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shortfatbalduglyman
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27 Apr 2025, 10:58 pm

Rapidly getting much physically weaker and weaker and only 42

Yesterday saw an old man and old woman lift a litterbox. They were about my height and weight

Today, lumber associate Lili lifted a pallet, while I was looking for the pallet jack. She's only about 4'9 and I tried and failed to lift the pallet but it was too heavy

Suspect osteoporosis or arthritis or something like that

Entire worthless corpse going limp



BillyTree
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28 Apr 2025, 6:50 am

You should do strenght training if you don't want to get weaker. There's no way around that.


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kokopelli
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28 Apr 2025, 6:53 am

BillyTree wrote:
You should do strenght training if you don't want to get weaker. There's no way around that.


Exactly.

And the older we get, the harder it is to maintain strength. A friend of mine in his mid 70's had some minor surgery four of months ago and was not allowed to work out the month before and the two months after. He said that it is proving to be much harder to regain his strength than he had expected.



shortfatbalduglyman
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28 Apr 2025, 7:02 pm

my job has heavy lifting in it.

exhausted on days off. can barely sit up. find it hard to make any slightest movement.

paranoid of undiagnosed medical condition.

no gym membership. $$$$

besides, "nature versus nuture".

osteoporosis
arthritis



BillyTree
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29 Apr 2025, 8:10 am

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
my job has heavy lifting in it.

exhausted on days off. can barely sit up. find it hard to make any slightest movement.


That is not healthy. If possible you should try to take some rest during your working hours to be able to do some cardio and weight training on your days off. You need to improve your physical capability to break this cirlce of exhaustion.


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gwynfryn
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29 Apr 2025, 9:56 am

BillyTree wrote:
You should do strenght training if you don't want to get weaker. There's no way around that.


True, but happily, having studied the subject for around 35 years, I can tell you it's actually a lot easier than most people imagine!

A bit of history first. ask most "experienced" weight trainers, and they'll recommend endless sets of multiple exercises, done several time a week, largely because that's what they've always done, having never tried any other way. This is despite the likes of Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer advocating brief high intensity work outs, followed by ample rest and recovery. Mentzer recommended that his HIT be done every 5 days or so, and some, like multi Olympia winner Dorian Yates, have used this with great success, and maybe its the best way for people in their prime. I worked for me when I eventually decided to try it (I was a reluctant starter, but the results changed all that) but that was 30 years ago.

I spent a few years varying the rest periods (among other things) and found the recovery curve didn't max out until the 9th to 11th day (nobody wants to believe this) and so opted for once a week training (for the sake of convenience) which gave steady results. Recently, being no longer tied to the 9 to 5, prompted by a missed session due to bad whether, I've decided to do alternative Sundays and Thursdays, around three times a month, due to having made the best gains for an age on my return. It would be unwise to read too much into this, but being 70 may be something to do with it.

For equipment I'm restricted to municipal body weight machines; a sort of machine squat "bench" press, and a simple "lat" pull down, carrying a shoulder bag to add weights, which until recently kept me in the optimal 8 to 12 rep range, but having to walk a considerable distance to get there, this has reached its limit, so the reps should go up, if last Thursdays outstanding result continues. I'll keep you posted.

For anyone just starting, or restarting, with limited funds, I suggest the following; get hold of a bar of some kind (water pipe or similar will do) and some weights (I got most of mine in a fire sale, and are now in storage, awaiting a time when I have room for my own gym) and try doing dead lifts, one a week. Take it easy to begin with, using a weight you can easily lift 10 times, then, on subsequent weeks, you add a little more weight until you can't do 8 reps. For the following session, you should strip off some of the weights and restart the cycle, from around 8 reps or so (but it's not mandatory, if you can do just five, that's fine, but don't add more weights until you can do 12 reps again.

The logic here is that, to provoke an anabolic response, you need to start with a major leg exercise, the strongest muscle groups (any kind of squat will also do, if available) and dead lifts are fine for that. As you move to weaker muscle groups, the return diminishes, but if you can get in exercises for other muscle groups, all the better. With just a bar, you can add upright and bent over rows, and maybe an overhead press, which combined with chair dips, makes for a pretty complete all round work out.

Sure, you can also do stuff like bicep and wrist curls, but, though they will strengthen your arms and improve your grip strength, they are largely just cosmetic as far as overall muscle growth goes; concentrate on dead lifts or squats for best results.

One important point; you need to keep a log of all your weights and repetitions, for comparison with future results; it's the only way you can be sure you are making improvements.

Lastly, you may be sore the next morning, after your early workouts (known as DOMS) but it's nothing to worry about and will disappear with time.

You have nothing to lose by trying this system.



shortfatbalduglyman
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29 Apr 2025, 11:34 am

:jester:

BillyTree wrote:
shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
my job has heavy lifting in it.

exhausted on days off. can barely sit up. find it hard to make any slightest movement.


That is not healthy. If possible you should try to take some rest during your working hours to be able to do some cardio and weight training on your days off. You need to improve your physical capability to break this cirlce of exhaustion.

___________________________


"Take some rest during your working hours". The micromanaging supervisor and head cashiers won't let me do that. The fact that no matter how great a job I did, nothing good will happen, and if I did nothing, nothing bad would happen (besides that I get made redundant), has nothing to do with it

42 need rest and sleep



BillyTree
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29 Apr 2025, 2:16 pm

gwynfryn wrote:
BillyTree wrote:
You should do strenght training if you don't want to get weaker. There's no way around that.


True, but happily, having studied the subject for around 35 years, I can tell you it's actually a lot easier than most people imagine!

A bit of history first. ask most "experienced" weight trainers, and they'll recommend endless sets of multiple exercises, done several time a week, largely because that's what they've always done, having never tried any other way. This is despite the likes of Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer advocating brief high intensity work outs, followed by ample rest and recovery. Mentzer recommended that his HIT be done every 5 days or so, and some, like multi Olympia winner Dorian Yates, have used this with great success, and maybe its the best way for people in their prime. I worked for me when I eventually decided to try it (I was a reluctant starter, but the results changed all that) but that was 30 years ago.

I spent a few years varying the rest periods (among other things) and found the recovery curve didn't max out until the 9th to 11th day (nobody wants to believe this) and so opted for once a week training (for the sake of convenience) which gave steady results. Recently, being no longer tied to the 9 to 5, prompted by a missed session due to bad whether, I've decided to do alternative Sundays and Thursdays, around three times a month, due to having made the best gains for an age on my return. It would be unwise to read too much into this, but being 70 may be something to do with it.

For equipment I'm restricted to municipal body weight machines; a sort of machine squat "bench" press, and a simple "lat" pull down, carrying a shoulder bag to add weights, which until recently kept me in the optimal 8 to 12 rep range, but having to walk a considerable distance to get there, this has reached its limit, so the reps should go up, if last Thursdays outstanding result continues. I'll keep you posted.

For anyone just starting, or restarting, with limited funds, I suggest the following; get hold of a bar of some kind (water pipe or similar will do) and some weights (I got most of mine in a fire sale, and are now in storage, awaiting a time when I have room for my own gym) and try doing dead lifts, one a week. Take it easy to begin with, using a weight you can easily lift 10 times, then, on subsequent weeks, you add a little more weight until you can't do 8 reps. For the following session, you should strip off some of the weights and restart the cycle, from around 8 reps or so (but it's not mandatory, if you can do just five, that's fine, but don't add more weights until you can do 12 reps again.

The logic here is that, to provoke an anabolic response, you need to start with a major leg exercise, the strongest muscle groups (any kind of squat will also do, if available) and dead lifts are fine for that. As you move to weaker muscle groups, the return diminishes, but if you can get in exercises for other muscle groups, all the better. With just a bar, you can add upright and bent over rows, and maybe an overhead press, which combined with chair dips, makes for a pretty complete all round work out.

Sure, you can also do stuff like bicep and wrist curls, but, though they will strengthen your arms and improve your grip strength, they are largely just cosmetic as far as overall muscle growth goes; concentrate on dead lifts or squats for best results.

One important point; you need to keep a log of all your weights and repetitions, for comparison with future results; it's the only way you can be sure you are making improvements.

Lastly, you may be sore the next morning, after your early workouts (known as DOMS) but it's nothing to worry about and will disappear with time.

You have nothing to lose by trying this system.


I know that I would get better results if I followed that concept to the book, but I need the training too much. If I take 2-3 days off I start feeling slightly depressed. When I started lifting weights 15 years ago I worked out 4-5 days a week and did 4-5 sets of every exercise. I knew that was too much for me to recover from but it took me several years to actually cut back to 3 times a week. Next step after a couple of more years was to only do 2-3 sets, and the step after that to do fewer exercises. For the last year I have managed to cut down to 2-3 days a week, 1-2 sets of a few compound exercises. Every time I have lowered the volume and increased the intensity I have put on more muscle mass and got stronger. Maybe one day I will be able to stick to one intensive workout a week.


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gwynfryn
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30 Apr 2025, 10:39 am

BillyTree wrote:
Every time I have lowered the volume and increased the intensity I have put on more muscle mass and got stronger. Maybe one day I will be able to stick to one intensive workout a week.


Well done; you've got ahead of more than 99% of those I've encountered who do weight training, who seem incapable of even considering any method other than their own cherished system (though it's different to everybody else's)!

I get the bit about not being able to stay away; following extraordinary results after missing a Sunday work out, I've decided to try 10 day rest periods, which has left me decidedly uncomfortable. In a few weeks, unless I have concrete evidence of the superiority of my new routine, I expect I'll be glad to get back to once a week (just as I once needed three times a week). It's a matter of degree, it seems, modified by whatever other ways we have of passing the time (an acute problem for me as I can't abide french television, an getting reading matter in English is a bind).

You at least have the incentive of previous experience, and I expect you are looking for other pastimes, and as the saying goes, time heals.



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30 Apr 2025, 11:33 am

I think the OP needs to be checked by a doctor. That it is happening rapidly has me concerned.


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shortfatbalduglyman
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30 Apr 2025, 11:42 am

ASPart of me

My sister is a doctor and she said that she doesn't think I have a medical condition, just strenuous job

____________

January 2024, when I was as exhausted and physically weak as I am now , all my blood work came in the standard reference range , with four exceptions, and those just barely out of the correct range

June 2024, home Depot had the nerve to tell me to get a doctor to fill out a form. The form allowed me a work accommodation of not lifting over fifty pounds. The doctor wrote that the accommodations last only one year. It has almost been an entire year. I am afraid that if I tell the doctor about the weakness and fatigue, the doctor will refuse to sign the form, I get made redundant and end up homeless



ASPartOfMe
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30 Apr 2025, 6:10 pm

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
ASPart of me

My sister is a doctor and she said that she doesn't think I have a medical condition, just strenuous job

____________

January 2024, when I was as exhausted and physically weak as I am now , all my blood work came in the standard reference range , with four exceptions, and those just barely out of the correct range

June 2024, home Depot had the nerve to tell me to get a doctor to fill out a form. The form allowed me a work accommodation of not lifting over fifty pounds. The doctor wrote that the accommodations last only one year. It has almost been an entire year. I am afraid that if I tell the doctor about the weakness and fatigue, the doctor will refuse to sign the form, I get made redundant and end up homeless


Thanks for the info.


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ToughDiamond
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30 Apr 2025, 8:49 pm

Well it's good that at least one doctor (your sister, who presumably cares about you more than the health service does) says there doesn't seem to be anything wrong enough to need medical intervention. Though it would be nice to get a second opinion. Not that I practice what I "preach," but that doesn't necessarily make it bad advice. I'm not used to the way the US charges for medical services, and the UK doctors I've seen in the past x years haven't inspired my confidence. So my circumstances are probably different to yours.

Wasn't it you who successfully completed a half-marathon run recently?

Just wondering, how are the results of these physical fitness exercises measured? Or is it just subjectively so obvious that it's not worth measuring?



MatchboxVagabond
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30 Apr 2025, 9:18 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
I think the OP needs to be checked by a doctor. That it is happening rapidly has me concerned.

That's my thought. There's a bunch of things like hormones that could be causing that. If that comes back, there's a bunch of options that are cheap or free for exercise. But, any time you're wanting to exercise because things seems not quite right, a trip to the doctor is probably a good idea.



pokeystinker
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01 May 2025, 12:32 am

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
Rapidly getting much physically weaker and weaker and only 42

Yesterday saw an old man and old woman lift a litterbox. They were about my height and weight

Today, lumber associate Lili lifted a pallet, while I was looking for the pallet jack. She's only about 4'9 and I tried and failed to lift the pallet but it was too heavy

Suspect osteoporosis or arthritis or something like that

Entire worthless corpse going limp


Never had much strength to begin with and I'm losing it too.


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shortfatbalduglyman
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01 May 2025, 6:26 pm

ToughDiamond wrote:
Well it's good that at least one doctor (your sister, who presumably cares about you more than the health service does) says there doesn't seem to be anything wrong enough to need medical intervention. Though it would be nice to get a second opinion.

If/when the doctor refuses to sign the work accommodations form that allows me to lift only fifty pounds, or if/when Home Depot has the nerve to make my worthless corpse redundant, or if/when i get hit by a car, or if/when i become eligible for government benefits, or something like that happens, then i will get a second opinion. however, i am afraid that if i tell my current physician how i have to struggle to stay awake, every waking second, and how it takes a lot of energy for me to even sit down instead of lying down, or how every slightest movement takes a lot of effort, then maybe the physician will refuse to sign the form. then home depot will have the nerve to make my worthless corpse redundant.

Not that I practice what I "preach," but that doesn't necessarily make it bad advice. I'm not used to the way the US charges for medical services, and the UK doctors I've seen in the past x years haven't inspired my confidence. So my circumstances are probably different to yours.

yes, your circumstances are different from mine, in that i have never gone to the UK.

Wasn't it you who successfully completed a half-marathon run recently?

november 2024, half marathon. "successfully completed." not an impressive time, 2:40. but whatever.

Just wondering, how are the results of these physical fitness exercises measured? Or is it just subjectively so obvious that it's not worth measuring?


what "physical exercises"? i didn't mention anything about "physical exercises".