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donnie_darko
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24 Sep 2011, 12:27 pm

There's a thread about tattoos in this section that made me think. A lot of people consider tattoos a fad. There's certainly some truth to this. It wasn't until about 1990, maybe even later, that tattoos became common outside of a few subcultures, such as bikers, sailors, prisoners and military men. They were seen as being very macho, implying masculine strength, violence, and general badassness. It's only been the past 15-20 years that tats have become truly a fad in the sense that 'everybody' does it, and the macho implication has worn off as I believe most tattooed people today are female.

The rise of tattoos since 1990 have coincided with several other trends, most of which I think are correlated somehow. The most obvious is the rise of body piercing. It actually wasn't common for girls to pierce their ears until the 1960s, at least I heard that. The other piercings, nose, belly, etc became popular in the early '90s. Slightly less obvious is the rise of alternative and punk culture. Once a backlash against formality, by the present, I would say the alternative is the new formality. Indeed, it almost looks a bit odd to see a person well-dressed today. Dressing 20th century sticks out as much in the grungy early 21st century as someone who just returned from a Renaissance Faire. I'm actually more used to seeing people with full sleeved tats and mohawks than I am people in suits and ties!

This formality goes beyond appearance too. The use of profanity has increased dramatically compared to the '80s. Of course profanity is probably as old as language, but before the 1990s, it was a private thing for the most part. You didn't hear much of it in movies, TV, and in public, and it was extremely uncommon to hear women use it publicly (not picking on women here, just stating the facts).

Another change that happened at the same time as all of those things is the loss of a belief in modern progress, that the world is destined for great things, and the rise of cynicism and doom and gloom. Back in the '60s, even as late as the '80s (Back to the Future), people still dreamed of a marvelous magical kind of future where everyone was happy and every day was kind of a scifi party. Most of the characterizations of the future since the '90s have been negative. Global warming, which essentially is a doomsday theory, is believed by most scientists, and it seems difficult to picture humans living just 100 more years. We are obsessed with nostalgia and hate the present, and even though we use technology we pretend to hate it. We swoon at people playing acoustic guitar even though synthesized hip hop is all that sells now. Nostalgia goes in 20 years cycles - now that 20 years ago = the 90s, which never really ended anyways (Nirvana are still played on 'new rock' stations, and little kids still like Eminem and South Park), we are now stuck repeating a past that we forgot is actually the present!

I think the first blow to the dream of the future was the decline of the hippie movement, Altamont showed that no amount of dreaming could ever wipe out the violence in our society (or seemed to anyway), the second blow was the end of the Cold War, not because the Cold War ended, but because when it did end, it was very anti-climatic and nothing really improved. Third blow would be the events of September 11.

Anyway, how this connects to tattoos, profanity, informality/slacker dress, etc. I think the underlying cause of this change in fashion and attitude is the fact that Modernity is over, and ended sometime during the 1990s. The age of ideology had ended with the fall of the Soviet Union and in its place there is a world of uncertainty where it's impossible to really know who 'the enemy' is. Is it violent teenagers? Is it video games? Is it terrorists? Is it our own government? Is it the new world order? The rise of the Internet which immediately followed the fall of communism essentially made the written word obsolete and that is why kids are losing their ability to spell.

Religion of the organized revealed sort is also a product of the written word, and now that paper is obsolete and information about other religions and the scandals and hypocrisies in religion are available, you can expect to see the average person become less religious, and the average religious person to become more radical, until religion dies out almost completely.

With the post-literate, post-modern age, skepticism of even formal dress arises. In a postmodern society, every opinion is valid, and the only evil or sinful thing is to deny a person their right to their own opinion. Of course, this isn't entirely true, they're not gonna legalize murder anytime soon, but you know what I mean.

In a sense, the end of modernity, means a return to primitive ways. I don't mean primitive in the pejorative sense, what I mean is that postmodern society is already more of an intuitive, emotionally based culture than one based on logic. This is why I don't think tattoos, body piercings, and alternative/DIY culture is just a fad of the 1990s/early 21st century era, but is actually a permanent feature of the new society that will likely last centuries.

Postmodern is all about 'keeping it real'. Fakeness is deplorable in the postmodern ethic. You see this in indie rock and metal when any band suddenly starts making money, they are accused of being fake. We love it when talented, but unattractive people like Susan Boyle and Adele become successful and deplore 'phonies' like Justin Bieber and Britney Spears. Modernity was about subduing the animal inside us, as it was still somewhat religious in its orientation and was also idealistic.

Tattoos, rather than being 'ugly' and 'rebellious', in the modern light, in the postmodern are seen as the ultimate symbol of artistic expression - turning one's own body, into art. After all, nothing can be more 'real' than something so meaningful, you will etch it in your skin, right? That's why as long as we are postmodern tattoos and 1990's (neo-primitive) fashion and culture is still gonna be all the rage.

Welcome to the post-modern, post-literate, post-ideological, post-religious, post-everything age! :D 8)



CockneyRebel
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24 Sep 2011, 1:07 pm

I'll just have a Coke and listen to The Kinks.


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Rocky
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25 Sep 2011, 5:19 am

Thank you for posting this. I am in my 50's. I'm guessing you are quite a bit younger. I stopped paying much attention to popular culture after about the 1980's. Its interesting getting the perspective on this subject from someone who has obviously paid attention to what has gone on since then.

I see wearing tattoos as a way of rebelling from the previous generation. The male members of my parents generation had short hair. My generation rebelled by wearing long hair. I figured subsequent generations would have to find something else. I remember when the Punks (during the 80's) rebelled against the "Hippies" with their particular stlye, which included some piercings, although not nearly as common as now. I don't mean to minimize the significance of the statement being made with tattoos, for example. I am just ignorant as to what that statement is (other than rebellion, or possibly just wanting their own look.)

As I see it, the statement made with long hair during the 60's and subsequent decades (until it faded) was to make a statement against the macho male prototype which facilitated the decent into (the Vietnam) war.


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donnie_darko
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25 Sep 2011, 8:01 am

Rocky wrote:
Thank you for posting this. I am in my 50's. I'm guessing you are quite a bit younger. I stopped paying much attention to popular culture after about the 1980's. Its interesting getting the perspective on this subject from someone who has obviously paid attention to what has gone on since then.

I see wearing tattoos as a way of rebelling from the previous generation. The male members of my parents generation had short hair. My generation rebelled by wearing long hair. I figured subsequent generations would have to find something else. I remember when the Punks (during the 80's) rebelled against the "Hippies" with their particular stlye, which included some piercings, although not nearly as common as now. I don't mean to minimize the significance of the statement being made with tattoos, for example. I am just ignorant as to what that statement is (other than rebellion, or possibly just wanting their own look.)

As I see it, the statement made with long hair during the 60's and subsequent decades (until it faded) was to make a statement against the macho male prototype which facilitated the decent into (the Vietnam) war.


The odd thing is, tattoos aren't really rebellious anymore. You see moms with tattoos and their daughters copying them. Most Gen Yers are extremely attached to their parents, and are actually proud to emulate them. Tattoos imo are just a part of postmodern style and will likely last centuries, and I'm saying that as someone who dislikes them.



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25 Sep 2011, 8:43 am

CockneyRebel wrote:
I'll just have a Coke and listen to The Kinks.


Sounds good to me, mind if I join? 8)


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Rocky
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25 Sep 2011, 11:48 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Rocky wrote:
Thank you for posting this. I am in my 50's. I'm guessing you are quite a bit younger. I stopped paying much attention to popular culture after about the 1980's. Its interesting getting the perspective on this subject from someone who has obviously paid attention to what has gone on since then.

I see wearing tattoos as a way of rebelling from the previous generation. The male members of my parents generation had short hair. My generation rebelled by wearing long hair. I figured subsequent generations would have to find something else. I remember when the Punks (during the 80's) rebelled against the "Hippies" with their particular stlye, which included some piercings, although not nearly as common as now. I don't mean to minimize the significance of the statement being made with tattoos, for example. I am just ignorant as to what that statement is (other than rebellion, or possibly just wanting their own look.)

As I see it, the statement made with long hair during the 60's and subsequent decades (until it faded) was to make a statement against the macho male prototype which facilitated the decent into (the Vietnam) war.


The odd thing is, tattoos aren't really rebellious anymore. You see moms with tattoos and their daughters copying them. Most Gen Yers are extremely attached to their parents, and are actually proud to emulate them. Tattoos imo are just a part of postmodern style and will likely last centuries, and I'm saying that as someone who dislikes them.


I used to be a little worried about one of my nephews, since he was not rebellious at all. I was afraid that he would never be able to be his own person. I was wrong to worry. I personally don't have any tattoos, but I don't object to them. Do you dislike them for aesthetic reasons?


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26 Sep 2011, 1:03 am

You'd probably be surprised, but the "issue" of teenage rebellion dates way back to the 1950s. There was an article in Newsweek from 1954 entitled Let's Face It: Our Teenagers Are Out Of Control. Also, have you seen movies from the '50s starring James Dean (such as Rebel Without A Cause)? Teenage rebellion was a real issue in the '50s, and historians theorize that it was due to the fact that teenagers in the post-WWII age experienced more freedom to do whatever they want than the generations before them. During and prior to WWII, teenagers were mostly expected to work alongside their parents. Or so I've read.

I disagree about your point about cursing being more common today than it was a couple of decades ago. Just yesterday, I saw a movie from 1976, and it was full of foul language. :wink:


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Rocky
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26 Sep 2011, 2:02 pm

Descartes wrote:
You'd probably be surprised, but the "issue" of teenage rebellion dates way back to the 1950s. There was an article in Newsweek from 1954 entitled Let's Face It: Our Teenagers Are Out Of Control. Also, have you seen movies from the '50s starring James Dean (such as Rebel Without A Cause)? Teenage rebellion was a real issue in the '50s, and historians theorize that it was due to the fact that teenagers in the post-WWII age experienced more freedom to do whatever they want than the generations before them. During and prior to WWII, teenagers were mostly expected to work alongside their parents. Or so I've read.

I disagree about your point about cursing being more common today than it was a couple of decades ago. Just yesterday, I saw a movie from 1976, and it was full of foul language. :wink:


Thanks for posting. Interesting point about rebellion in the 50's.

My impression about cursing being more common today than it used to be in the 70's: I would say that more people curse in public now. Film makers in the 70's were experimenting with relatively new freedoms they had available to them. Those who cursed did a lot, but I would say more people do so now.


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26 Sep 2011, 3:08 pm

Austin Powers is a pretty cool character, so the 90s weren't all bad for me. :)


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donnie_darko
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26 Sep 2011, 3:37 pm

Rocky wrote:


I used to be a little worried about one of my nephews, since he was not rebellious at all. I was afraid that he would never be able to be his own person. I was wrong to worry. I personally don't have any tattoos, but I don't object to them. Do you dislike them for aesthetic reasons?


Yeah, just aesthetic reasons, they just look kind of 'gross' to me. Sort of profane. I'm not a snob or anything, I'm never gonna tell someone that I don't like their tattoos, or give them crap for it ... I just find them kind of ugly. Especially when you see them on beautiful women. It's like they are ruining their bodies!



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26 Sep 2011, 3:43 pm

Descartes wrote:
You'd probably be surprised, but the "issue" of teenage rebellion dates way back to the 1950s. There was an article in Newsweek from 1954 entitled Let's Face It: Our Teenagers Are Out Of Control. Also, have you seen movies from the '50s starring James Dean (such as Rebel Without A Cause)? Teenage rebellion was a real issue in the '50s, and historians theorize that it was due to the fact that teenagers in the post-WWII age experienced more freedom to do whatever they want than the generations before them. During and prior to WWII, teenagers were mostly expected to work alongside their parents. Or so I've read.

I disagree about your point about cursing being more common today than it was a couple of decades ago. Just yesterday, I saw a movie from 1976, and it was full of foul language. :wink:


Was that movie Taxi Driver by any chance? :D Nah, cussing was definitely around and common enough, before the 90s. The difference is that back in the 70s, only badass metal groups and stuff cussed for the most part, while now, it's pretty unusual if you're a pop star if you don't have at least a couple songs that drop some kind of bomb.

I don't think a show like South Park could have become successful even in the first half of the 90s, unless it was like a VHS-only deal and wasn't broadcast. Even then the humor was probably too 21st century.

And yes it's true teenage rebellion really began in the 50s, though there was even a taste of it in the '20s with the flappers and all, that's probably more young adults in their 20s though. I see the era of teen rebellion as lasting from the late 1940s to early 2000s. Essentially it's dead now since parents are kids' friends and stuff. Which I guess is a good thing.



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26 Sep 2011, 4:37 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Rocky wrote:


I used to be a little worried about one of my nephews, since he was not rebellious at all. I was afraid that he would never be able to be his own person. I was wrong to worry. I personally don't have any tattoos, but I don't object to them. Do you dislike them for aesthetic reasons?


Yeah, just aesthetic reasons, they just look kind of 'gross' to me. Sort of profane. I'm not a snob or anything, I'm never gonna tell someone that I don't like their tattoos, or give them crap for it ... I just find them kind of ugly. Especially when you see them on beautiful women. It's like they are ruining their bodies!


Yeah, I agree. Gilding the lily. If you are honoring the traditions of your ancestors, if you are Maori, for example, that could be justified. I just don't care for tattoos from an aesthetic point of view.


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26 Sep 2011, 4:49 pm

I disagree on a large number of points - I think you're wrong about a lot of things you said. I'm trying not to be confrontational, so I'll keep it to myself unless you really wanna go into it. :wink:


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donnie_darko
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26 Sep 2011, 4:59 pm

Ambivalence wrote:
I disagree on a large number of points - I think you're wrong about a lot of things you said. I'm trying not to be confrontational, so I'll keep it to myself unless you really wanna go into it. :wink:


No point them out! I'm almost impossible to offend.



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26 Sep 2011, 9:35 pm

donnie_darko wrote:
Descartes wrote:
You'd probably be surprised, but the "issue" of teenage rebellion dates way back to the 1950s. There was an article in Newsweek from 1954 entitled Let's Face It: Our Teenagers Are Out Of Control. Also, have you seen movies from the '50s starring James Dean (such as Rebel Without A Cause)? Teenage rebellion was a real issue in the '50s, and historians theorize that it was due to the fact that teenagers in the post-WWII age experienced more freedom to do whatever they want than the generations before them. During and prior to WWII, teenagers were mostly expected to work alongside their parents. Or so I've read.

I disagree about your point about cursing being more common today than it was a couple of decades ago. Just yesterday, I saw a movie from 1976, and it was full of foul language. :wink:


Was that movie Taxi Driver by any chance? :D Nah, cussing was definitely around and common enough, before the 90s. The difference is that back in the 70s, only badass metal groups and stuff cussed for the most part, while now, it's pretty unusual if you're a pop star if you don't have at least a couple songs that drop some kind of bomb.

I don't think a show like South Park could have become successful even in the first half of the 90s, unless it was like a VHS-only deal and wasn't broadcast. Even then the humor was probably too 21st century.

And yes it's true teenage rebellion really began in the 50s, though there was even a taste of it in the '20s with the flappers and all, that's probably more young adults in their 20s though. I see the era of teen rebellion as lasting from the late 1940s to early 2000s. Essentially it's dead now since parents are kids' friends and stuff. Which I guess is a good thing.


The movie I watched was Carrie, which is based off the Stephen King novel that was published in the early 1970s. Even the novel version of the movie, whose main characters are mostly teenagers, has a lot of foul language.

The cultural atmosphere of the '20s has a strong parallel to that of the '50s. Both periods were immediately following a major war, and the economy of both periods was booming. Organized crime was probably worse during the '20s, mostly due to Prohibition.

The "rebellion" of that period was probably mostly perpetrated by women, who began to wear shorter skirts, dance provocatively, and dress "boyishly," by cutting their hair short and wearing loose clothing that de-emphazied their bust and waist areas. The reason for this new outlandish behavior was probably due to the fact that women nationwide were finally able to vote. Some historians say that the '20s was a sexual revolution all on its own.


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26 Sep 2011, 9:54 pm

The 90's sure had some good music though. 8)


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