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Surfman
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27 Aug 2010, 6:13 pm

I was thinking how I always used to get suckered into being part of religious organisations, when I didnt know I was an aspie, or when I was frustrated and lonely, feeling different and left out.

Looking back, it must be easy for people to recruit new church members from aspies.

The first AS support meeting I went to had a Christian leader and another Christian in the crowd, who flirted about with everyone, and brought up his Christian faith in conversation to everyone there.

Meaning well is all good and fine, but to my mind this reeks of taking advantage of vulnerable people...

Please forgive my impertinence god, but I'm from NZ and we Kiwis are some of the most irreligious people in the world.

On other forums I have upset others from religious countries, because I am now quite irreligious, even though I consider myself a spiritual person. I used to live in a monastery and wake at 4am every day

Have other people here had a similar experience? Where you have gone along for the sorely needed company with nice kind people, even though you dont give a hoot about worshipping a deity in a group setting?

Sorry if I'm offensive to religious people here, I just think approaching people with a mental disability to join your church, is somewhat inappropriate behaviour



Willard
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27 Aug 2010, 7:15 pm

...



Last edited by Willard on 01 Sep 2010, 11:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

LadybugQ
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27 Aug 2010, 7:16 pm

Meaning well is all good and fine, but to my mind this reeks of taking advantage of vulnerable people...

Precisely! As a person who is baptized and confirmed in the Episcopal Church, I'm not offended by your description at all ;) "Christians" can be even more manipulative than standard groups, I've learned.


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Horus
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27 Aug 2010, 7:53 pm

No....i've personally never done anything to seek out company as i've never felt it was "sorely needed".

Quite the opposite would be true in my case. I suppose this comes with the territory with schizoid personality disorder, at least in my case.


I am the furthest thing from religious or spiritual either. While I am fascinated by the occult and alternative spirituality in general, I take all that with a major grain of salt as well. Thus...I define myself as an atheist/materialist who BELIEVES nothing exists beyond the physical universe, but I don't claim to KNOW that nothing does.



pgd
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27 Aug 2010, 8:04 pm

Spirituality, religion and aspergers - In my view when a person is correctly diagnosed with a neurological challenge which involves the human brain/mind, that diagnosis can naturally raise a list of questions as to what a person was taught about non-profit religions and God and how all of that fits into/doesn't fit into such a correct neurological diagnosis.

http://www.beliefnet.com/

For myself, such a clash, at times, in definitions/expectations has caused me to view the meaning of some non-profit religious writings to be symbolic rather than literal in meaning.

Over the years I've also asked myself what is behind the drive and ambition of a number of high profile, non-profit religious leaders around the world and my conclusion today is that, at least for some of them (not all), they have great acting talent and are willing to play narrow religious roles in exchange for non-profit, tax-exempt status, fame, and great wealth. Many pew renters, to them, are expendable as long as they can keep their theatrical religious gig going from year to year.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leap_of_Faith_(film)

Today I also tend to lean toward religious science fiction as providing some kind of truth or items to meditate on - especially stories which are clearly told under the literary device of a dream.

http://www.pilgrimsprogressthemovie.com/

It's very clear to me that faith can change the lives of a number of people (not everyone) and that those changes are 100% real for whatever reason for those persons.

I simply cannot conclude that faith is balderdash in all cases at all.

In some cases (not all cases) I do conclude that faith is nothing but balderdash.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Spanis ... nty_Python)



DemonAbyss10
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27 Aug 2010, 9:07 pm

Willard wrote:
I grew up with a useless dead religion shoved down my throat and while I'm interested in understanding different belief systems and why groups of people see spirituality from varying perspectives, someone proselytizing their personal faith to me p*sses me off faster than about anything else they can do. Anyone starts that crap around me and just walking out of the room is the nicest thing I'm liable to do. I don't want to hear how wonderfully God has treated you - he forced me to live with Autism, so he can kiss my @ss. :evil:


I am exactly the same way. I have actually trolled the hell out of the local jehovas branch because they irritate me so much.


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Horus
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27 Aug 2010, 9:40 pm

Willard wrote:
I grew up with a useless dead religion shoved down my throat and while I'm interested in understanding different belief systems and why groups of people see spirituality from varying perspectives, someone proselytizing their personal faith to me p*sses me off faster than about anything else they can do. Anyone starts that crap around me and just walking out of the room is the nicest thing I'm liable to do. I don't want to hear how wonderfully God has treated you - he forced me to live with Autism, so he can kiss my @ss. :evil:




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27 Aug 2010, 9:42 pm

DemonAbyss10 wrote:
Willard wrote:
I grew up with a useless dead religion shoved down my throat and while I'm interested in understanding different belief systems and why groups of people see spirituality from varying perspectives, someone proselytizing their personal faith to me p*sses me off faster than about anything else they can do. Anyone starts that crap around me and just walking out of the room is the nicest thing I'm liable to do. I don't want to hear how wonderfully God has treated you - he forced me to live with Autism, so he can kiss my @ss. :evil:


I am exactly the same way. I have actually trolled the hell out of the local jehovas branch because they irritate me so much.


:cheers: they are so annoying forcing their belief and social interaction.



CockneyRebel
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27 Aug 2010, 9:46 pm

I'm a Christian.


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buryuntime
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27 Aug 2010, 9:55 pm

How am I to know if a religious person is wanting to communicate with me because they actually like me or if I'm just part of their agenda to recruiting more people to God? I don't like that idea.



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27 Aug 2010, 10:23 pm

I've often wondered about how other Aspies process religion and god. I remember as a child never understanding the concept of god. It didn't make sense, and still doesn't. I've read the bible, and that made even less sense. I grew up in a very christian household, so it's not like I only went to church during holidays. it was every week, plus the bible study nonsense. I actually hated bible study because no one could answer my questions, or refused to answer them, even though we were "encouraged" to ask questions.

Now I am not Mr. Vulcan over here, I so do love a good fairy tale and ghost story. Hell, one of my interests is mythology, but that is just how I view god and all religious beliefs; myths, fairy tales, legends and ghost stories. Nothing more.



adifferentname
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27 Aug 2010, 10:29 pm

SteamPowerDev wrote:
I've often wondered about how other Aspies process religion and god. I remember as a child never understanding the concept of god. It didn't make sense, and still doesn't. I've read the bible, and that made even less sense. I grew up in a very christian household, so it's not like I only went to church during holidays. it was every week, plus the bible study nonsense. I actually hated bible study because no one could answer my questions, or refused to answer them, even though we were "encouraged" to ask questions.

Now I am not Mr. Vulcan over here, I so do love a good fairy tale and ghost story. Hell, one of my interests is mythology, but that is just how I view god and all religious beliefs; myths, fairy tales, legends and ghost stories. Nothing more.


I had some similar experiences to yourself. I remember being scorned for suggesting that an omniscient God is proof that we lack free will. If our futures are set in stone then my decision to turn away from those teachings is pre-determined, thus gaining me justification for any past sins were I to be proved wrong and find myself before the pearly gates.

I've yet to find a Christian who could give me a satisfactory answer to that one.



eon
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27 Aug 2010, 10:43 pm

I'm in agreement with a lot of you. god didn't make sense to me as a kid. i was really swept along though by the forced participation. i would call myself persuaded by it due to susceptibility! i find it mythologically interesting but have always felt that an omniscient being would have to lack free will also. interesting philosophically. we can't ever claim to know a perspective on the grand scheme of time, but agnosticism is pretty weak too in my opinion.

i had a special interest in atheistic ideas and it has dominated my thought process for the past years, sort of leading me to the path of self discovery for aspie..


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just-lou
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28 Aug 2010, 1:15 am

It's interesting that everyone seems to be taking "God" as Jehovah, God of the Jews. The "God" of the Bible. There are many, many, many other forms of god/deity which are much older.
I don't hold much with Christianity, because it's not my heritage. Same reason that in Paganism, I don't have anything to do with Hermetic Qabalah. I certainly don't believe, as Christians seem to, that there is only one true religion and everyone else is wrong or worse.
I'm a religious person. It's part of why Irish polytheism is one of my main interests, an has been for years. I believe in spirit beings - just not in an omnipotent patriarchal god. Anthropologically speaking, animism and shamanism were the first expressions of religion known to the human species. I believe in these things, and their modern progressions.
Maybe it's an aspie thing, but the physical results of Pagan practices seem to back it up, even if you're a non-theistic practitioner. I was reading recently that some of the oldest chant forms used by Pagan peoples of Scandinavia was proven to alter blood floe in the body, changing the blood flow in the brain and causing documented physiological effects. Even if those early people didn't understand this - it still works.
But that's off topic.



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28 Aug 2010, 1:21 am

"How am I to know if a religious person is wanting to communicate with me because they actually like me or if I'm just part of their agenda to recruiting more people to God? I don't like that idea."

Part 1: the one case I know where someone tried that [I have heard it is called "lovebombing] was my NT but wounded sister, who was briefly a Mormon because of thast kind recruiting.

Part 2: I have always been able to feel the difference. In my atheist days I met a lot of Christians of various types, not counting the odd Scientologist. A few of them felt so GOOD I could almost taste it. Not that they understood me better than the average, but they could accept and respect without needing full undetrstanding. Not ONE of those people - if you ask me, saints every one - ever said to me the first word of propaganda.