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bee33
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02 May 2011, 4:12 pm

I have trouble understanding the concept of forgiveness. I can easily forgive someone I care about, because the way I feel about the person overrides any anger I might have toward them. I can do that because it's not something I do actively, it just happens -- it flows out of the good feelings I have for the person. But when it comes to someone I am not close to but has done me serious emotional harm (like being bullied out of a social group), I am stuck, and it has greatly affected my life because the bullying still hurts even many years later.

I have read that forgiving is just letting go of a grudge and bitterness, not necessarily feeling that the person who hurt you did nothing wrong, or that the wrong is something you can live with, but I don't really understand what that means in a practical way.

Are Aspies more likely to hold grudges? And how does one let go of these grudges so that they don't hurt as much?



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02 May 2011, 4:17 pm

bee33 wrote:
Are Aspies more likely to hold grudges?

Probably. I used to find it very hard. Now less so but still to an extent.
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And how does one let go of these grudges so that they don't hurt as much?

I'd like to know how to do this with ease, if that is possible.


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02 May 2011, 4:51 pm

bee33 wrote:
I have read that forgiving is just letting go of a grudge and bitterness, not necessarily feeling that the person who hurt you did nothing wrong,

THIS



Aimless
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02 May 2011, 5:48 pm

jc6chan wrote:
bee33 wrote:
I have read that forgiving is just letting go of a grudge and bitterness, not necessarily feeling that the person who hurt you did nothing wrong,

THIS


Yes, I think this. It's saying you're going to move on and not let anger, resentment and a desire for revenge poison your life any longer.



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02 May 2011, 5:52 pm

Anger is one letter short of danger.

Its good for you to forgive, like most of the Ten Commandments.

Holding onto past hurts will only damage yourself in the long run, the object of your dislike is usually blissfully unaware



bee33
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02 May 2011, 5:59 pm

Aimless wrote:
jc6chan wrote:
bee33 wrote:
I have read that forgiving is just letting go of a grudge and bitterness, not necessarily feeling that the person who hurt you did nothing wrong,

THIS


Yes, I think this. It's saying you're going to move on and not let anger, resentment and a desire for revenge poison your life any longer.

What's hard for me to understand is how to go from an abstract concept like this one and then actually apply it in real life. It's easy to say "just let it go" but how does one actually accomplish that? What is the thought process behind it, when just thinking about that person makes your blood boil? And I also don't understand how one can "forgive" but still blame?



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02 May 2011, 6:06 pm

bee33 wrote:
Aimless wrote:
jc6chan wrote:
bee33 wrote:
I have read that forgiving is just letting go of a grudge and bitterness, not necessarily feeling that the person who hurt you did nothing wrong,

THIS


Yes, I think this. It's saying you're going to move on and not let anger, resentment and a desire for revenge poison your life any longer.

What's hard for me to understand is how to go from an abstract concept like this one and then actually apply it in real life. It's easy to say "just let it go" but how does one actually accomplish that? What is the thought process behind it, when just thinking about that person makes your blood boil? And I also don't understand how one can "forgive" but still blame?


It's a lot easier when the person you need to forgive isn't around, I'll admit. :wink:



zer0netgain
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03 May 2011, 7:37 am

I can't say I have an answer for this.

I believe in forgiving someone, but I don't forget the transgression. If you betray me, I know you are a betrayer and would be an idiot to ever trust you until you earn the privilege of being trusted.

I suppose you could say forgiveness would amount to being willing to give someone the opportunity to regain your trust. Yes, you would look at them with a jaded eye, but you would be willing to let them prove that they are redeemable or not.

Does that mean if someone consistently hurts you that it's okay to just cut them off entirely? I think it's okay as it's a matter of protecting yourself from harm, but does that equate to not forgiving them?

The bible says that when God forgives you of your sin, God "chooses not to remember" it anymore. Is that what we are expected to do?



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03 May 2011, 9:18 am

Forgiveness is traditionally defined as cancelling a debt. In the context of this post, it is giving up your right to hurt the person who hurt you.

I don't think that we're necessarily supposed to forget the wrongs that other people have committed against us, though we may end up doing so later on. I think the notion of giving that person a chance to regain your trust is a very good one, as well. Just because you forgive someone doesn't mean you end up allowing them to hurt you again--you remain cautious, but because you've forgiven, you might give that person opportunities to regain your trust in the area in which they hurt you. Of course, this can work to varying degrees of success, depending on the type of hurt that was inflicted--you may just be better off staying away from that person if the hurt was very severe.

If the person is unapologetic, forgiveness then comes from your heart--giving up the feelings of vengeance and retaliation you might feel. I'm a Christian, so for me, praying for that person tends to go a long way in forgiving them, as well. I can give God my "right" to hurt that person back, and since God knows that person's heart, he can decide if some sort of punishment is necessary or not. This is what the scripture means when it says, "Vengeance is mine..." Obviously, this type of forgiveness does not include trusting that person again, though.

I also think understanding a person's intentions typically goes a long way toward what I would call "true forgiveness" (forgiving and fully trusting that person again--the kind that God gives us when he forgives us). This is something that you could practice with some friends and family members, but you might not have the luxury of discussing motivations with someone you don't know well. This sort of forgiveness is very Biblical, as well. God asks us to confess our sins that we might be forgiven--I'd argue the same applies to interpersonal relationships.

Oh--I'm new here, by the way! I've been lurking for a little while and finally decided to register. Hope this is a good first post. It's a bit of a wall of text, but I hope it's informative!



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03 May 2011, 10:10 am

Forgiveness is traditionally defined as cancelling a debt. In the context of this post, it is giving up your right to hurt the person who hurt you.


This is a good way to phrase it, I think. It's pretty hard though when the person in question is still transgressin' all over you.

BTW Welcome to WP GuitarMan270
I lived in Richmond for about 20 years.



bee33
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03 May 2011, 1:35 pm

zer0netgain wrote:
I can't say I have an answer for this.

I believe in forgiving someone, but I don't forget the transgression. If you betray me, I know you are a betrayer and would be an idiot to ever trust you until you earn the privilege of being trusted.

I suppose you could say forgiveness would amount to being willing to give someone the opportunity to regain your trust. Yes, you would look at them with a jaded eye, but you would be willing to let them prove that they are redeemable or not.

Does that mean if someone consistently hurts you that it's okay to just cut them off entirely? I think it's okay as it's a matter of protecting yourself from harm, but does that equate to not forgiving them?

The bible says that when God forgives you of your sin, God "chooses not to remember" it anymore. Is that what we are expected to do?

You have some of the same questions that I do. I think giving someone the opportunity to regain your trust is a good concept. Unfortunately I have no contact with the people I have in mind. I suppose I could try to contact them, but I think this needs to be done on my end, as contacting them I think would only lead to more scorn being heaped on me, since they don't see me as their victim but themselves as the aggrieved parties (which psychological bullies often do).

I have cut them off entirely, because I felt I had no choice, but it has left me stuck. I have not until recently even thought of forgiving them. So far it has indeed equated to not forgiving them.

I'm not sure if we are expected not to remember, like God is said to do. How could we not remember? Certainly God is much more forgiving than we are? :) (I'm not religious and don't believe in God, but I think religion has some good insights on forgiveness.)



bee33
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03 May 2011, 1:44 pm

GuitarMan270 wrote:
Forgiveness is traditionally defined as cancelling a debt. In the context of this post, it is giving up your right to hurt the person who hurt you.

I don't think that we're necessarily supposed to forget the wrongs that other people have committed against us, though we may end up doing so later on. I think the notion of giving that person a chance to regain your trust is a very good one, as well. Just because you forgive someone doesn't mean you end up allowing them to hurt you again--you remain cautious, but because you've forgiven, you might give that person opportunities to regain your trust in the area in which they hurt you. Of course, this can work to varying degrees of success, depending on the type of hurt that was inflicted--you may just be better off staying away from that person if the hurt was very severe.

If the person is unapologetic, forgiveness then comes from your heart--giving up the feelings of vengeance and retaliation you might feel. I'm a Christian, so for me, praying for that person tends to go a long way in forgiving them, as well. I can give God my "right" to hurt that person back, and since God knows that person's heart, he can decide if some sort of punishment is necessary or not. This is what the scripture means when it says, "Vengeance is mine..." Obviously, this type of forgiveness does not include trusting that person again, though.

I also think understanding a person's intentions typically goes a long way toward what I would call "true forgiveness" (forgiving and fully trusting that person again--the kind that God gives us when he forgives us). This is something that you could practice with some friends and family members, but you might not have the luxury of discussing motivations with someone you don't know well. This sort of forgiveness is very Biblical, as well. God asks us to confess our sins that we might be forgiven--I'd argue the same applies to interpersonal relationships.

Oh--I'm new here, by the way! I've been lurking for a little while and finally decided to register. Hope this is a good first post. It's a bit of a wall of text, but I hope it's informative!


Thank you for your insights. Like I said in my previous post, I don't believe in God, but I think there is a lot of wisdom in religious thought. I think the idea of understanding the other person's intentions is useful, even though I would have to guess at their intentions, since they won't talk to me, and if I was not generous in my thinking I would simply come to the conclusion that they were out to hurt me because they could. But I also can understand that they felt threatened and jealous.

They are definitely unapologetic (they blame me in fact) but I can understand the notion of letting forgiveness come from one's heart, not for them but for ourselves. I just don't know if I'm advanced enough to accomplish that with my petty little heart. :)

And thanks for making it your first post!

Aimless wrote:
Forgiveness is traditionally defined as cancelling a debt. In the context of this post, it is giving up your right to hurt the person who hurt you.


This is a good way to phrase it, I think. It's pretty hard though when the person in question is still transgressin' all over you.
Yeah, I can see that. The people in my situation are not still doing anything to me, except that it feels like they are by not attempting to make any amends and continuing to look on me as the one who did something to them.



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03 May 2011, 2:17 pm

To forgive means to let all of grudges and move on. It means to leave old resentments in the past.


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03 May 2011, 5:16 pm

CockneyRebel wrote:
To forgive means to let all of grudges and move on. It means to leave old resentments in the past.


Exactly. It's what my NT husband does as naturally as breathing, and as a result he limits his suffering from a bad encounter or vindictive action to a few moments rather than a lifetime. I find it incredibly difficult to forgive - often trying very hard and thinking I might have got there, only to find that I'm simmering with resentment a short time later. As to forgetting - I would love to be able to do that, but by constantly replaying a bad event in my mind it becomes totally embedded and I can't get rid of it.



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03 May 2011, 6:52 pm

Grazia wrote:
I find it incredibly difficult to forgive - often trying very hard and thinking I might have got there, only to find that I'm simmering with resentment a short time later. As to forgetting - I would love to be able to do that, but by constantly replaying a bad event in my mind it becomes totally embedded and I can't get rid of it.

Yes, I'm absolutely guilty of that, especially the bolded part. I've only recently started ruminating over the idea of forgiveness, to try to get past events that happened years ago. I've been to two therapists, and neither of them brought up this possibility. The first one said, "What do you care about those people? Just forget about it." The second one thought I was paranoid and was only imagining the slights I told her about. :roll: Then she suggested some kind of therapy used for people with PTSD that involves eye movements. Perhaps that would have been helpful, but I was very skeptical. I think I need to deal with the people themselves who wronged me, even if it's just within my own self -- since I don't think I can communicate with them (though ideally that's what I would like to do, with help).



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03 May 2011, 7:01 pm

I ignore more times than I forgive. Most times I forget and get reminded of what someone has done to me. I will let it go but will dwell on it at times. I see no point to forgive someone that will hurt you over and over again in the exact same way.

I remember growing up in a church that we HAD to forgive, so not forgiving people actually feels more liberating to me.


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