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Aimless
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10 Jun 2009, 3:14 pm

jrknothead
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10 Jun 2009, 4:36 pm

Holocaust Museum Shooting In Washington D.C.

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from The Huffington Post

WASHINGTON — An elderly gunman, said by authorities to have a violent and virulently anti-Semitic past, stepped inside a crowded U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum on Wednesday, opened fire with a rifle and fatally wounded a security guard before being shot by other officers.

The assailant was hospitalized in critical condition, leaving behind a sprawling investigation by federal and local law enforcement and expressions of shock from the Israeli government and a prominent Muslim organization.

D.C. Police Chief Cathy Lanier said the gunman was "engaged by security guards immediately after entering the door" with a rifle. "The second he stepped into the building he began firing."

Law enforcement officials said James Von Brunn, 88, a white supremacist, was under investigation in the shooting, and a second official said the elderly man's car was found near the museum and tested for explosives. They spoke on condition of anonymity, saying they were not authorized to discuss the investigation just beginning.

Museum officials identified the dead guard as Stephen T. Johns, a six-year veteran of the facility. In an e-mail, director Sara Bloomfield said he "died heroically in the line of duty."

Von Brunn has a racist, anti-Semitic Web site and wrote a book titled "Kill the Best Gentiles."

In 1983, he was convicted of attempting to kidnap members of the Federal Reserve Board and served more than six years in prison. He was arrested two years earlier outside the room where the board was meeting, carrying a revolver, knife and sawed-off shotgun. At the time, police said Von Brunn wanted to take the members hostage because of high interest rates and the nation's economic difficulties.

Writings attributed to Von Brunn on the Internet say the Holocaust was a hoax and decry a Jewish conspiracy to "destroy the white gene pool."

"At Auschwitz the 'Holocaust' myth became Reality, and Germany, cultural gem of the West, became a pariah among world nations," it says.

The museum, which opened in 1993 and has drawn nearly 30 million visitors, houses exhibits and records relating to the Holocaust of more than a half century ago in which more than six million Jews died at the hands of Nazis. Its Web site says the museum "teaches millions of people each year about the dangers of unchecked hatred and the need to prevent genocide."

The crowd at the museum on Wednesday included many school-age children on field trips.


I have to wonder what, if anything, this guy expected to accomplish with this... I would expect a man who reached 88 years of age would have picked up some common sense along the way somewhere...



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10 Jun 2009, 5:33 pm

sounds like an example of 'suicide by cop'.



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10 Jun 2009, 6:15 pm

Who in their right mind would
go into a museum full of
school-age kids and start shooting?

I agree that at 88, this guy should
have picked up some common sense along the way.


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10 Jun 2009, 6:23 pm

I'm sure if I ever reach 88 years old any common sense I pick up along the way will be long gone by then.

That's not to justify his actions at all, it's just the fact of the matter.



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10 Jun 2009, 6:25 pm

Quote:
I would expect a man who reached 88 years of age would have picked up some common sense along the way somewhere...


Oh, you'd be surprised just how little sense some of our elders have...


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10 Jun 2009, 7:01 pm

the direction this thread is taking is a little off the point, I think.



pezar
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10 Jun 2009, 8:32 pm

Why? Simple. An 88 year old man is not in the best of health. I imagine that this guy was recently told that he has inoperable cancer, or some other incurable disease, and decided to go out in a blaze of glory. Suicide by cop is an oversimplification, he likely knew that he would die soon, and he had spent his whole life "fighting the Jews" with nothing to show for it, so he decided to go and attack the Jews, die in the process, and be hailed as a hero by his peers in the white supremacist community. He will likely die before the case goes to trial, if his wounds don't kill him.



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10 Jun 2009, 10:01 pm

Aimless wrote:
the direction this thread is taking is a little off the point, I think.


yes, Vipera is stalking me around the threads, it's tedious. I've asked him/her to stop previously. Just stop it.



monty
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11 Jun 2009, 8:47 am

Postperson wrote:
sounds like an example of 'suicide by cop'.


Yes, that is part of it. But also to go out in a 'blaze of glory' and strike a blow against the enemies of his delusions, the evil ZOG.

I think it was paranoid schizophrenia - many such people can be rational discussing ordinary matters, but when they get on their obsession/delusion, they lose the ability to be rational.

Advancing age might increase the problem (more things can go wrong in the brain, less to lose when looking at death anyway) ... but I don't think that it was strictly age related.



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11 Jun 2009, 9:08 am

This guy has a history and a web site- he has been on the radar for years-insanity is a strictly legal term meaning did the suspect understand what he was doing. If the guy was hallucinating dragons that's one thing- but he is not insane by legal definition.



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11 Jun 2009, 5:07 pm

ViperaAspis wrote:
Quote:
I would expect a man who reached 88 years of age would have picked up some common sense along the way somewhere...


Oh, you'd be surprised just how little sense some of our elders have...


So true. I live in a retirement community and some of my neighbors are true a**holes. My guess is that young a**holes eventually will become elderly a**holes if they don't die first.

ruveyn



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11 Jun 2009, 6:21 pm

Aimless wrote:
the direction this thread is taking is a little off the point, I think.


I know what you mean. I started a thread in the Computers, Math, Science, and Technology about a problem with weather temperature sensors being placed in wrong locations according to an NOAA's rules for proper readings. About midway through the thread I decided to intervene by posting a follow-up comment asking people nicely to please stay on topic. All subsequent posts have turned into non-topic related bickering. I've pretty much given up on that thread. I will occasionally revisit the thread to see if things improve but for now I think it's done. :(

PS my apologies for posting this off-topic message here. :)


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11 Jun 2009, 7:07 pm

@aimless: Don't worry, it's the nature of threads to meander a bit. They are sorta... aimless ;) But to distill it down, what do you define the point of this thread as, Aimless? I was taking it as "Sometimes people can do pretty crazy things regardless of their age and it is sad". Is that kinda close? People here seem to be pretty close to that, anyway.

@ruveyn: :lmao: I guess that makes a lot of sense. BTW, my dad agrees with your WWII view that we should have kept going afterwards until we reached U.S.A. Worldwide.

@postperson: Good grief, are you seeing that as aimed at YOU?!? You're nowhere near "elderly" if you're in your early 50's. Anyhow, let's be friends, hug and make up. Here, have a hug, I'm not shy to go first: <<HUG>>. Now quit thinking I'm following you everywhere just because I've posted after you in a few places. This is going to happen. You've posted after me a few places too. [Obi-Wan voice]: Let go, Luke. Besides, if we have an argument here it's going to knock the thread way off topic and our friend Aimless is literally going to have kittens.


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11 Jun 2009, 8:32 pm

You're right of course, I would expect threads to meander "aimlessly" :) it just seemed to start right away and I thought it missed the larger point of blind hatred towards of a group of people. I visited the Holocaust Museum this last April and I don't know that the guard who was killed wasn't the one checking my bag. Maybe so maybe not; but it is a humbling experience to be there and the exhibit is very powerful. All that you see there is repellent but there was one photo of "medical experiment" they made me wonder what did they tell themselves was the scientific benefit of doing such a thing, as it was clearly nothing more than a sick amusement.The one thing that scares me more than anything is mob mentality and it seems there is more and more rigid thinking and less and less tolerance in allowing people to be who they are. Kids are beating other kids just so they can post it on YouTube. I started that thread when I first saw the breaking news and I was responding emotionally.
On a somewhat different yet related topic- There is a little boy in my son's class who has Tourettes. His vocalizations are quite loud. I have been to several school functions and "J" also pops over to the neighborhood and I have yet to see one smirk or giggle from anyone. I think because "J" is a very matter of fact little boy and his attitude is this is what's going on and if you got a problem then tough sh!t. I could see clearly that the other kids didn't notice it anymore and for that I am pleased. "J" is a cool kid(also a rascal) :)