Why isn't OCD or asthma a fad, but apparently AS/HFA is?
So they were brushing it off as something not to care much about?
goodness no! Asthma is definately something to care about! But the attitude was that asthma was very common and it wasn't a rare thing to have asthma. Now it seems it is far more common than it was when I was a child, but then, I might have been ignorant of the prevelence.
I remember this too. There were magazine articles fretting about the rise in asthma diagnosis and wondering what was causing it. There were those who said it was the natural outcome of air pollution and crumbling old apartment buildings that children lived in (this actually is very reasonable and probably true). There were others who said that was all nonsense and wimpy kids were just looking for an excuse to get out of gym and we need to be more rigorous in demanding physical exertion from the children. And so on.
And then, over time, people just stopped talking about it. You still see kids with inhalers, but adults have stopped accusing them of just trying to duck gym and turned their sights on kids with ADHD or Aspergers diagnoses and said those kids are just trying to duck responsibilities.
Whenever an increasing number of kids are diagnosed with something that is not fatal, they (or their parents) will be accused of trying to duck responsibilities. Next up...bipolar.
Most would consider Down Syndrome to be real. Something I found interesting is there are tests to see how good you are at reading social situations. Those with Down Syndrome do better on tests of picking up on social situations than those with AS/HFA, which shows that it's not intelligence but rather social impairments. It's interesting because those with AS/HFA do better than Down Syndrome on cause-effect cognition tests.
That's very interesting. Do you have a source for this fact? Not saying I don't believe it but I'd like to reference this if true. My skepticism is based on my own belief that someone with Down Syndrome would not be better in a social situation than myself as someone on the spectrum. And that in no way is meant to sound like I am underestimating or dismissing someone with Down's. Maybe it's because I may have superior cognitive abilities so I have used this advantage to learn my way through social situations (which for the most part today I avoid anyway). Also, is this likely to hold true in most/all comparisons between someone with Down's and someone with an autism spectrum disorder, or does it depend on how severe your case of autism is? In the study you reference, is the person with Down's far superior to the person with AS/HFA in picking up on social situations, or is it only a slight advantage?
I have an anecdotal source: my daughter's special ed program (she is in elementary school). I have seen with my own eyes how much better the two kids with Down's Syndrome are in social situations than she is with her autism. Admittedly it's a small sample, but I saw them doing things naturally that she needs extensive coaching to do, such as greeting others. You might say, "maybe they were extensively coached too" but I just don't think so. They did these social things with such utter ease it looked natural.
I think AS has become a fad. I hear AD/HD was a fad in the 90's and now in the 2000's AS became one. Now I wonder what the next condition will be this decade to become a fad?
In the 80's asthma was a fad it looks like because it was all over the media. I wonder what condition was a fad in the 70's and 60's and 50's?
This is largely human nature at work. My experience with people who are different in ways that have not gained widespread acceptance is that there will always be some people who, upon finally acquiring an understanding of their difficulties and a validation of sorts that they are not sick in the head or worthless screw-ups, develop a tendency for exclusiveness toward those with related conditions that might threaten the legitimacy or acceptance of their newfound sense of self. In the autistic community, the rift you see is not only between diagnosed ("legitimate") vs. undiagnosed ("fake"), but also between more and less severe ("overdiagnosis"). Once an autistic person, who likely never truly belonged anywhere before, becomes at home in the autistic community, it is not unnatural, or even unreasonable, to at least subconsciously want that community to remain somewhat "pure", rather than become diluted by people with seemingly peripherally-related or much less serious conditions that may weaken their hard-won acceptance.
Lest you believe that this type of territorial thinking is the exclusive domain of autism, try visiting transgender or intersex communities and check out the animosity (and outright vitriol) between the "authentic" group and those accused of diluting the club's legitimacy. Intersex people, having gained a significant degree of acceptance, do not want to dilute their pool by accepting that many transsexuals are neurologically intersexed. Many transsexual groups, having gained at least some recognition that their is a medical underpinning to their condition, tend to exclude other varieties of gender variance, again for the common theme of not losing whatever acceptance ground they may have gained. The higher the stakes, the worse the conflict tends to be.
In my experience, as a whole the autistic community is quite accepting of all autistics, regardless of the nature and severity of their autism, regardless of their functioning level, and, for the most part, regardless of whether they are professionally diagnosed.
i don't think i ever seen it better put, i to have those feelings, i being medical diagnosed, i feel slightly threaten by all the media attention its getting, at the same time im hopeful, that by educating people about it may make our lifes easier, for im one of those people who do see it is a potential genetic advantage, and i also think one of the main things holding us back is society at large, but i think with this attention were getting it may better educate people on as, and help us fufill our potential better in society.
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i would like to point out, ive never bin anti 'self diagnosed' but i do fear the fad status of it. i feel the media attention is a double sided sword, the exposure might make it ezer for people in general to understand us, but i fear it might make people think were full of s**t who seen some stuff about it, but are still ignorant, but i think it will do a lot more good than bad in the long run,
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I notice online people seem to assume every aspie they see is self diagnosed. They also seem to assume anyone who is diagnosed with it these days was misdiagnosed because AS is being "over diagnosed." So I always say I was diagnosed with AS in 1997 before it became a fad so they take me seriously. Back then it was still fairly new and been in the DSM for three years. I don't think many AS diagnoses was made then compare to now. But I think it's under diagnosed in adults.
Some people already think AS is made up and an excuse. They think it's a new word for being socially awkward or if you don't fit in or for being a geek or nerd.
I am unsure if AS is over diagnosed or not in kids. It might seem like it is because AS AS AS what we hear in the media a lot. The whole spectrum I mean.
The thing with Down syndrome is that your basic global developmental delay is measured with IQ tests; and IQ tests measure skills that center mostly around academics. Down syndrome people often aren't nearly as delayed when it comes to social skills; some actually learn them as fast as their typical peers, and many have social skills as a relative strength. That's possibly the origin of the grain of truth in the stereotype of the happy, sociable Down's child (which is annoying; but at least it isn't as bad as the soulless-child autism stereotype). Most are delayed in social skills like in everything else; there are courses to teach them how to get around in the social world; but as far as comparison to autism/AS goes, they'll leave us in the dust most of the time. Autism seems to create, most of the time, such a glaring weakness in social skills that the same low level of social talent in someone with more evened-out skills would probably be found in someone a great deal more delayed than the average Down's individual.
Actually, I remember some of the stuff I learned about profound mental retardation during the whole Ashley debacle, and some of those kids can do things in the social realm that I couldn't do at their age... things like back-and-forth conversations (with sounds or single words, but still), and getting information from eye contact and facial expressions. Autism just hits the social skills so hard that it makes sense to compare us to Down's kids to quantify the exact difference between specific autism-related problems and global delays, and it's easier to match by developmental levels by using Down's controls when you run out of NTs at the delayed end of the autistic development spectrum. Of course then there's the problem of how you define developmental levels when your autistic subjects are probably at several different spots simultaneously; but we'll leave that up to the (likely severely confused) researchers.
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Most would consider Down Syndrome to be real. Something I found interesting is there are tests to see how good you are at reading social situations. Those with Down Syndrome do better on tests of picking up on social situations than those with AS/HFA, which shows that it's not intelligence but rather social impairments. It's interesting because those with AS/HFA do better than Down Syndrome on cause-effect cognition tests.
That's very interesting. Do you have a source for this fact? Not saying I don't believe it but I'd like to reference this if true. My skepticism is based on my own belief that someone with Down Syndrome would not be better in a social situation than myself as someone on the spectrum. And that in no way is meant to sound like I am underestimating or dismissing someone with Down's. Maybe it's because I may have superior cognitive abilities so I have used this advantage to learn my way through social situations (which for the most part today I avoid anyway). Also, is this likely to hold true in most/all comparisons between someone with Down's and someone with an autism spectrum disorder, or does it depend on how severe your case of autism is? In the study you reference, is the person with Down's far superior to the person with AS/HFA in picking up on social situations, or is it only a slight advantage?
I have an anecdotal source: my daughter's special ed program (she is in elementary school). I have seen with my own eyes how much better the two kids with Down's Syndrome are in social situations than she is with her autism. Admittedly it's a small sample, but I saw them doing things naturally that she needs extensive coaching to do, such as greeting others. You might say, "maybe they were extensively coached too" but I just don't think so. They did these social things with such utter ease it looked natural.
That's interesting. I wonder if there are more who work with special ed everywhere who notice that? I think I've heard others say that.
Well, I think the "fad" affects how much the mental health professionals want to consider it. I mean seriously, he said he was hesitant to even talk to me about AS because of how much it is over diagnosed, but he's not squeamish about slapping on a label of OCD just because I used the word obsessive to describe myself one day. He later took off OCD when I protested against it.
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I agree...I hear the OCD thing all the time. I have only heard one person talk about being somewhat near the criteria for autism/asperger's, this was very recently and it is the very first person I've ever met in my 41 years outside of here who did this. And it was someone who of all the people I have met in my life (aside from my brother who is textbook as can be) I would have put them as possibly on the spectrum, most definitely. And when they said it I told them so. They had taken an online test and seemed a bit surprised at their score. It is a friend who is very artistic and very 'odd' and always has been, since I met him almost 20 years ago. A very gentle soul and very childlike, and really, unlike anyone else I've ever met in my whole life.
But I hear the OCD thing and the ADD thing bandied about almost daily. I am suspicious that because of the association with savant abilities of autism it automatically triggers a bit of envy in people for some reason, even though a minority of autistics have these abilities.
Some people already think AS is made up and an excuse. They think it's a new word for being socially awkward or if you don't fit in or for being a geek or nerd.
now I am really starting to wonder if society is afraid of losing it's one down people, it's targets. I mean, what if instead of all the negative associations people put on the 'geek or nerd' as stated, people suddenly have to think harder...instead of seeing these people in lack they have to see people as wholly and utterly different from themselves. Kind of the same way society used to view gay people, as deficient or failed straight people, and there are still some people out there who resent having to look at gay people as anything but deviant. And maybe people resent having to see people like this as something other than deficient or deviating from a social norm, but instead different altogether and therefore not, as assumed, natural and deserving targets of letting off steam. And they go 'oh, a fad' because they just don't want to think that hard, and shift a paradigm, which is hard work.
wendigopsychosis
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Joined: 11 Apr 2010
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Actually, I think OCD is also a fad...
I've heard many people talk about how they're "sooOOOooo OCD (insert awkward polite laughter that women do)."
So I don't know...
Though I think I understand the point the OP's trying to make.
From what I've gathered, a lot of people use Asperger's as an excuse for why they're a virgin with no friends. Instead of trying to improve themselves, they try to put a label on it so they don't feel so weird.
Things like asthma are more of a medical problem, so things like that don't tend to become fads.
Mental things tend to be fads on the whole, I think. Lots of people like to self diagnose themselves with BPD, bipolar disorder, etc etc, because they feel like it gives them a "reason" for doing what they do.
I believe it's a fad. And I place much of the blame on the phony "liberal" bourgeois for this. Keep in mind, i'm more to the "left" on just about every issue than the vast majority of so-called liberals in this country. I don't care how much they agree with me on the social and cultural issues, I still see through their vomit-inducing hypocrisy.
You see....these type of "liberals" claim a United colors of Benetton love of diversity.
After all....one can no longer proudly pin a good guy/girl to their lapel these days unless they pay lip-service to the importance of respecting and supporting "diversity".
However....the line is drawn at cool diverse groups and individuals. The black person who makes snappy hip-hop music these liberals swoon over is cool. He's the first one on the liberal VIP list...cuz' that's a covenient way for them to flaunt their "diversity" credentials. The same liberals who are sure to call the police when the homeless black Vietnam veteran dares set foot in their neighborhoods.
Ditto for Aspies....let's show how "diverse" and "inclusive" we are by asking that quirky-but-brilliant Aspie Actuarial to the office Christmas party. Later on we can sneak a few good laughs at the Down Syndrome kid who bags our groceries at Piggly-Wiggly. We would never DREAM of inviting HIM to our party. More importantly....we would never DREAM of advocating for him like we do for the "cooler" black, gay and Aspie folks. After all....THEY have something to OFFER us. THEY make great music we can dance to and wear hip clothes. THEY DESIGN the hip clothes and show us how to redecorate our homes in Marin county. And THEY make computers scream and tell us all sorts of neat stuff about science.
But woe unto the less glamorous, sexy and "useful" diverse ones. Woe unto the millions of poor black Americans who, for all intents and purposes, aren't even ALLOWED in Marin county. Woe unto the gay guy who just drives a taxi for a living and can't tell you anything about the latest fashions. And woe unto the "low-functioning" autistic who can't work wonders with computers or tell you about all about the electron wave model. The much-heralded "love of diversity" stops with these "untouchables".
Needless to say.....Madison ave. and big business in general picked up on this fad shortly after it's inception.
In fact...i'm surprised there's not a pop group made up of nerd-chic sexy Aspie Wunderkinds yet. Then the "liberal" entertainment media could wax poetic about what a triumphant step this is for "diversity".
They could tell us about how wonderful it is that those with autistic spectrum disorders have finally arrived, following in the footsteps of their female, African-American and Homosexual brothers and sisters.
Meanwhile....millions of blacks and hispanics remain in grinding poverty and millions of unsexy and "useless" mentally ill people remain homeless (many of them Vietnam Vets....so much for "honoring the troops" eh?) and millions of "low-functioning" people with neuropsychological differences are essentially without services and any chance of improving their circumstances.
So ain't that America eh? And ain't that the smug and contemptible frauds who have the unmitigated audacity to call themselves "liberals"?
wendigopsychosis
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Joined: 11 Apr 2010
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I come from an extremely liberal part of western MA, and I absolutely hate that liberals think of themselves as somehow more "open minded" than conservatives.
In my high school, if you declared yourself to be anything but insanely liberal, everyone immediately asked, "Wait, are you a republican?" as though someone with a differing view point was somehow the bad guy. Now, I'm not a republican, and I absolutely hate both of the mainstream parties, but I think there's something inherently wrong with the "good guys and bad guys" thing we have going on.
Liberals are no more open minded than their conservative counterparts.
I had a high school art teacher who was talking about how he loves my town, because he used to teach at a catholic all-boys school, and they were all very religious, conservative, and closed minded; he loved our town because people were so much more "accepting," here.
I raised my hand and told him that we are no more accepting, we simply agree with him. Where in his old school he was shunned for being a liberal, here he is embraced. But if any of the catholic boys tried to join the school over here, they would be ostracized, hated, total outcasts...
Not that it's in any way bad to fight for the rights of genocide victims, the gay community, the autistic community, etc etc. But to say that one system (that doesn't accept the other, and hates it back with just as much fire) is "open minded," is simply being naive...
This is true for so many things.
Needless to say in America the shallow. Actually things aren't much better in other countries like France considering the way they fawn all over the so-called "intellectuals".
You know..... famous philosopher or writer="intellectual".
Top notch auto mechanic or machinist=blue collar nobody