Michael Wiener(AKA Michael Savage) says autism is a fraud

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legendoftheselkie
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24 Jul 2008, 3:43 pm

"AKA"? Which came first, the savage or the wiener? Interesting that he refers to us as "putzes". Mr. Savage Wiener, although it"s true there were times when, as a child, I acted like a little savage- at least I outgrew it.



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24 Jul 2008, 5:28 pm

You'd have to have heard the radio episode that this interview is based upon to get the full context of it. I don't usually listen to Michael Savage, though when I heard him talking about autism, it got my attention. I think his remarks quoted in this interview are exaggerative and overbearing, though you'd have to have heard the earlier part of the program to understand where those comments are coming from. It's not autism he finds to be the fraud; it's the epidemic.

In his program he acknowledged that he believed that autism is a real problem, though he doesn't believe it could possibly be 1 out of 150 kids. Like he said in the program, an early diagnostic attempt could be dangerous because the tests are not fully reliable (the reason why they don't do 18-24 months diagnoses in England).

I remember in AP English in high school, we watched a psychology video of 12 young men, and were divided into 2 categories; prison inmates, and prison guards. They were placed in a prison facility in their appropriate places, and left to act out their roles. At first it was all fun, but for some reason they started taking the roles seriously. The "prisoners" really felt like prisoners, and the "prison guards" really felt like prison guards, and the "prison guards" actually began to get a bit abusive to the "prisoners." They cut the experiment short because the treatment and conditions of the participants were getting worse. If you get diagnosed with autism at a young age, and your parents tell you you're autistic, you're going to live autistic whether or not you really are. For some psychological reason, people take seriously the roles they are assigned.

Reminds me, ever seen the episode of House where they're on a plane, and House tells everyone that if their left hand starts trembling, they have a disease from which they'll die? Everyone's left hands started trembling :)

Savage also talked about there being second motives to diagnosing kids with autism, because professionals do have the potential to make money off the kids. The schools do. One caller talked about how she went to have her son diagnosed, and he came up as negative. However, the school was trying to push her to let him be diagnosed with autism. That way they could put him through the special ed classes and reap the benefits.

He also told a story about a friend who was diagnosed with autism just because he had a nervous tic, nothing else as far as I can see. He did not tell his son that he "had autism," and the child outgrew the tic.

I think he is right to some extent that the epidemic may be false because this has happened before. I remember our youth pastor doing a little experiment; he asked how many of the kids have been diagnosed with ADD, and about half the hands in the room shot up. In the back of my mind I was thinking, "How could all these kids possibly have a neural disorder that inhibits their attention span?" 150 out of 300 kids is a bit much. I was diagnosed with ADD (this was before AS was known in the US, and my parents thought perhaps I was autistic), they put me on the medicine, I wasn't myself, they took me off, I was normal, and I think the main reason I couldn't pay attention in school at times was simply because I was bored, or I didn't understand it and felt too lost to catch up. When it comes to anything involving music though, my attention never strays, and I remember anything/everything said concerning the subject.

Savage isn't unfamiliar with mental disorder either; he had a brother who was severely disabled and never spoke a word in his life, and died in his 20's in a mental institution, so it's not as if he's clueless to the world of neurosis. If anyone doesn't want to listen to him because he's too mean, I don't really blame them because he is, though I think he was right about this.

I don't have an official diagnosis, but I match the criteria for AS as far as I can tell. Perhaps social situations are more dififcult for me (they've always been difficult even before I found out about AS), I do find that I can get around it to some extent. I can still socialize, even if not as well. Some days I can't get a word in on a conversation and it frustrates me badly, but other times I find people who are genuinely interested in what I have to say or offer, and I am with them. And I do understand that some people legitimately are not so neurologically fortunate, though ever since learning about these things I wondered if some of it was simply natural and how much was just bad habits. I guess that's up to each person to be honest with himself about.



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24 Jul 2008, 6:33 pm

Haliphron wrote:
Conservative Christianity( religious conservativism) is essentially using religion to legitimize the status quo. There are black christian conservatives who are believe that being subservient to white establishment will get them into heaven. You see, christianity is all about being submissive, and I have no doubt there are plenty of submissive aspies out there willing to compromise their own interests for the "good of society" :roll: . The elite will sometimes make exceptions for certain individuals in an oppressed minority group to counter minority coalitons.

Well, ok? The status quo doesn't know and doesn't care that we exist. Frankly, given that the religion has existed for a long time, the status quo and the traditional interpretations of the religion in the region are not necessarily that far off.

Yes, Christianity is submissive, however, Christians in a sense serve their interests by serving their God.

Umm... the major issue is that nobody knows or cares about our existence, so there is no "exception made". There are individuals who act and some who are successful.

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While most of my beliefs and ideas correspond with liberalism, there is one thing which sets me apart from them and that is my worldview. Liberals tend to have a positive view of the world and believe strongly(despite mounting contradictory evidence)that people are basically 'good' and that they deserve to be free cos they can be counted on to treat others fairly.

I assume you mean US liberalism, and thus the left. "Liberal" really is a terrible term due to it's meanings and historical usage.
Quote:
I however, believe that people are basically *bad* and that they need to be controlled. The US Constitution has some very useful clauses against tyranny of the majority which are designed to protect the elite and minorities from the masses.

I believe the terms "good" and "bad" are poorly defined. All that exists is self-interest.

Quote:
I have found tha in my adult life Ive been caught between a rock and a hard place: the masses harass me for not conforming to their social norms and so I have sought refuge among the elite........only to have them slam the door in my face because they thing Im not *good enough* since Im socially clumsy and so the look down upon me as being inferior Evil or Very Mad .So snake321, I agree with your last paragraph and what needs to be done is for us to get (legally)ORGANIZED!

Well, the issue is that you aren't charming, few people with AS are. There is no rock or hard place at all, only rejection. I doubt that legal organization would do much anyway.



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24 Jul 2008, 8:40 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Well, the issue is that you aren't charming, few people with AS are.

:lol:

Being *charming* is only the icing on the cake! If you wanna be part of the liberal social elite you gotta play the GAME :wink: .

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
There is no rock or hard place at all, only rejection.

:roll:

NOTHING could be further from the truth my friend. In addition to rejection there is also Harassment. I have lived in 2 small towns and I am plenty familiar with how the Masses behave. So yes there is such a place-having to deal with rejection, harassment, or BOTH. So I take it the point of your post is the same old hard-nosed 90s BS deal with it! no?



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24 Jul 2008, 8:48 pm

Haliphron wrote:
:lol:

Being *charming* is only the icing on the cake! If you wanna be part of the liberal social elite you gotta play the GAME :wink: .

I don't know what game you speak of. Charm seems like the major thing that separates AS from the rest.

Quote:
:roll:

NOTHING could be further from the truth my friend. In addition to rejection there is also Harassment. I have lived in 2 small towns and I am plenty familiar with how the Masses behave. So yes there is such a place-having to deal with rejection, harassment, or BOTH. So I take it the point of your post is the same old hard-nosed 90s BS deal with it! no?

Harassment is merely a stronger measure of that same terrible impulse.

What else can I tell you to do? You are not going to change the nature of people, you hardly have any power to change the nature of institutions, and even if you could do the latter, utopia would always evade you.



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24 Jul 2008, 9:53 pm

The Political Compass Test

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Take the test and find out!

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Fred2670
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25 Jul 2008, 4:01 am

skafather84 wrote:
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good stuff


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25 Jul 2008, 5:19 am

And David Icke beliefs all politicians are reptilian-aliens in disguise- what of it?


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25 Jul 2008, 7:30 am

PsychonautChaos wrote:
And David Icke beliefs all politicians are reptilian-aliens in disguise- what of it?

David Icke's thoughts on the matter sound reasonable to me.



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25 Jul 2008, 11:10 am

Fred2670 wrote:
skafather84 wrote:
Image


good stuff



lenny bruce's life is a good study in the first amendment and censorship.



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25 Jul 2008, 11:48 am

Weiner roast topic

The Savage Weiner is a whiner. If it were not for liberalism, Mikey's ideas would not have come crawling out of his ass. The smell is disgusting, but then, he is human. :lol:

Perhaps he no longer takes herbs to fight dementia. :P


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29 Jul 2008, 10:56 am

your wrong about Conservatism standing for the status quo. Conservatism is about standing up for eternal principals, when those prinicipals are violated real conservatives are supposed to stand up.



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29 Jul 2008, 12:09 pm

nightbender wrote:
your wrong about Conservatism standing for the status quo. Conservatism is about standing up for eternal principals, when those prinicipals are violated real conservatives are supposed to stand up.


In some cases, you might be right - 'conservative' can mean many things. And the principles a particular conservative group champions are not always eternal. Ideas of marriage have changed. Ideas about civil rights and the dignity of all human beings have changed.



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29 Jul 2008, 12:17 pm

ideas dont change people do



monty
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29 Jul 2008, 12:38 pm

nightbender wrote:
ideas dont change people do


Poppycock. One of the ideas that the US was founded on ("... all men are created equal... ") has changed dramatically over time. Originally, it meant white males who owned property. Over time, that idea was expanded to include Negroes, American Indians, and women.



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29 Jul 2008, 12:45 pm

Fred2670 wrote:
I dont know who he is but I would like to take this opportunity to tell you all that I beat autism. One day I just "snapped out of it". I feel mucH BETTER AND YOU CAN TOO SO STOP FEELING SO DAMN SORRY FOR YOURSELF AND SNAP OUT OF IT ALREADY. i EXPLAINED aSPERGERS ONE TIME TO A LADY WHO WAS WAITING IN LINE, AND SHE SAID, "THOSE KIND OF PEOPLE ARE JUST NERDS".


Didn't snap out of incoherence, the inability to notice a caps lock on, or the inability to edit one's post when it is noticed that the caps lock is on. Autism may have been beaten, but below mean intellect remains a hurdle, eh?


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