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Henriksson
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21 Sep 2009, 5:25 am

I think I might have made a bit of an overanalysis on the essay I wrote today. What do you think?

“Write a short text, no more than 500 words about: What characteristics do you think the perfect hero should have? Describe your hero, what does he/she do, what characteristics do a person need to have in order to be called a hero. Also discuss is there a difference between being a hero and being brave? Give examples from the article you have read, films you have seen and novels you have read.”

So, what is this entire hero thing all about, anyway? Well, I looked up ‘brave’ in the dictionary, and I got the impression that being brave is about undergoing, challenging, and/or daring something. However, there is so much more about a word than what you can find in a dictionary. In fact, semantics is quite a common item for discussion.

I’ve been thinking about one thing in particular about the definition of bravery. If, for example, a conscripted soldier is doing what is expected of him, like what we would normally accept as an act of bravery, such as being under enemy fire, would it still count as being a hero? The soldier did, after all, his duty and nothing less. To challenge what is expected of him to do, to refuse to participate in the war, isn’t that being brave too?

Due to this, I am obliged to believe that being a hero isn’t only about acts of bravery, but also about the motivation that the hero has. Of course, this is all assuming that bravery and heroism is linked to each other. Is it? I think it’s commonly accepted that there is a correlation, at least, so I’m going to assume that it is.

I don’t really think that there is such a thing as a perfect hero, because it begs the question of how one would define perfection. It seems as though the question demands that I have an opinion about what my ‘perfect’ hero is, though I’m kind of uncertain I have. If I may be as simplistic and generalising as possible, and further assuming that bravery and heroism have a correlation with each other, which I elaborated on in the above paragraph, I’m going to say that the perfect hero fits the definition of bravery perfectly.

Hmm, now I think I get it. If I am to give an actual example, let’s go back to the article I provided [And by article I mean this.]. It’s a bit like the soldier I talked about. The child starts at a new school. It’s expected of him to accept this. Is it not brave to challenge this, to refuse to do it, to brave the status quo? By the definition of bravery, it would be. But the natural inclinations of the child might compel him to skip school and so on, so perhaps it’s also brave to deal with his fears about the new school, and do what is expected of him to do, natural inclinations be damned? That, too, would fit the definition of bravery. So, he would be a hero no matter what he does? I don’t think so, I think a hero would be to be brave, but going with what you are expected of you to do. So the child, or the soldier, would be a hero if they went to school, or to war, but be merely brave if they tried to avoid the whole thing.


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Silvervarg
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21 Sep 2009, 6:00 am

I think the key difference is motivation. Bravery is to challange ones fears, being a hero is to challange ones fears for the sake of others.

Both your examples lacks motivation, why would they refuse to do what's expected of them? If they refuse out of fear, no obviously they are not to be considered brave, but if they do it out of personal belifs, it's a different situation.


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Henriksson
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21 Sep 2009, 6:04 am

Silvervarg wrote:
I think the key difference is motivation. Bravery is to challange ones fears, being a hero is to challange ones fears for the sake of others.

Both your examples lacks motivation, why would they refuse to do what's expected of them? If they refuse out of fear, no obviously they are not to be considered brave, but if they do it out of personal belifs, it's a different situation.

Wouldn't they do what's expected of them out of fear, too, if personal beliefs is out of the question?


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ruveyn
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21 Sep 2009, 7:17 am

There are no Perfect Heroes nor can there be.

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sartresue
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21 Sep 2009, 9:00 am

Heroics and bravery topic

I have always thought that heroics was a more spontaneous behaviour like the war heroics that merit medals, though many consider someone who speaks regularly against injustice as a hero.

I think the term hero is more of a label imposed from without rather than a self serving term.

There may be persons who even refrain from referring to their actions as courageous out of modesty, but in a autobiography mention it.

In news stories, I have seen very few refuse awards and praise for deeds considered by others to be "brave, courageous and heroic." They might refer to themselves and (or their actions) as good samaritans, activists, "at the right place at the right time", or even part of the job/duty.

At any rate, I do think good role models and concerned citizens are the better options, though this is not exactly the subject of your thread, Henriksson.


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zer0netgain
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21 Sep 2009, 10:06 am

Bravery is akin to courage.

Courage is facing your fears rather than letting your fears control you.

Being a "hero" is harder to define. It's a label, often assigned by society. Many "heroes" can be cowards at heart but in a moment did something very brave (or stupid...acting without thinking about the likely consequences first).

Do I consider police officers brave or heroic? Not really. These people CHOSE to be in those professions for many personal reasons. Are they "brave?" Often, yes. Are they "heroes?" Not necessarily.

I suppose the boundary of "heroic" can be defined as "self-sacrifice." If one puts nothing at risk to help someone, is it really heroic? If someone puts their own life at risk because they act without thinking it may be a heroic act, but is that person consistently "heroic?"

My guess is that a "hero" is someone who consistently acts with no regard for their own well-being. They always put the needs of another before their own. It's not a moment of rash action where self-preservation is ignored to save another. It's a conscious choice to constantly endanger oneself for the good of another person just because they want to help them. That last bit is important because people with suicidal motives can do heroic acts because they secretly yearn to die but don't want to exit the world with the image of being a coward, so they put themselves in harm's way hoping to die in the attempt and be remembered for what they did and not why they really sought out such peril.



ruveyn
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21 Sep 2009, 12:49 pm

We can reasonably expect people will keep their fear in check and keep their heads in a crisis. That is courage. What we cannot reasonably expect is heroism. Few are capable of it and then only under extreme conditions.

Read -If- by Rudyard Kipling for a hint.

See: http://www.kipling.org.uk/poems_if.htm

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pakled
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21 Sep 2009, 3:47 pm

I always figured heroism was just dumb luck that paid off...;)



ruveyn
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21 Sep 2009, 4:07 pm

pakled wrote:
I always figured heroism was just dumb luck that paid off...;)


sometimes it is.

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Silvervarg
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21 Sep 2009, 4:50 pm

Henriksson wrote:
Silvervarg wrote:
I think the key difference is motivation. Bravery is to challange ones fears, being a hero is to challange ones fears for the sake of others.

Both your examples lacks motivation, why would they refuse to do what's expected of them? If they refuse out of fear, no obviously they are not to be considered brave, but if they do it out of personal belifs, it's a different situation.

Wouldn't they do what's expected of them out of fear, too, if personal beliefs is out of the question?

*Hehe* That is a possibility, but it's more common for people to back out of doing things out of fear. ;)
My point was that you never explained why they would refuse/do what's expected. Because you could do either and be brave, or not do it out of fear. That's why motivation is needed, if we don't know why they did it we can't tell if it's bravery or cowardness. ;)


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claire-333
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21 Sep 2009, 6:05 pm

I see my thoughts have been spoken by others, so I will agree with sartresue in heroics being spontaneous acts, without thought or motivation. It makes me think of some saying I have heard...The true character of a man can be measured by his reflexive response...or something like that...

I also agree with Zer0netgain and bravery meaning facing fears.



Awesomelyglorious
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21 Sep 2009, 10:02 pm

Being a hero is subjective. A hero can be taken as a person that exemplifies a set of values, and these values are usually community values to some extent, but I don't think a hero has to be excessively brave so much as a hero has to be functional enough to exemplify some desired trait.



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21 Sep 2009, 10:21 pm

Being a hero means following your conscience no matter what.

There is no issue of fear with heroics as the hero knows what [s]he is doing and knows it is right. A hero does not feel fear, does not act in the face of fear; the hero breathes easy, the hands are steady, the heart-rate is not elevated.

Fear for what? Life is nothing, if lost it is no loss at all, it was free, for nothing. The will is everything, and it is good.



techstepgenr8tion
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21 Sep 2009, 10:31 pm

To give another probably somewhat run-of-the-mill definition but one I haven't seen so far; a person who's been honed by life in certain ways, perhaps has lead a life of more depth than social success (strange enough most war heroes even are like that - great leaders in crisis, camped out in the corner during the good times watching the world pass them by). Courage is pretty standard - its the ability to do what needs to be done at sacrifice to yourself, especially when your able to do it for that purpose only and the glory doesn't even factor in.

A true hero (not to be confused with John Ralston Saul's 'rational hero' of the post-enlightenment world) is someone who is able to be in the right place at the right time who posesses clarity over a situation that no one else seems to be able to grasp on their own and on a larger level is able to organize people for positive action (though yes, that can be scary depending), or more on the individual level you may have someone like a platoon leader who is able to pull a maneuver in battle - outgunned, overmanned, stuck in a terrible situation - that would make Sun Tzu want to shake his hand; at least that's a common scenario where courage and heroism (ie. competence in leadership) could intersect.

The downside of the existence of the 'hero' at a specific current time, when people are looking for a human savior its a sign that things are so horrendously f'd up in society that everyone's at a breaking point. Then, all kinds of sacrifices are given to bring us to exactly where we're at right now - fluffiness and vanity.



ruveyn
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22 Sep 2009, 5:53 am

Vana wrote:
Being a hero means following your conscience no matter what.



Some psychopaths do that. Are they heroes?

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Silvervarg
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22 Sep 2009, 6:09 am

Vana wrote:
There is no issue of fear with heroics as the hero knows what [s]he is doing and knows it is right. A hero does not feel fear, does not act in the face of fear; the hero breathes easy, the hands are steady, the heart-rate is not elevated.

In that case either he/she has a severe brain damage, or he/she is never in any dangerous situations. First one possibly a hero, second one, hardly one. ;)


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