael Cohen figuring that he'll get house arrest - not because he deserves to sit at home and watch Netflix and order DoorDash, but rather because he received daily intelligence briefings during his tenure as potus and there's too high of a security risk of trump blabbing secrets inside a jail where it would be easy to get spies close to him.. Cohen makes a good point when he says trump would sell national secrets in jail for a can of tuna or whatever he wanted & could get on the inside and wouldn't care one bit about hurting national security.. hence his prediction that trumpty dumpty serves his time at home.

Interesting change in tone. They all seem to figure he's not only bound to be hit with multiple indictments in the not so distant future, possibly including state/federal RICO charges, but that he'll receive multiple convictions and then some form of punishment.

Lawd bebe jebuz I hope they're righ! Especially Jamie Raskin - mostly because he thinks trump will end up behind bars. :D

:ketchup chips:

If he does not see jail time for whatever reason including death as far as I am concerned he skated. The MAGAs will be more emboldened because they will view it as the ultimate own the libs ordained by God. The Anti Trumpers will try and convince themselves that he will get his just deserts when he is sent to hell. But deep down there will still be doubt and frustration. Also, the percentage of atheists among progressives is higher than the general popular so those anti-Trumpers won't have he is going to hell to console themselves.


_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


DeathFlowerKing
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Sep 2022
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,228
Location: City of Roses

13 Mar 2023, 9:04 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
When it comes to talking about the former guy.

They're no longer blah blah blahing about whether or not they think he'll be indicted. Now the conversations have shifted to whether or not he'll see prison time for one or multiple convictions, with some saying 50/50 chance, others Hoping he sees the inside of a jail cell, and former fixer Michael Cohen figuring that he'll get house arrest - not because he deserves to sit at home and watch Netflix and order DoorDash, but rather because he received daily intelligence briefings during his tenure as potus and there's too high of a security risk of trump blabbing secrets inside a jail where it would be easy to get spies close to him.. Cohen makes a good point when he says trump would sell national secrets in jail for a can of tuna or whatever he wanted & could get on the inside and wouldn't care one bit about hurting national security.. hence his prediction that trumpty dumpty serves his time at home.

Interesting change in tone. They all seem to figure he's not only bound to be hit with multiple indictments in the not so distant future, possibly including state/federal RICO charges, but that he'll receive multiple convictions and then some form of punishment.

Lawd bebe jebuz I hope they're righ! Especially Jamie Raskin - mostly because he thinks trump will end up behind bars. :D

:ketchup chips:

If he does not see jail time for whatever reason including death as far as I am concerned he skated. The MAGAs will be more emboldened because they will view it as the ultimate own the libs ordained by God. The Anti Trumpers will try and convince themselves that he will get his just deserts when he is sent to hell. But deep down there will still be doubt and frustration. Also, the percentage of atheists among progressives is higher than the general popular so those anti-Trumpers won't have he is going to hell to console themselves.


That's pretty much the way this world has always worked. Most monsters on Trump's level always die comfortably in a luxurious palace surrounded by sycophants and there is never any real justice done for the many whose lives they ruined.

Look at tyrants like Mao, Stalin, Castro, Hitler, and Mussolini. Only two out of five of those monsters listed actually faced justice for their crimes (well technically only one, Hitler commited suicide so he died on his terms and faced no real justice).

So... yeah. There is only one true Hell in this world, it's the one we live in now. :evil:



AngelRho
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,362
Location: The Landmass between N.O. and Mobile

17 Mar 2023, 9:35 am

DeathFlowerKing wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
When it comes to talking about the former guy.

They're no longer blah blah blahing about whether or not they think he'll be indicted. Now the conversations have shifted to whether or not he'll see prison time for one or multiple convictions, with some saying 50/50 chance, others Hoping he sees the inside of a jail cell, and former fixer Michael Cohen figuring that he'll get house arrest - not because he deserves to sit at home and watch Netflix and order DoorDash, but rather because he received daily intelligence briefings during his tenure as potus and there's too high of a security risk of trump blabbing secrets inside a jail where it would be easy to get spies close to him.. Cohen makes a good point when he says trump would sell national secrets in jail for a can of tuna or whatever he wanted & could get on the inside and wouldn't care one bit about hurting national security.. hence his prediction that trumpty dumpty serves his time at home.

Interesting change in tone. They all seem to figure he's not only bound to be hit with multiple indictments in the not so distant future, possibly including state/federal RICO charges, but that he'll receive multiple convictions and then some form of punishment.

Lawd bebe jebuz I hope they're righ! Especially Jamie Raskin - mostly because he thinks trump will end up behind bars. :D

:ketchup chips:

If he does not see jail time for whatever reason including death as far as I am concerned he skated. The MAGAs will be more emboldened because they will view it as the ultimate own the libs ordained by God. The Anti Trumpers will try and convince themselves that he will get his just deserts when he is sent to hell. But deep down there will still be doubt and frustration. Also, the percentage of atheists among progressives is higher than the general popular so those anti-Trumpers won't have he is going to hell to console themselves.


That's pretty much the way this world has always worked. Most monsters on Trump's level always die comfortably in a luxurious palace surrounded by sycophants and there is never any real justice done for the many whose lives they ruined.

Look at tyrants like Mao, Stalin, Castro, Hitler, and Mussolini. Only two out of five of those monsters listed actually faced justice for their crimes (well technically only one, Hitler commited suicide so he died on his terms and faced no real justice).

So... yeah. There is only one true Hell in this world, it's the one we live in now. :evil:

Don’t forget that 3 out of those 5 restricted their evil to domestic policy and had enough support among their people to become untouchable. If Japan had stayed out of Manchuria and Hitler out of Poland, there probably wouldn’t be a single Jew to be found in Germany today. Stalin was only able to do what he did AFTER a) Hitler violated the non-aggression treaty with Russia and b) Russia gained the full support of the West for an offensive.

I wouldn’t be opposed to 4 more years of Trump. It won’t happen, though. As far as comparisons to other murderous authoritarians goes, evil in the USA takes the reverse form—it’s opposing groups of people who bully and scapegoat their elected leaders. We all know the Democratic agenda and its evil is no secret. Republican evil? Well, that’s a little more complicated because half or more of them are still pretending to be the good guys and hiding in plain sight. Trump OBVIOUSLY went after Democratic political power as we’d expect any Republican to do. Trump did just fine until he went after RINO’s and weak Republicans.

By comparison, Eric Holder and Obama were in ideological lock step. Eric never had to ask Obama what to do, and Obama always knew Holder had his back like a butt crack. What does Trump’s guy do? Recuses himself the first time there’s any pressure. As soon as the Republican knives were out, Trump publicly turned on them.

If the American people need Trump brought to justice, I’m sure it will happen. They don’t want justice for Jan. 6, though. They want justice for how Trump upended Republican politics and ruined other ineffective politician’s careers. Jan. 6 just happens to be the only thing they believe they can count on to keep Trump from running again.

What you have to remember about Hitler is that he had the love and support of so many Germans. Opponents were sufficiently few in number they could be managed by snitches and rifles. Hitler never would have been brought to justice in the sense that Trump might be. The biggest problem regarding Hitler is that the German people were lock step with Hitler. It would do no good to get rid of Hitler. Hitler was merely a symptom of a larger problem, but he gets all the blame for it. We didn’t need to defeat Hitler—Germany had to be defeated. If we had taken out Hitler, he’d have just been replaced by someone worse, maybe Goering.

America has too many safeguards against something similar happening. Trump was out after 4 years. The great evil we face now is our political parties have positioned themselves to be 2 equal sides to the same coin. They create problems where no problems exist and then compete to see who can come up with a solution they can persuade the people to support. It’s a game to see how long politicians can keep their jobs. They make it look good on camera, like scripted pro wrestling matches, and then go out together for beers at the end of the day like best friends. When someone like Trump threatens that status quo, both parties will unite to get rid of him.

It’s plainly evident in the elections. Nobody wanted Clinton for President, but a Democrat would have to be bat-$#!+ crazy to run against her. Enter Bernie Sanders. Trump won because blue states didn’t love Clinton enough. And Trump lost because those same states that elected him liked Biden better. Republicans love Biden because he’s boring. And I guarantee you if Trump wins the nomination, which Republicans won’t mind so much since they’re lazy, he won’t defeat an incumbent Biden. Republicans will vote for Biden, just like last time, or they’ll just stay home. Heaven help Democrats if Biden doesn’t run again. Republicans have run out of options if they can’t re-elect Trump. But the way I see it, Democrats are in a worse position right now.

For things to improve in America, the Democratic/Republican machine has to go. I don’t mean get rid of the parties. I just mean the scheming to keep the parties so evenly divided. We’ve become a one-party system. It’s just nobody is ready to admit that yet. If you want to see conditions that would allow a Hitleresque regime in this country, we’re on track for it the way things are.

As far as a real authoritarian situation in America goes, the closest we’ve ever been was with Lincoln. We were dangerously close with FDR, and that sounded so many alarm bells we changed our constitution to stop it from ever happening again. Rumors were Obama was set for a third term given so much fanaticism surrounding Obama at the time.

Interestingly, the only consistent balance between the Democratic-Republican faux Party has been the Supreme Court. It’s obvious why Democrats hate overturning Roe. But now Republicans have lost a campaign issue. SCOTUS didn’t ban abortions. So now we have to go state by state to introduce legislation banning abortions…which won’t happen. Or if it rarely does, Democrats have a new can they can kick down the road in the way of winning reelections. If you want to see a Hitler or Stalin in the USA right now, get rid of the court. Congress is ready to give us one.



Honey69
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 29 Jan 2023
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 682
Location: Llareggub

17 Mar 2023, 10:02 am

AngelRho wrote:
We all know the Democratic agenda and its evil is no secret.


Huh? What "evil?" :scratch:


_________________
May you be blessed by YHWH and his Asherah


goldfish21
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 19,874
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

17 Mar 2023, 12:27 pm

AngelRho wrote:
I wouldn’t be opposed to 4 more years of Trump. It won’t happen, though. As far as comparisons to other murderous authoritarians goes, evil in the USA takes the reverse form—it’s opposing groups of people who bully and scapegoat their elected leaders. We all know the Democratic agenda and its evil is no secret. Republican evil? Well, that’s a little more complicated because half or more of them are still pretending to be the good guys and hiding in plain sight. Trump OBVIOUSLY went after Democratic political power as we’d expect any Republican to do. Trump did just fine until he went after RINO’s and weak Republicans.


If the American people need Trump brought to justice, I’m sure it will happen. They don’t want justice for Jan. 6, though. They want justice for how Trump upended Republican politics and ruined other ineffective politician’s careers. Jan. 6 just happens to be the only thing they believe they can count on to keep Trump from running again.


8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O :( :x


_________________
No :heart: for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.


ProfessorJohn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Jun 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 973
Location: Oklahoma

17 Mar 2023, 12:56 pm

AngelRho wrote:
So... yeah. There is only one true Hell in this world, it's the one we live in now. :evil:

Don’t forget that 3 out of those 5 restricted their evil to domestic policy and had enough support among their people to become untouchable. If Japan had stayed out of Manchuria and Hitler out of Poland, there probably wouldn’t be a single Jew to be found in Germany today. Stalin was only able to do what he did AFTER a) Hitler violated the non-aggression treaty with Russia and b) Russia gained the full support of the West for an offensive.

[/quote]

Stalin starved out the Ukraine, had mass executions of other communist party members and most of his generals, and sent people to the gulags years before the non-aggression pact was signed.

Mao sent troops into Korea to battle the UN.



ProfessorJohn
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Jun 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 973
Location: Oklahoma

17 Mar 2023, 1:00 pm

AngelRho wrote:
As far as a real authoritarian situation in America goes, the closest we’ve ever been was with Lincoln. We were dangerously close with FDR, and that sounded so many alarm bells we changed our constitution to stop it from ever happening again.



Wilson came pretty close. Eugene Debs (Socialist candidate) had to run for president in 1920 from prison since Wilson locked him up for speaking out against our involvement in WWI.



Honey69
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 29 Jan 2023
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 682
Location: Llareggub

17 Mar 2023, 1:10 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
They don’t want justice for Jan. 6, though. They want justice for how Trump upended Republican politics and ruined other ineffective politician’s careers. Jan. 6 just happens to be the only thing they believe they can count on to keep Trump from running again.


8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O :( :x


Who are "they?" Sounds like a conspiracy theory-laden post.

There is also the Stormy Daniels affair being brought in New York, plus the election crimes in Georgia.

But, we've already had the example of Eugene V. Debs running for president from prison 100 years ago. But, you may be right. Trump's activities related to the Jan 6 insurrection may be the only crime that keeps Trump from serving in government again. Per the 14th Amendment:

Quote:

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.



A two-thirds vote of each House is a rather high threshold. The Repugs would have to have a major blow-out in the next election.


_________________
May you be blessed by YHWH and his Asherah


AngelRho
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,362
Location: The Landmass between N.O. and Mobile

17 Mar 2023, 9:45 pm

Honey69 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
They don’t want justice for Jan. 6, though. They want justice for how Trump upended Republican politics and ruined other ineffective politician’s careers. Jan. 6 just happens to be the only thing they believe they can count on to keep Trump from running again.


8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O :( :x


Who are "they?" Sounds like a conspiracy theory-laden post.

There is also the Stormy Daniels affair being brought in New York, plus the election crimes in Georgia.

But, we've already had the example of Eugene V. Debs running for president from prison 100 years ago. But, you may be right. Trump's activities related to the Jan 6 insurrection may be the only crime that keeps Trump from serving in government again. Per the 14th Amendment:

Quote:

No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.



A two-thirds vote of each House is a rather high threshold. The Repugs would have to have a major blow-out in the next election.

“They” referring to Republicans who see Trump as a threat. And what conspiracy theory? This has long been out in the open since before Trump hit the primaries. There has been steadfast opposition to Trump within rank and file Republicans. In particular there were career politicians who accepted Trump appointments which effectively removed them from office and subsequently lost their jobs. That changed the party landscape largely for the better. But there’s still a lot of hate and resentment over that. Most of your Never-Trumpers kept their congressional seats and stayed clear of the swamp drain. A few lost re-election campaigns at home.

You don’t have to ask who “they” are. “They” are fairly up front about it.



Honey69
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 29 Jan 2023
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 682
Location: Llareggub

17 Mar 2023, 9:50 pm

AngelRho wrote:
That changed the party landscape largely for the better.


"Better?" All these wacko nutjobs? How are they any "better?"


_________________
May you be blessed by YHWH and his Asherah


AngelRho
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 9,362
Location: The Landmass between N.O. and Mobile

17 Mar 2023, 9:58 pm

ProfessorJohn wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
So... yeah. There is only one true Hell in this world, it's the one we live in now. :evil:

Don’t forget that 3 out of those 5 restricted their evil to domestic policy and had enough support among their people to become untouchable. If Japan had stayed out of Manchuria and Hitler out of Poland, there probably wouldn’t be a single Jew to be found in Germany today. Stalin was only able to do what he did AFTER a) Hitler violated the non-aggression treaty with Russia and b) Russia gained the full support of the West for an offensive.



Stalin starved out the Ukraine, had mass executions of other communist party members and most of his generals, and sent people to the gulags years before the non-aggression pact was signed.

Mao sent troops into Korea to battle the UN.[/quote]
Holodomor was a domestic issue since Ukraine and other communist states were Soviet satellites. Party purges were also domestics matters. Mao sending troops to aid the Norks was entirely self-serving—Korea was a useful to China as a buffer zone against the West. Plus, the Norks weren’t about to look a gift horse in the mouth.

It’s always bad form to get involved in another nation’s problems. Mao recognized the stupidity of invading South Korea. Had a Westernized, unified Korea not been seen as a potential threat to communist China, Mao wouldn’t have gotten involved. The USA wouldn’t have been involved in Europe had we not gotten dragged into the wars. Hitler could have gotten away with exterminating Jews had he not gotten greedy with carving up Poland.



goldfish21
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Feb 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 19,874
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada

18 Mar 2023, 2:11 am

Honey69 wrote:
AngelRho wrote:
That changed the party landscape largely for the better.


"Better?" All these wacko nutjobs? How are they any "better?"

:heart: :heart: :heart:


_________________
No :heart: for supporting trump. Because doing so is deplorable.


Dengashinobi
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Dec 2022
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 598

18 Mar 2023, 2:48 am

I don't think that going after opposition leaders is a good sign for democracy. Especially if you consider that also democrat leaders have been involved in recent scandals with government secrets like puppet Joe's degenerate son's laptop and the Biden classified ducuments scandal from his vice presidency, Hillary Clinton's server scandal. Nobody gave a damn for those, the media didn't care, and as good liberal NPC's you are, you didn't care as well.



Fnord
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2008
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Posts: 58,016
Location: Stendec

18 Mar 2023, 3:15 am

Dengashinobi wrote:
I don't think that going after opposition leaders is a good sign for democracy. . .
How about going after criminals no matter which party they belong to?

The only significant difference between the American government and the Mafia is that we get to elect our government.


_________________
 
• Veritas Illuminata • Semper Illuminans • Custodiamus Veritas •
• Et Serviunt Qui Non Videntur •


Dengashinobi
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Dec 2022
Age: 33
Gender: Male
Posts: 598

18 Mar 2023, 3:47 am

Fnord wrote:
Dengashinobi wrote:
I don't think that going after opposition leaders is a good sign for democracy. . .
How about going after cri8minals no matter which party they belong to?

The only significant difference between the American government and the Mafia is that we get to elect our government.


I agree, but utilizing the law selectively is worse than not utilizing it at all.