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LiendaBalla
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26 Feb 2011, 6:02 pm

It's like when Yoda says "Do! There is no 'try'!" As in, "Just socialize like an experianced prophessional. There is no 'trying' to socialize." :shrug: Imagine if he had none, or too few of those mini-claroforms, or whatever they call those in Star Wars....

How is he supposed to 'do' it without at least a little help? :shrug: Also, on either side there isn't anybody who actualy 'just knows' all the social clues in unfamilior places either. I find it a little ignorant.



Last edited by LiendaBalla on 26 Feb 2011, 6:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

LiendaBalla
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26 Feb 2011, 6:08 pm

I also think that kind of message is like saying "convince yourself that our happiness is your's", or "do what we want you to".



Last edited by LiendaBalla on 26 Feb 2011, 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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26 Feb 2011, 6:09 pm

StevieC wrote:
what does this even mean?

when i asked further, i was told "just be chatty, and dont look so depressed"


the first thing that came to my brain was "variable: undefined; arg not supported; return"

seriously, how do you just "be sociable"?

It means talk to people.

Compliment.
Then ask a question.

That is the basic formula. You see someone with bright red lipstick, you say,
"Hey, that looks great on you! Ever think about trying pink? I bet that would look cool."

Someone you are aquainted with gets a haircut. You are supposed to notice it and say,
"I really dig that new do. Where'd you get it done?"
People are supposed to be flattered that you want to get your hair done where they got theirs.

Whenever you feel obliged to utter, make sure you do the compliment/question thingy.

So, you just do that and before you know it, they, supposedly, like you.



E-FrameZenderblast
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26 Feb 2011, 6:39 pm

They do not realise that you are different, and find it hard. For them it is simple, and it is simple for most people, so they think it is simple for you. Even for aspies, it is difficult to comprehend being different from the way we are.



KBerg
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26 Feb 2011, 7:17 pm

Yeah, saying 'just socialize more' is... not helpful. It's the kind of thing people who have a certain skill so well ingrained they don't realize it's a skill say to people who don't have that skill at all.

What I like to try for people I am interested in having a good relationship with is remember one or two interests or people of importance in that person's life to ask after. Like with someone who runs and does crafts I ask if he's been working on anything special, if there's a lull in the conversation I'd ask him about running, if he's training for something special or if all that frost isn't making it hard lately to train. I used to keep a little book with everyone's names, numbers, birthdays and little notes and read up before I went out to socialize. I really should dig it out of storage and start using it again as I keep forgetting birthdays.

There's also a lot of just flat out faking stuff, things like complementing someone's clothes or hairstyle and ask them questions to elaborate. Sometimes you get it wrong and they go "oh, this old thing, you've seen it a dozen times before!" but you can usually cover up with something like "It just never fails to look so great on you it feels new every time!" (times like that honesty is the last thing you want to use, admitting you weren't really paying attention is a very very bad idea).

Emoting is important too, I used to be awful at showing emotions that other people could use as cues but have gotten a bit better at that with practice. The problem for me tended to be trying to guess the emotion of the other person, so I could work on partially mirroring that. (the other part of showing emotions on your face people often don't mention - it's not just showing your emotions (as many NTs like to just explain it), it's also doing a slight mirroring effect when they're talking about something so that they feel you're sharing in what they're telling, giving a bigger sense of connection.)

Most of it tends to be very superficial, it's funny but grasping something that superficial feels much harder than having a deep meaningful conversation. Small talk is significantly more complex than deep talk.



wblastyn
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26 Feb 2011, 7:39 pm

It's a bit like asking someone in a wheel chair to "just get up and walk!".



StevieC
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26 Feb 2011, 11:02 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
StevieC wrote:
what does this even mean?

when i asked further, i was told "just be chatty, and dont look so depressed"


the first thing that came to my brain was "variable: undefined; arg not supported; return"

seriously, how do you just "be sociable"?

It means talk to people.

Compliment.
Then ask a question.

That is the basic formula. You see someone with bright red lipstick, you say,
"Hey, that looks great on you! Ever think about trying pink? I bet that would look cool."

Someone you are aquainted with gets a haircut. You are supposed to notice it and say,
"I really dig that new do. Where'd you get it done?"
People are supposed to be flattered that you want to get your hair done where they got theirs.

Whenever you feel obliged to utter, make sure you do the compliment/question thingy.

So, you just do that and before you know it, they, supposedly, like you.


no seriously, whenever somebody says something like this, i just see a big "system error message" like the kind you get when programming...


i don't have a problem with touch, in fact i f***ing love hugs :) which tends to freak people out anyway :(

its just i saw this person that i kinda liked in the pub, and was advised by a well meaning friend to - as i said - be sociable with them.

thing is, when i've tried in the past to compliment them, it comes out wrong and tends to freak people out. ie i say i like their hair or whatever, and for some reason they are put out.

if i try using that formula/pattern, what i say sounds mechanical and, quite frankly, i just want to be somewhere else.

i just wish people could see inside me as well as my outside.
like a giant bubble that floats above my head saying "name: Stevie C, likes hugs, Oasis, pink floyd etc etc etc"
problem is, in today's world, first impressions are everything.
especially with the kind of job i'm after...

i'm f***ed :(



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26 Feb 2011, 11:57 pm

StevieC wrote:
thing is, when i've tried in the past to compliment them, it comes out wrong and tends to freak people out. ie i say i like their hair or whatever, and for some reason they are put out.


Yes. I get that blank stare for about 5 seconds. Then they suddenly decide that they need to do something else.

This reminds me of something. I once had to tutor someone in algebra. He knew what to do, he just could not figure out when to do it. He would look at a problem, and if I told him what to do next, he could do it. If I did not tell him what to do next, he would just do something random, which, more often than not, made things worse. He eventually learned what to do with certain standard problems, but as soon as he saw anything that was slightly different from what he had studied, he was helpless. He simply did not know what to do.

The situations are surprisingly similar. In social situations, I know what I can do, but I don't know what to do next. I generally pick the wrong thing to do, and it makes things worse. I know some standard situations and in those situations I am fine. But as soon as things change a bit, I am completely lost, and what I decide to do next is usuall the wrong thing.


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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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27 Feb 2011, 12:15 am

StevieC wrote:
no seriously, whenever somebody says something like this, i just see a big "system error message" like the kind you get when programming...


i don't have a problem with touch, in fact i f***ing love hugs :) which tends to freak people out anyway :(

its just i saw this person that i kinda liked in the pub, and was advised by a well meaning friend to - as i said - be sociable with them.

thing is, when i've tried in the past to compliment them, it comes out wrong and tends to freak people out. ie i say i like their hair or whatever, and for some reason they are put out.

if i try using that formula/pattern, what i say sounds mechanical and, quite frankly, i just want to be somewhere else.

i just wish people could see inside me as well as my outside.
like a giant bubble that floats above my head saying "name: Stevie C, likes hugs, Oasis, pink floyd etc etc etc"
problem is, in today's world, first impressions are everything.
especially with the kind of job i'm after...

i'm f***ed :(

You use it at your discretion. Like it or not, it's what successful people do. That, or banter, but banter can be difficult to officialize.



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27 Feb 2011, 1:35 am

My mom recently said to me that I should "develop a social life"....i don't know what that means either :roll:



sterfry
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27 Feb 2011, 1:49 am

Once I took my goldfish out of his bowl and threw him on the floor. I said "just walk." He flopped around frantically until I realized that he had no legs. I picked him up and put him back in the bowl and he immediately seemed more comfortable.



jackbus01
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27 Feb 2011, 5:49 am

Wow, its a good thing someone didn't give me that advice. You don't want me to be chatty. I will talk forever about every little thing. I also don't seem to take any subtle social clues that you are not listening to me anymore. I am working on this though.



Surreal
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28 Feb 2011, 12:28 pm

Mar1976 wrote:
They were trying to help I suppose!

But when I've been told something along those lines, in my head I'm thinking "but why should I if I have nothing to add to the conversation? Why should I when I can't keep up with what's being said? Why should I if I find it a struggle to even try? And when I do try, 80% of the time it's disasterous, followed by an awkward silence and funny looks!"
I don't really understand why some people cannot just let someone who doesn't say very much 'just be'; who will occasionally add to the conversation when THEY want to and not just to fill a void or because someone forces them to say something, anything......

"Join in" is the most recent 'advice' I've been given (after another joke I didn't get), and I suppose that's good advice if you want to appear 'normal'/sociable; but if you genuinely don't know how to react, or what to say to something then the advice is pretty useless!

I suppose it's about practice/repetition of social 'skills'. But there doesn't seem to be a hard and fast rule 'handbook' for that, social interactions differ depending on who's there, what's being discussed (or what's being said just to fill the silence!), what setting you're in.

I wish I could help!


The PROBLEM with this (and this is from my OWN experience) is that no matter HOW much or how HARD you TRY, it DOESN'T GET any easier or ANY BETTER or anything else. And in the END, you wind up sitting there looking like :cyclops: And then many people will avoid you because you just seem odd or off or they feel like you just don't fit in :roll:

There are times when I do follow the flow of conversations and can join in, but many times it's still a struggle - EVEN when things seem to be going well by outside appearances.