Board index › General Discussion › News and Current Events

Borris Johnson and Tories loose commons majority

Page 3 of 7 [ 105 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

Previous topic | Next topic

JohnPowell
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2016
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,806
Location: Palestine

05 Sep 2019, 4:14 am

vermontsavant wrote:
JohnPowell wrote:
It's not about 'no deal brexit'. It is purely to stop us leaving the EU.
Yes and no.In the short term Corbyn wants to stop the disaster of leaving the EU on 11-31 without a deal in place because that is an imediate threat.
In the long run your right,Corbyn's goal is to stop brexit all together but first he needs to stall for time so he can make plans to achieve his ultimate goal of a new referendum

The way things are going for Johnson,Corbyn could be PM soon and may get his way.


Corbyn has been against the EU his whole career, he's saying and doing stuff he doesn't believe in. MP's voted to trigger Article 50 which meant we would leave on the 29th of Match regardless. So parliament is now holding the country to ransom. It's a national disgrace.


_________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"


Trueno
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2017
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,788
Location: UK

05 Sep 2019, 4:42 am

^^^ correct. Corbyn is anti-EU. Ironically, I don't think Boris is particularly anti-EU... he just takes whatever stance he thinks will further Boris.


_________________
Steve J

Unkind tongue, right ill hast thou me rendered
For such desert to do me wreak and shame


vermontsavant
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 7 Dec 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,110
Location: Left WP forever

05 Sep 2019, 5:23 am

ASS-P wrote:
...I did not know that a party could kick someone out in Parliament simply for going against the leader's desired vote! 8O. Obviously they can. Can a party not in Downing Street - Labour, etc. - do that. too?
Especially given thst there may be a General Election quite soon...could someone who was deselected/lost the whip stand a chance running in their home arrs (posting/district) as an independent?
Two really old-guard Tories, Nicolas Soames and Kenneth Clarke. who'vee been in Parliament forever (and are pretty well-connected and, let's face it, rich. I'm sure), and I assume win their local elections by good margins, ate among the 21. Even assuming that the Tory leadership nominated someone to run as a Tory in their areas. it seems like they could win :? ? :mrgreen:
there not kicked out of pariament,just the conservative party.So they can join Labour or the Lib Dems or just hang around untill there is a new PM


_________________
Forever gone
Sorry I ever joined


vermontsavant
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 7 Dec 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,110
Location: Left WP forever

05 Sep 2019, 5:31 am

As far as Jeremy Corbyn being anti EU that may be true in his heart but at least since the 2016 referendum he has been staunchly pro remain.And has said he would like to call for a new referendum and has also been fighting the no deal brexit very hard.

Pro EU and pro remain may be two different things,one can dislike the EU but still be pro remain just like one can be anti abortion and still be pro choice


_________________
Forever gone
Sorry I ever joined


Trueno
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2017
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,788
Location: UK

05 Sep 2019, 5:43 am

EU legislation would hinder Corbyn introducing Marxist policies in the unlikely event he should ever become PM. Which is why he is anti-remain. He may support another referendum, but a referendum on what deal we should accept, not another in/out referendum.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then both the press and the BBC have been lying to me since 2016... and even I don't believe they could lie so long and so consistently.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then he would have been active in the original campaign and put up better opposition to the Government since 2016... instead of virtually no opposition at all.

The only parties that have been officially pro-remain (to my knowledge) are the LibDems and the Greens.


_________________
Steve J

Unkind tongue, right ill hast thou me rendered
For such desert to do me wreak and shame


vermontsavant
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 7 Dec 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,110
Location: Left WP forever

05 Sep 2019, 6:43 am

Trueno wrote:
EU legislation would hinder Corbyn introducing Marxist policies in the unlikely event he should ever become PM. Which is why he is anti-remain. He may support another referendum, but a referendum on what deal we should accept, not another in/out referendum.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then both the press and the BBC have been lying to me since 2016... and even I don't believe they could lie so long and so consistently.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then he would have been active in the original campaign and put up better opposition to the Government since 2016... instead of virtually no opposition at all.

The only parties that have been officially pro-remain (to my knowledge) are the LibDems and the Greens.
you know more about Jeremy Corbyn and English politics than I do.I could have swarn I have read in some american news sites that Corbyn wants new referendum and I thought I had read he pro remain but I could be wrong.I dont know a lot about Jeremy Corbyn and maybe I am just confusing his personal beliefs with the beliefs of the opposition.He is certainly against a no brexit that is for sure,I just read ironicaly that most people are more afraid of Corbyn becoming PM then a no deal brexit


_________________
Forever gone
Sorry I ever joined


Trueno
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2017
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,788
Location: UK

05 Sep 2019, 7:29 am

vermontsavant wrote:
Trueno wrote:
EU legislation would hinder Corbyn introducing Marxist policies in the unlikely event he should ever become PM. Which is why he is anti-remain. He may support another referendum, but a referendum on what deal we should accept, not another in/out referendum.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then both the press and the BBC have been lying to me since 2016... and even I don't believe they could lie so long and so consistently.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then he would have been active in the original campaign and put up better opposition to the Government since 2016... instead of virtually no opposition at all.

The only parties that have been officially pro-remain (to my knowledge) are the LibDems and the Greens.
you know more about Jeremy Corbyn and English politics than I do.I could have swarn I have read in some american news sites that Corbyn wants new referendum and I thought I had read he pro remain but I could be wrong.I dont know a lot about Jeremy Corbyn and maybe I am just confusing his personal beliefs with the beliefs of the opposition.He is certainly against a no brexit that is for sure,I just read ironicaly that most people are more afraid of Corbyn becoming PM then a no deal brexit


To be honest, I wouldn't dismiss the veracity of American news sites. As I hinted at above, I'm even a bit suspicious of the BBC... so I just take it all in and try an make my own mind up. You could try dabbling in the BBC on internet if you're really interested.

You are right that a lot of people are more afraid of Corbyn than no deal Brexit. That's behind Boris' wish for an early election... the two issues will get mixed up and Boris will win. I don't believe Corbyn will ever be PM, though. More likely to be a hung parliament and the whole thing will run on and on.


_________________
Steve J

Unkind tongue, right ill hast thou me rendered
For such desert to do me wreak and shame


vermontsavant
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 7 Dec 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,110
Location: Left WP forever

05 Sep 2019, 8:02 am

Trueno wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
Trueno wrote:
EU legislation would hinder Corbyn introducing Marxist policies in the unlikely event he should ever become PM. Which is why he is anti-remain. He may support another referendum, but a referendum on what deal we should accept, not another in/out referendum.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then both the press and the BBC have been lying to me since 2016... and even I don't believe they could lie so long and so consistently.
If Corbyn is "staunchly pro remain" then he would have been active in the original campaign and put up better opposition to the Government since 2016... instead of virtually no opposition at all.

The only parties that have been officially pro-remain (to my knowledge) are the LibDems and the Greens.
you know more about Jeremy Corbyn and English politics than I do.I could have swarn I have read in some american news sites that Corbyn wants new referendum and I thought I had read he pro remain but I could be wrong.I dont know a lot about Jeremy Corbyn and maybe I am just confusing his personal beliefs with the beliefs of the opposition.He is certainly against a no brexit that is for sure,I just read ironicaly that most people are more afraid of Corbyn becoming PM then a no deal brexit


To be honest, I wouldn't dismiss the veracity of American news sites. As I hinted at above, I'm even a bit suspicious of the BBC... so I just take it all in and try an make my own mind up. You could try dabbling in the BBC on internet if you're really interested.

You are right that a lot of people are more afraid of Corbyn than no deal Brexit. That's behind Boris' wish for an early election... the two issues will get mixed up and Boris will win. I don't believe Corbyn will ever be PM, though. More likely to be a hung parliament and the whole thing will run on and on.
I read BBC online every day on my phone but they show mostly world news and not much on English politics unless its really big,I read the guardian online occasionally.any guesses on who the next PM might be being that its looking like Boris's days are numbered


_________________
Forever gone
Sorry I ever joined


Trueno
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2017
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,788
Location: UK

05 Sep 2019, 8:11 am

The Guardian is probably the only British newspaper I would read. Strangely, I would argue there hasn't been much to report on politics... up until now. Parliament was in recess for a long summer break, hence what we call "the silly season" here. We had the drama of the Tory leadership race for a few weeks. But. Parliament has only been back for a couple of days and it's all exploded. I'm watching BBCnews now and it's still mostly conjecture... opinions from politicians, "experts" and random members of the public. I'm hoping to be out of the country when it really hots up.

... and Boris' days are numbered.


_________________
Steve J

Unkind tongue, right ill hast thou me rendered
For such desert to do me wreak and shame


Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,665
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

05 Sep 2019, 8:37 am

ASS-P wrote:
...I did not know that a party could kick someone out in Parliament simply for going against the leader's desired vote! 8O. Obviously they can. Can a party not in Downing Street - Labour, etc. - do that. too?
Especially given thst there may be a General Election quite soon...could someone who was deselected/lost the whip stand a chance running in their home arrs (posting/district) as an independent?
Two really old-guard Tories, Nicolas Soames and Kenneth Clarke. who'vee been in Parliament forever (and are pretty well-connected and, let's face it, rich. I'm sure), and I assume win their local elections by good margins, ate among the 21. Even assuming that the Tory leadership nominated someone to run as a Tory in their areas. it seems like they could win :? ? :mrgreen:


They had the whip resigned, so are now outside of Party goings on but continue as a member of Parliament until the next General Election. They are barred for standing for the party again in a future election.

Some have already said they will stand in the general election as an independent, i am sure 1 or 2 will move to another party (Libs) and some will walk away from politics. Ken Clarke had already confirmed some time back that he wouldnt stand in the next election anyway as he was retiring.



Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,665
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

05 Sep 2019, 8:40 am

PM Johnsons own brother had quit the party today saying he has had enough of family loyalty Vs what's best for the country.



Trueno
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2017
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,788
Location: UK

05 Sep 2019, 8:54 am

Nicholas Soames has also announced he won't stand again.


_________________
Steve J

Unkind tongue, right ill hast thou me rendered
For such desert to do me wreak and shame


Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,665
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

05 Sep 2019, 9:29 am

Sounds like, as The Conservatives didn't get the result they wanted in the GE vote yesterday, they will just rerun the vote on Monday to try and get a different result.



JohnPowell
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2016
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,806
Location: Palestine

05 Sep 2019, 11:03 am

vermontsavant wrote:
As far as Jeremy Corbyn being anti EU that may be true in his heart but at least since the 2016 referendum he has been staunchly pro remain.And has said he would like to call for a new referendum and has also been fighting the no deal brexit very hard.

Pro EU and pro remain may be two different things,one can dislike the EU but still be pro remain just like one can be anti abortion and still be pro choice


He's not pro 'remain' he is lying because the forces that control the party will not allow the leader to be openly pro leaving the EU. If you believe that he magically changed his mind when he became leader then I don't know what to say.


_________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"


vermontsavant
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 7 Dec 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,110
Location: Left WP forever

05 Sep 2019, 12:19 pm

JohnPowell wrote:
vermontsavant wrote:
As far as Jeremy Corbyn being anti EU that may be true in his heart but at least since the 2016 referendum he has been staunchly pro remain.And has said he would like to call for a new referendum and has also been fighting the no deal brexit very hard.

Pro EU and pro remain may be two different things,one can dislike the EU but still be pro remain just like one can be anti abortion and still be pro choice


He's not pro 'remain' he is lying because the forces that control the party will not allow the leader to be openly pro leaving the EU. If you believe that he magically changed his mind when he became leader then I don't know what to say.
your probably right,and he is not very popular right now either


_________________
Forever gone
Sorry I ever joined


Trueno
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Jul 2017
Age: 68
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,788
Location: UK

05 Sep 2019, 12:24 pm

I think the adversarial party system in the UK is sh*t. It was "party before country" that got us into this mess.


_________________
Steve J

Unkind tongue, right ill hast thou me rendered
For such desert to do me wreak and shame