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ProvokesThinking
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09 Nov 2012, 7:08 am

I have read topics about this here more, but I couldn't find recent topics on this.

I have Aspergers Syndrome myself, although un-diagnosed, and I watched a documentary about this Dahmer and also read a lot about him. Why do some people with Aspergers here claim that Dahmer was absolutely not autistic and was a psychopath?

I recognize quite some things of myself in him and his behaviour. The odd social interaction he made, he couldn't have close friendships with other people, obsessive interests (which happened when his father, a chemist introduced him to animal cadavers, which he started collecting), goofy behaviour sometimes (in school he was known as a clown, although some Aspergers are absolutely not clowns I also know autistic people who are clowns and acting like clowns) and he doesn't correspond to the normal pattern of serial killers. I 'm almost sure that people like Ted Bundy and Ramirez were psychopaths, they were absolutely not on the autistic spectrum, they didn't show guilt and such things, but when I look at Jeffrey Dahmer he doesn't fit this pattern, he had a sense of guilt and he didn't even realise the consequences of what he did, a typical autistic feature, sometimes I too don't realise the consequences of what I 've done and I know other autistic people who have this.

Of course it went horribly wrong with him and he is just an exception, because there aren't a lot of other autistic people who turned in somebody like him, but why do people here deny he could have had Aspergers? I have it myself and I think it may be very well possible he had had it, his obsessive interests and the other mental disorders he had in combination with Aspergers just made it gone horribly wrong.



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09 Nov 2012, 7:48 am

ProvokesThinking wrote:
I have read topics about this here more, but I couldn't find recent topics on this.

I have Aspergers Syndrome myself, although un-diagnosed, and I watched a documentary about this Dahmer and also read a lot about him. Why do some people with Aspergers here claim that Dahmer was absolutely not autistic and was a psychopath?

I recognize quite some things of myself in him and his behaviour. The odd social interaction he made, he couldn't have close friendships with other people, obsessive interests (which happened when his father, a chemist introduced him to animal cadavers, which he started collecting), goofy behaviour sometimes (in school he was known as a clown, although some Aspergers are absolutely not clowns I also know autistic people who are clowns and acting like clowns) and he doesn't correspond to the normal pattern of serial killers. I 'm almost sure that people like Ted Bundy and Ramirez were psychopaths, they were absolutely not on the autistic spectrum, they didn't show guilt and such things, but when I look at Jeffrey Dahmer he doesn't fit this pattern, he had a sense of guilt and he didn't even realise the consequences of what he did, a typical autistic feature, sometimes I too don't realise the consequences of what I 've done and I know other autistic people who have this.

Of course it went horribly wrong with him and he is just an exception, because there aren't a lot of other autistic people who turned in somebody like him, but why do people here deny he could have had Aspergers? I have it myself and I think it may be very well possible he had had it, his obsessive interests and the other mental disorders he had in combination with Aspergers just made it gone horribly wrong.


Jeffery Dalmer most certainly had the symptoms of Autism and was obsessed for all of the wrong reasons. But he was an alcoholic too which can completely alter the mind of some people. You may want to read this article where you can see if you think he had Autism or not. But, I saw he did which seems to be a criminal Autism and is the exception rather then the rule. Most of us with Autism or Aspergers are very peaceful and wouldn't even think of doing the things this scumbag did. So Please don't feel guilty about this scumbag.

Jeffrey Dalmer



Ilka
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09 Nov 2012, 7:49 am

I have read about Jeffrey Dahmer myself. For some reason I like to read about serial killers. I do not think Jeffrey Dahmer was autistic. If you read his story he started to withdrawn and became uncommunicative by the age of 10. A person with Autism gets borned like that. You do not start showing signs so late. I do not think he was a sociopath, either. I think he suffered a severe trauma. If I had to bet, he was repetitively raped in his childhood (that would explain the change in behavior, fixation with male body, homosexuality, drinking problems, anger) and never told anyone.



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09 Nov 2012, 8:04 am

Ilka wrote:
I have read about Jeffrey Dahmer myself. For some reason I like to read about serial killers. I do not think Jeffrey Dahmer was autistic. If you read his story he started to withdrawn and became uncommunicative by the age of 10. A person with Autism gets borned like that. You do not start showing signs so late. I do not think he was a sociopath, either. I think he suffered a severe trauma. If I had to bet, he was repetitively raped in his childhood (that would explain the change in behavior, fixation with male body, homosexuality, drinking problems, anger) and never told anyone.


A person don't necessarily get born like that although many of us are born with it. I feel like Trauma and abuse can bring on Autism even in a boy that is 10 years old. Also the environment can cause Autism. But, the professionals can't really put their fingers on the exact causes. Here is an article from the Mayo Clinic that you may want to read. There are probably a lot of good articles about the causes of Autism. But, anything from the Mayo Clinic seems to be more credible. There might even be something about the causes of Autism on WebMD which is another reputable website. I know what I have been reading about it, but you can draw your own conclusions if you choose to read a few articles about the cause of Autism.

No known cause of Autism



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09 Nov 2012, 8:48 am

While Dahmer may have had some symptoms of AS/ASD, those same symptoms may also be evident with people having psychopathy, schizophrenia, or PTSD.

It's like having the symptoms of fever and headache. Is it a cold or the flu? Is it spinal meningitis or ebola? Maybe it's a tumor that effects those parts of the body and brain that control blood pressure and metabolism.

No, let's just say that anyone with a fever and a headache is autistic, and make everyone happy.

Not.

:roll:


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Toy_Soldier
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09 Nov 2012, 9:23 am

Another inmate did us all a favor and killed him in the bathroom with a broom stick. That is all I wanted and hoped to hear about it. Case closed for me on that one.



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09 Nov 2012, 10:02 am

Too bad his parents wouldn't allow his brain to be studied afterwards though. I'm curious what would make someone want to do the terrible things Dahmer did.



Ilka
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09 Nov 2012, 10:04 am

Dirtdigger wrote:
A person don't necessarily get born like that although many of us are born with it. I feel like Trauma and abuse can bring on Autism even in a boy that is 10 years old. Also the environment can cause Autism. But, the professionals can't really put their fingers on the exact causes. Here is an article from the Mayo Clinic that you may want to read. There are probably a lot of good articles about the causes of Autism. But, anything from the Mayo Clinic seems to be more credible. There might even be something about the causes of Autism on WebMD which is another reputable website. I know what I have been reading about it, but you can draw your own conclusions if you choose to read a few articles about the cause of Autism.

No known cause of Autism


I did read the article you sent. It says: "Researchers are currently exploring whether such factors as viral infections, complications during pregnancy and air pollutants play a role in triggering autism." Complications during pregnancy points to before the child is borned. Viral infections and air pollutants is not very clear, are they meaning they affect the mother so the child gets borned autistic, or do they affect children and make them autistic? Truth be told scientists have not being able to point what causes autism. Not yet. The only theory I have seen that says a child can develop autism is the acquired autism/autistic enterocolitis theory, and that theory is very controversial and has being discredited by other scientists.

I did read somewhere that his behavior changed after he suffered from some childhood illness, so maybe that is the reason? Anyway, there is enough information to support your theory.



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09 Nov 2012, 12:24 pm

Quote:
A person don't necessarily get born like that although many of us are born with it. I feel like Trauma and abuse can bring on Autism even in a boy that is 10 years old.


Psychological trauma doesn't cause autism. That was debunked back in the 70s. There are many varied causes of autism, but all of them are physical (genetics or biological environment).

It is possible for a child to develop autistic like traits (though they wouldn't meet onset criteria) at 10, as a result of a brain injury. For example, I've read about kids with cerebellar tumors, many of them end up with autistic traits after the tumor is removed. Although most just get ADHD, language impairment and poor visuospatial skills instead.

But emotional trauma and abuse has nothing at all to do with autism. Children who suffer severe abuse get things like PTSD, depression, reactive attachment disorder, substance abuse problems, things like that. They don't get autism. Closest thing is institutionalized kids (eg in orphanages), they'll often act autistic while in the institution, but they lose those autistic traits pretty quick when they get out.



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09 Nov 2012, 12:35 pm

He wasn't Autistic,just a combo of loneliness and hunger.
Sorry of this offends anyone,sometimes I have a macabe sense of humor.



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09 Nov 2012, 12:46 pm

What really, really annoys me is that the many analyses of Dahmer do not mention that he was raised by his father and a STEPmother, who hated him, and said so CONSTANTLY and bragged to her friends about the ways she abused him. One of her friends gave an interview years ago and talked about this at length.
No one ever called Child Protective Services, and I do not know what his father was aware of.
Severe physical, emotional, psychological abuse of a child can instill so much fear and rage as to turn any child into a dangerous adult.

Sylkat



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09 Nov 2012, 1:15 pm

Sylkat wrote:
What really, really annoys me is that the many analyses of Dahmer do not mention that he was raised by his father and a STEPmother, who hated him, and said so CONSTANTLY and bragged to her friends about the ways she abused him. One of her friends gave an interview years ago and talked about this at length.
No one ever called Child Protective Services, and I do not know what his father was aware of.
Severe physical, emotional, psychological abuse of a child can instill so much fear and rage as to turn any child into a dangerous adult.

Sylkat


Funny that you talked about how Dalmer was being abused by step-mother. I was just watching this on You Tube this morning about an autistic girl and that the mother hated her on the Phil Show. Would like to get everyone's thoughts on this.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5Ztv1FoHz8&feature=g-all-u[/youtube]



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09 Nov 2012, 1:47 pm

When Dahmer said he was having someone over for dinner he meant it literally.

Again,sorry,macabre.



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09 Nov 2012, 3:33 pm

Sylkat wrote:
What really, really annoys me is that the many analyses of Dahmer do not mention that he was raised by his father and a STEPmother, who hated him, and said so CONSTANTLY and bragged to her friends about the ways she abused him. One of her friends gave an interview years ago and talked about this at length.
No one ever called Child Protective Services, and I do not know what his father was aware of.
Severe physical, emotional, psychological abuse of a child can instill so much fear and rage as to turn any child into a dangerous adult.

Sylkat

Never ran across that before. Interesting.

Supposidly he would get drunk and pass out while he was in the army in order to drown out the macabre fantasies he was already having, but not yet acting out. But the alchol binging Im sure didnt improve the health of his brain either.



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09 Nov 2012, 3:53 pm

Sylkat wrote:
... the many analyses of Dahmer do not mention that he was raised by his father and a step-mother, who hated him, said so constantly, and bragged to her friends about the ways she abused him... No one ever called Child Protective Services, and I do not know what his father was aware of.

During the time of his childhood, it happened often that children who sought help from the police, their teachers, and from other adults were dismissed as "whiners" and "crybabies". This happened only if the child was not abused into silence by the abusing parent (i.e., "It's nobody else's damn business how I raise my child, not even the police!").

If an abused child of that era had to be taken to the hospital to have their burns, broken bones, concussions, and lacerations treated, the medical staff their was more likely to believe the parents' story of, "He was playing with a lighter and some gasoline, and the explosion blew him across the yard." If the child tried to tell someone what had really happened, then all his parents had to say was, "He's just lying to stay out of trouble -- he won't admit what he did to anyone."

Trust me ... I've had personal experience ...


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09 Nov 2012, 4:01 pm

Fnord wrote:
"He was playing with a lighter and some gasoline, and the explosion blew him across the yard." If the child tried to tell someone what had really happened, then all his parents had to say was, "He's just lying to stay out of trouble -- he won't admit what he did to anyone."



wtf, The explosion blew him across the yard? I don't think the kid would be alive to talk about it in the first place. :roll: