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cyberdad
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17 Jul 2024, 4:55 pm

naturalplastic wrote:

the plot thickens. Still, Crook's motives remain elusive.



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17 Jul 2024, 5:33 pm

cyberdad wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:

the plot thickens. Still, Crook's motives remain elusive.


I wish this video could be seen by everyone. But unfortunately, many of Trump's supporters would choose not to believe it, just the same.


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17 Jul 2024, 5:41 pm

Ok, so more insight into Crooks.
https://www.news.com.au/world/north-ame ... 029823c133

He hated politicians and was anti-trump in 2016. Confusingly, he had lots of friends but they noted a red flag whenever the topic of politics was bought up.



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17 Jul 2024, 5:53 pm


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17 Jul 2024, 9:45 pm

Bestiola wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
yet another sad misfit man gone postal, in our ableist culture that produces so many of them.


Yeah, the dude got his associate's degree in engineering from a local community college with high honours in May, and was planning to attend uni this autumn (Robert Morris University) yet wasted his life (and the guy he killed) on Donald Trump. What a waste of potential. :?

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/live-up ... =111974110


Too weird, if these are the facts, what , would cause him to suddenly throw away all his work..? schooling ?
Starting to sound like some sort of brain washed. manchurian candidate .. ..if we go down the condpirascy rabbit hole ?


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17 Jul 2024, 10:55 pm

FINALLY somebody brought that up :star:



cyberdad
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18 Jul 2024, 12:37 am

Jakki wrote:
Starting to sound like some sort of brain washed. manchurian candidate .. ..if we go down the condpirascy rabbit hole ?


He may be a Manchurian candidate, or sign that nihilism is becoming a thing in some young men who don't care.



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18 Jul 2024, 7:28 am

Isn't it possible he wanted to start a gun debate/war just before the election to rile up the NRA?


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18 Jul 2024, 8:55 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Isn't it possible he wanted to start a gun debate/war just before the election to rile up the NRA?


Thats a big supposition that an person with enough smarts to build two remote control bombs found in his car also.
Besides his use of a AR 15 rifle . May or Maynot cause one to think he connected those dots .....but if we go
the Long way around .... part of this entire show ..was to show that those high capacity magazine fed weapons.
Being the one that the shooter used are very bad . Might be preprogramned effort for Trump to appear to have an excuse to try to remove the 2 nd amendment..( crazy thought) , What if he really wanted to have dictatorship level of control,he might want to disarm the public .? So much harder to rebel against his dictatorship, uf that time ever came ? Seems the Founding Fathers had anticipated this as a possible situation. by adding the US second amendment law.
But I am no constitutional scholar .. :roll:


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18 Jul 2024, 9:18 am


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18 Jul 2024, 3:42 pm

Secret Service criticized for how long it took to get Trump offstage

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In the days after a gunman nearly killed former President Donald Trump, scrutiny of the Secret Service has focused on the failure to secure the rooftop where the shooter took up a sniper position.

But what happened after a bullet nicked Trump’s ear was also galling, according to former Secret Service agents and experts in protecting prominent figures. While Trump’s detail performed well in quickly converging on him when the bullets began flying, they say, the agents’ actions in the immediate aftermath were contrary to the most basic protocols — and they put Trump’s life at unnecessary risk.

These experts fault the Secret Service detail for failing to adequately shield him and rush him off the stage to safety. Some suggested that the agents were too deferential as he asked to put on his shoes and paused to pump his fist in the air. If a second gunman had been at the rally, experts noted, he could have shot Trump.

“They stayed on that stage for over a minute,” said Richard Aitch, a U.K. close protection expert and former member of the Royal Military Police. “What on Earth were they doing? It was shocking.”

Aitch noted that the agents were trying to cover Trump with their bodies but said that would be ineffective against rifle bullets.

“The moment you know you are getting incoming rounds, you grab hold on to that boss and you throw him into a car and you get out of there as quickly as you can with the maximum amount of aggression,” he said.

Chris Story, a consultant who has worked for 25 years in close protection, including for the State Department, said that as for what actually happened when Trump was shot, “I’ve seen sixth graders do better rugby scrums than the protective formation they used.”

“They did a really good job in covering, but after that, there was no movement,” he said.

An official briefed on the Secret Service response told NBC News that the agents were told in their earpieces that the threat had been mitigated, which is consistent with what can be heard on video, with agents shouting “shooter down” and “we’re good.”

But experts say that the agents had no way of knowing there were not multiple shooters and that their training dictates that they should act as if there are.

Some former Secret Service agents have defended the response.

Paul Eckloff — who served in the agency for 22 years, including as assistant special agent in charge for the presidential protective division under Trump and President Barack Obama — praised how the agents rushed to Trump.

“What you saw ... was muscle memory,” he said. “That’s why the agents stormed the stage and collapsed onto the former president. It’s called an attack on a principal. They are practiced over and over and over and over again at the training facility for this specific scenario.”

In a post on LinkedIn responding to Story’s criticisms, Eckloff wrote, “Calling the response of the agents and officers on the ground as anything but well executed in the seconds they were accomplished is disingenuous at best, and dangerous at worst.”

Eckloff cited an axiom about tactical environments: “slow is smooth and smooth is fast.” He said there can be good reasons to pause, such as allowing additional agents to clear and secure the route to the vehicle.

Anthony Cangelosi, a former Secret Service agent who worked on protective details for presidential candidates, including John Kerry in 2004, also defended the agents.

“Was it a textbook response? It absolutely wasn’t,” said Cangelosi, an adjunct professor at John Jay College for Criminal Justice in New York. “But how many agents in the history of the Secret Service have actually been in that scenario? We’re talking a decimal of a percentage.”

Some of the experts cited the difference between how agents behaved after Trump was shot and how they acted after bullets struck President Ronald Reagan in 1981. Those agents were praised for their lightning response in shoving Reagan into a limousine as others rushed the shooter.

“If a protectee is being attacked, you get them off the point, even if that means you literally take them off their feet,” a former agent told NBC News. “No matter what they’re saying, no matter the injury, you get them off the point.”

The former agents and experts acknowledged that the agents acted bravely in putting themselves in the line of fire. But they are puzzled by the failure to follow their training after that, and some said they believe there is a likely explanation: that Trump’s Secret Service detail may be too close to him personally and accustomed to deferring to his wishes and commands.

“I’ve heard it and I’ve seen it firsthand — Trump is very chummy with his USSS detail,” said a former law enforcement official familiar with the Trump detail. “A lot of them are very ideologically aligned with him. They aren’t shy about it — they basically agree with Trump and with his worldview.”

Trump’s son Eric appeared to confirm a close relationship with agents in an interview Tuesday with MSNBC’s Katy Tur.

“I know all those agents onstage, and they’re the greatest people ever,” he said. “I know those people intimately. I know their family.”

There is another reason agents may have been hesitant. Trump is also known as being among “the most difficult protectees” in part because of his and his staff’s questioning of some protection protocols, according to two former agents.

“When you train, you practice literally picking them up, covering them, getting them to the Beast,” meaning the presidential limousine, one of them said.

“Every second counts,” the former agent added. “You do whatever it takes — there is no discussion, no pausing, no waiting. It does not matter what the protectee says or wants.”

The Secret Service spokesperson declined to comment. “We don’t talk about protectees; it would jeopardize USSS’ ability to do our job.”

Former Secret Service agent Rich Staropoli said he has heard another line of criticism in the last few days — that some of the agents on the detail were too short to properly protect a 6-foot-3 man.

“Even though those agents did an incredibly brave thing jumping on top of him, once he stood up, he was exposed again to a known shooter mid-chest up," Staropoli said. "You’ve left him completely uncovered ... because your agents simply aren’t tall enough to provide the level of physical protection that was needed at that moment.”


The head of the Secret Service said agents did not go on the roof because it is sloped. If you grow up in the suburbs you see men going up on thier sloped roofs to clean out leaves from their gutters all the time. Why does Cheatle still have a job?


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cyberdad
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18 Jul 2024, 5:41 pm

Young dude is smarter than the average shooter. He was using encrypted communications apps authorities have yet to penetrate, according to the FBI.

Instead of the usual things you find on a 20 yr old's phone like porn or social media, Crooks searches included major depressive disorder. He also was searching images of Biden, trump, Attorney General Merrick B Garland and a British royal family member, and looked up the dates of Trump's public appearances.

Political media outlet The Hill reported Crooks visited the rally site for 20-30 minutes on July 7. He also reportedly visited the site again on the morning of the shooting, which happened in the evening.

On that day he also stopped at a gun store in his hometown and purchased 50 rounds of ammunition, according to a joint FBI and Homeland Security bulletin. Two homemade bombs were found in his car, and a third was found in his home. The bulletin noted "multiple packages, including some marked as possibly containing hazardous material" had been delivered to the home in the previous months.

Relatives such as his uncle claimed not to have been in contact with the family since 2019. He does have a brother, eventually something will be revealed.



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18 Jul 2024, 5:45 pm

Crooks seemed to have a bright future, said two people who knew him at the Community College of Allegheny County, where he graduated in May with a two-year associate’s degree in engineering.

One college instructor told Reuters that she had gone back through his assignments this week, bewildered that the conscientious student who distinguished himself by going “above and beyond” could have turned murderous.

The instructor, who declined to be identified, said his homework responses were thoughtful and his emails polite. He excelled at an assignment to redesign a toy for people with disabilities. “He did a chess set for the blind. He 3D-printed it. He put the Braille on it. He talked to experts in the field,” she recalled. “He really took a lot of care.”

Most recently, he worked as a dietary aide at a nursing home, where he “performed his job without concern,” the centre said. The job was down the street from his home in Bethel Park, a middle-class suburb of Pittsburgh, where he had lived in a modest brick home with his parents and older sister.

Former high-school classmate Max Rich said Crooks was shy and “never seemed like the type” to commit such violence. He left virtually no digital footprint. He spent time on Discord, a gaming platform, but the company said it found “no evidence that it was used to plan this incident, promote violence, or discuss his political views”.
https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-amer ... 5jur9.html

Very mysterious? He seems like a really nice, studious person.



Last edited by cyberdad on 18 Jul 2024, 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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18 Jul 2024, 5:46 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
The head of the Secret Service said agents did not go on the roof because it is sloped. If you grow up in the suburbs you see men going up on thier sloped roofs to clean out leaves from their gutters all the time. Why does Cheatle still have a job?



I've done that and I'm a woman.


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19 Jul 2024, 12:29 am

Jakki wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Isn't it possible he wanted to start a gun debate/war just before the election to rile up the NRA?


Thats a big supposition that an person with enough smarts to build two remote control bombs found in his car also.
Besides his use of a AR 15 rifle . May or Maynot cause one to think he connected those dots .....but if we go
the Long way around .... part of this entire show ..was to show that those high capacity magazine fed weapons.
Being the one that the shooter used are very bad . Might be preprogramned effort for Trump to appear to have an excuse to try to remove the 2 nd amendment..( crazy thought) , What if he really wanted to have dictatorship level of control,he might want to disarm the public .? So much harder to rebel against his dictatorship, uf that time ever came ? Seems the Founding Fathers had anticipated this as a possible situation. by adding the US second amendment law.
But I am no constitutional scholar .. :roll:

Making bombs isn't hard. Making ones that go off when you want it, not too soon or too late. Also doing so without the FBI being tipped off.



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19 Jul 2024, 1:41 am

MatchboxVagabond wrote:
Making bombs isn't hard.


Dude! you just got logged on the FBI database