Believe in Yourself or you need to believe in yourself more!

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cubedemon6073
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06 Jan 2019, 8:14 am

Believe in Yourself or you need to believe in yourself more!

Let's turn this BS around.  Do you believe in me?  Enough for you to hire me for any position at your company?  Even being a janitor?  If you don't have a company or own a business then pretend you do?   If you don't believe in me enough to hire me or give me the time of day then why in the f**k should I believe in myself?   Will my believing in myself change the outcome of your decision to hire me?   

Let's say the answer is no.  Why does it matter whether I believe in myself or not?   You as an employer or pretend employer is gate keeper.  You make the decisions who gets hired or not?   You guard the doors and have the keys.  Believe in yourself is BS!  (f**k, that should be a Penn and Teller BS episode).



Fireblossom
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06 Jan 2019, 8:47 am

Not exactly. While it's true that believing in yourself doesn't matter if no one else believes in you, it is easier for others to believe in you if you believe in yourself too. I mean let's say two people apply for the same job. Both have equally good papers for it, but neither has anyone who recommends them for the job. However, one of them is confident, saying "I can do this" and the other one is not and doesn't say it. So, the confident one actually has someone recommending them (the person themselves) while the one who doesn't believe in themselves has no one. While it might turn out that the less confident one would've been a better choice, they certainly don't look like it during the interviews and the other one gets hired.

It's an endless cycle, really. You say that how can people demand you to believe in yourself when they don't believe in you and they say how could they believe in you when even you who know yourself the best can't do it.

I think it depends on the person a little bit. Some people just need someone to have faith in them before they can have faith in themselves, while some others gather their faith in themselves from pure facts or what they think are facts. Neither is exactly the wrong way, but you don't need others in order to follow the later path so it might be easier.



shortfatbalduglyman
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06 Jan 2019, 7:46 pm

Some people believe in themselves way too much



Earthling
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07 Jan 2019, 8:03 am

It depends.

If you project a negative image just by your low self-esteem and not by a lack of skill then yes, you can try to increase your self-confidence and see if it also effects how others view you.
At the very least other people's rejection won't get to you as much.

If you actually suck at a skill and that causes your low confidence, then you need to work on the skill before you can truly believe in yourself.
However, if you project confidence, some people will believe it even if you have zero aptitude.

If it's got nothing to do with you and only with how other people perceive you independent of your actions (that almost never happens, but ok...) then nothing will change it. But even then at least you're convinced that you're amazing and others who don't see it are a bunch of morons, which can be more redeeming than seeing oneself as a failure.

Either others see your amazing projection, or if they don't see it, at least you see it and they are idiots.
Isn't that more of a win in both situations than a defeatist attitude?

Tell me in which instance (apart from wanting to improve at something because you truly care about being skilled or self-preservation or being truthful to yourself no matter the consequences) it's advantageous to not believe in yourself?



ezbzbfcg2
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08 Jan 2019, 3:54 am

What does "believe in yourself" have to do with getting a job? Really. Getting a job is a game of chance and hoping for the best.

I think "believe in yourself" means you have a 50/50 shot at something. No guarantees here. You can either chose to dwell on the failure side, or dwell on the successful side. Either way, you don't know which outcome will occur until you actually try, so, in the meantime, why not put stock in success?



cubedemon6073
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08 Jan 2019, 9:54 am

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
What does "believe in yourself" have to do with getting a job? Really. Getting a job is a game of chance and hoping for the best.

I think "believe in yourself" means you have a 50/50 shot at something. No guarantees here. You can either chose to dwell on the failure side, or dwell on the successful side. Either way, you don't know which outcome will occur until you actually try, so, in the meantime, why not put stock in success?


When I'm in the mood I will explain.



kraftiekortie
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08 Jan 2019, 10:04 am

I, honestly, believe that "believing in yourself" promotes a posture within yourself that aids in things like "getting a job," or "making a friend."

It's partially BS, yes. I'm not a believer in "positivity." Or some of that Norman Vincent Peale stuff---or self-help stuff. I don't read those sorts of books.

But I am a believer in "having faith in yourself." In basic terms.



Fireblossom
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08 Jan 2019, 12:07 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
What does "believe in yourself" have to do with getting a job? Really. Getting a job is a game of chance and hoping for the best.


Not much when you're sending applications, but if you actually go to an interview then it does have an effect. People with self confidence and a positive attitude (=people who believe in themselves) tend to leave a better impression than people who are the opposite, in other words the person who's doing the interview will likely like a person who believes in themselves better. Impressions and how another person's precense makes you feel seem to matter a lot to most people after all. Even if you're seen as cabable, you likely won't be hired if you give off the impression of a someone who will poison the air at work. Negativity feeds negativity.



cubedemon6073
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08 Jan 2019, 11:34 pm

Fireblossom wrote:
ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
What does "believe in yourself" have to do with getting a job? Really. Getting a job is a game of chance and hoping for the best.


Not much when you're sending applications, but if you actually go to an interview then it does have an effect. People with self confidence and a positive attitude (=people who believe in themselves) tend to leave a better impression than people who are the opposite, in other words the person who's doing the interview will likely like a person who believes in themselves better. Impressions and how another person's precense makes you feel seem to matter a lot to most people after all. Even if you're seen as cabable, you likely won't be hired if you give off the impression of a someone who will poison the air at work. Negativity feeds negativity.


You got it and explained it better then I would have.

I'm going to add to this. Even if others see you as capable in the field by one's body language, facial expressions and speech mannerisms they might see you as slow or not believing in one self even if you truthfully do. In other words, one can believe in oneself but if the other party has doubts about you one way or another you are more then likely not going to get employed. Telling me to believe in myself is meaningless if the other party doesn't believe in me as well.

One can believe one is awesome all the way to the bank but does that mean others will think so? I don't think so.

Some will say I shouldn't care what others think. I think that is f*****g stupid. In certain aspects of life you do need an employers approval to be employed and a customer's approval to buy your product if one is self-employed.

Believe in yourself others say. My response: HA! How much of the crack rock are you on?



Last edited by cubedemon6073 on 08 Jan 2019, 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

shortfatbalduglyman
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08 Jan 2019, 11:42 pm

Confidence not proportional to competence



Kiprobalhato
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09 Jan 2019, 12:00 am

how on earth is an aspie supposed to know if their "presence" is off putting or not?


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shortfatbalduglyman
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09 Jan 2019, 12:11 am

If someone acts in a restrained way around you, and less uninhibited around everyone else. Or if someone avoids you, someone finds your presence off putting



On the other hand, there is no way to know how someone acts in your absence, because you are absent



cubedemon6073
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09 Jan 2019, 2:34 am

Let's get down to brass tacks. It's not about believing in oneself or confidence. It's about being able to portray that one believes in oneself or has confidence as defined by others. This is one example out of other examples in which life is not what one makes it despite the claim. Others define the parameters, create the doors and keys, guard the doors and keys and define who gets the keys and who gets in or not. This is truth to power. You as an individual don't really get to define this in the USA despite the claim of be yourself and individualism.



ezbzbfcg2
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09 Jan 2019, 9:05 am

Whenever NTs talk about "the self" in a general way, they're almost always talking about how one should present himself to others. Nothing at all to do with individualism, the exact opposite in fact.

As Aspies, we take a lot of these phrases literally, at face value, and think, "Gee, that sounds good, I like being myself!" But that's never what those phrases meant and it takes us a lot longer to learn these things. 'Read between the lines.'

Glad you've finally come around OP. Some Aspies never do.



cubedemon6073
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09 Jan 2019, 2:15 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Whenever NTs talk about "the self" in a general way, they're almost always talking about how one should present himself to others. Nothing at all to do with individualism, the exact opposite in fact.

As Aspies, we take a lot of these phrases literally, at face value, and think, "Gee, that sounds good, I like being myself!" But that's never what those phrases meant and it takes us a lot longer to learn these things. 'Read between the lines.'

Glad you've finally come around OP. Some Aspies never do.


It took alot of observation, analysis, and asking ppl from voc rehab, shrinks, my dad, wife, various members, a commentor on my old blog until I reached my conclusions.

Another thing, a lot of ppl will say one thing but do another.

Whenever there’s a discrepancy between what people actually do and what they say to do, beware of social desirability bias.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_desirability_bias

Don't pay attention to what NTs say (consider it verbal diarrhea) but what they do.



Last edited by cubedemon6073 on 09 Jan 2019, 2:35 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Prometheus18
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09 Jan 2019, 2:22 pm

Fireblossom wrote:
Not exactly. While it's true that believing in yourself doesn't matter if no one else believes in you, it is easier for others to believe in you if you believe in yourself too. I mean let's say two people apply for the same job. Both have equally good papers for it, but neither has anyone who recommends them for the job. However, one of them is confident, saying "I can do this" and the other one is not and doesn't say it. So, the confident one actually has someone recommending them (the person themselves) while the one who doesn't believe in themselves has no one. While it might turn out that the less confident one would've been a better choice, they certainly don't look like it during the interviews and the other one gets hired.

It's an endless cycle, really. You say that how can people demand you to believe in yourself when they don't believe in you and they say how could they believe in you when even you who know yourself the best can't do it.

I think it depends on the person a little bit. Some people just need someone to have faith in them before they can have faith in themselves, while some others gather their faith in themselves from pure facts or what they think are facts. Neither is exactly the wrong way, but you don't need others in order to follow the later path so it might be easier.


Good, well balanced analysis. Thanks for posting.