NT an insult?
http://web.archive.org/web/200806060241 ... nguage.htm"
lelia wrote~
I swear I've come across professional works on the internet that used the terms. "typical", and also, "neurotypical". Possibly I am remembering wrong. Nonetheless, I am almost sure I've come across books written by professionals which used the term, "neurotypical".
I don't really care one way or the other for the term. I'm not into nt bashing either though.
People may or may not want to be "typical" but the autistic spectrum is a PDD, pervasive developmental disorder. It seems it would then have to be considered a 'disorder' from what is 'typical'.
You're not remembering wrong. The term "neurotypical" was later adopted by the scientific and professional community to refer to "normal" or "typical" brain development or people without neurological disorders or disabilities. The point I was making in that other thread was that when the word neurotypical was coined by the autistic community, it was never meant to be insulting.
lelia
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I've been trying to remember the lecture I got, and since my hearing and understanding are so iffy, please forgive me if I got it wrong. I think he was referring to polls of doctors and other professions at conventions asking if they liked being referred to as neurotypical. If he was referring to polls of doctors, well of course they don't want to be called typical. They want to be called God.
Titangeek
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Oh jeez, most NT's don't even know what neurotypical means. So, how can they be offended? The ones that do know what it means only use it in reference to people on the spectrum.
was thinking about something. neurotypical could be used by any type of neurology, if it means "traits that are typical of a certain neurology".... if it's supposed to mean "typical neurology for the species" there could be a better word...
i could say "i'm pretty typical for an AS", does that not make me autistically neurotypical? or just typical. am i talking for nothing? pretty much.
I am NT and don't find the term offensive. If somebody says, "NTs are all so stupid" or "NTs are all so mean" then that's offensive (and it has been said in various threads) but it is the "stupid" and "mean" that are offensive, not "NT". But most of the time when people use the term it is just used to differentiate those on the autism spectrum from those not (except when semantics arguments break out and somebody says, "how is being bipolar 'typical'? Are they NT?" or something like that. Threads where somebody says "I'm AS but my brother is NT" or "why do NTs enjoy small talk?" are completely inoffensive.
What I find most interesting about this whole thread is the reason that the group leader (who is on the spectrum) gave for why it should not be used. He said that nobody wants to be considered "typical". It's a very revealing value judgement. Although "normal is boring" may be the motto of WrongPlanet (more or less), to many people (who have never heard the term "neurotypical" unless they have a family member on the spectrum or work in the field, and sometimes not even then), there is nothing inherently wrong with being a fairly typical member of a group. He assumes that NT/non-autistic people are offended if you say that they are similar in many ways to other people. But he's wrong. He's taken his own negative value judgement of "typical" and projected it on to NT people. It's the exact same projection error NT people make when assuming that a non-verbal autistic person is "trapped". Oh the irony.
Ha! Yeah, someone should tell Roger that they don't mind...
But if Roger wants us all to scrub that word, I propose the following alternatives
Neuro-regular
Neuro-average
Neuro-standard
Neuro-normal
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neuro-normal
i propose we call them "weirdoes"....what?
Titangeek
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I thought that I was simply naming a reality, but Roger pointed out that nobody wants to be "typical". Well, okay, so what will be the term I should use? I should say Non-spectrum, which I guess would be NS.
So there you go. I shall use the new term now.
But I'm still surprised that neurotypical is an insult. I don't consider AS to be an insult. New things to learn everyday.
If there were NTs in the group, they might think of it as an insult because maybe they have been called NT in a vehement way by someone with an ASD and people in the support group do not want to alienate people who aren't on the spectrum, or people who are and have loved ones who are not. What makes it an insult is the way it's said and the meaning behind it.
like many words, depends on how its used and the intent behind it. often on these forums, and already in this thread, its used in an insulting manner. if its being used to imply a negative about a group of people rather than to neutrally say "non-autistic", then its insulting. when it appears as an insult, its quite often as a negative generalization, such as "NT's do X to autistics" or "all NTs are X", etc.
its also very often used inaccurately, as people use it to mean both non-autistic and neurologically typical, which are not the same thing. autism is not the only neurological difference out there, and the two words, neuro and typical put together, should not mean specifically non-autistic but rather someone with typical neurological development.
the use of the term itself bugs me and i would much rather see an accurate word used, NA for non-autistic or NS for non-spectrum, or whatever. i am often surprised and confused that a group of people with a neurological condition which has formal speech and an insistence on accuracy and facts as common traits prolifically use a word that is so inaccurate.
but thats based on my own anal-not-autistic-but-not-typical-either thinking =P
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partner to: D - 40 yrs med dx classic autism
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C - 8 yrs NT
N - 15 yrs school dx AS
I thought that I was simply naming a reality, but Roger pointed out that nobody wants to be "typical". Well, okay, so what will be the term I should use? I should say Non-spectrum, which I guess would be NS.
So there you go. I shall use the new term now.
But I'm still surprised that neurotypical is an insult. I don't consider AS to be an insult. New things to learn everyday.
My sister told me that...please don't insult her. She is the only person that understands me, and she is the only friend who is close to my age, so I don't want you to try to chide her. She is more rational than me, and she teaches me about people who are NS (or whatever you call someone without a different mindset).
Isn't the autistic spectrum defined as disorder/s (with positive/negative attributes) and so beyond, or outside the range of, what is considered functional or "normal"/"typical" traits, behaviors, and neurology? I don't think it would make sense to say these were disorders, or ways of being, outside of the "non-spectrum". "Non-spectrum" is only in the negative.
I think it seems fair enough to discuss the traits and behaviors of what is considered "normal" or "typical" neurology or "mindset". I don't think that would then mean it's ok to insult all "NT's".