I feel out of place here. Am I just an asocial psychopath?

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Niiuchien
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18 Sep 2011, 4:35 pm

WARNING: This is going to be long and boring. RUN! RUN WHILE YOU STILL CAN!

The existence of people, who share my bizarre eating habits, my problems with change (which is quite the understatement, if I may add), my likes or in any way coincide with my ways of living, was thought to be terribly low or even unreal before I came here. And yet every nod, agreement and shock to each of the topics I've passed so far has been building up to a harsh realisation; an awakening of the symptoms on paper, if you will. They've never seemed as lively as they do tonight. And it's frightening.

Before you clasp me up in the ''Lost Cause: Crazy Edition'' file, let me explain my odd reaction.

You see, I've had a lot of time to think things through. There have been a few mentions of me having that disorder, whilst the majority kept the nutcase explanation closer to their hearts. It is true that it is not a very well known disorder in this area. That is one of the things which keep me from getting a diagnosis. Not as major as the fact I'd have to talk to a person in order to get it, for example, or that I'm 19 and have progressed with my social skills (which, according to my assumption, would tinker with the accuracy of testing and personal evaluation), but it poses an obstacle nevertheless.

I will eventually get a diagnosis for the peace of my mind. At the moment, it's not possible, though. My father works for the government and is closely linked with the medical portion of the region. He's one of the most supportive and diligent parents any child could wish for, but he needs to uphold his position. Or so he's stated several times up until this day (well, technically, it's night-time). Having a mentally ill wife is bad enough for his health and reputation, both of which he treasures.

That is not to say I would share his or anyone else's point of view of the disorder as an illness or that he would think of it as such in the first place. I'm sure you can see my dilemma, though.

Then there's my feelings about a positive diagnosis. As much as I know myself and from how I've reacted about a few sentences today, I can assure you, I will not feel like a part of ''the group.'' While it does feel as if someone has cloned me numerous times and adjusted some temperamental aspects of my personality, this does not feel mine. Or real, for that matter. I've read about Asperger's and several other mental and physical illnesses and disorders because I'm interested in these things. But they don't mention that these people have a titanic chunk of Niiu in them (not being able to wear or touch certain fabrics, wearing the same clothes, reacting drastically to change, etc.). The emotional recoil upon my brain receiving this information was somewhat devastating, almost as if someone had touched something of mine or ripped it out of me. This has always been mine and only mine, why do I suddenly share it all with people? I got used to the thought of being alone. In fact, that's a comforting thought and always has been. But now, it feels like it's been taken away from me and ''I'' don't really exist.

Before I've been able to reason with myself about this, a negative result of the testing was thought to have the ability of causing confusion in me. How would I be able to explain my disfigurements to myself? The social ineptitude, rocking back and forth, having peculiar interests and all of the other deformations had to go by a better name. One of them was my obsessive compulsive disorder. But how does that explain half of these symptoms?

Digging far into my childhood, into my current self and comparing that to people with Asperger's syndrome, I've noticed something odd. Now, correct me if I'm wrong and have generalised it too much, but most of you seem almost eager to belong somewhere. While that is a natural necessity for the survival of animals and I in no way condone such sentiments, it baffles me to a great extent. Why? As you might have noticed by now, I don't share these wants. So I've come to the conclusion that I'm either a terribly asocial person, I've been dropped on the head as an infant one too many times or I'm just crazy. Not the pleasant, funny kind, either.

Thus it has crossed my mind that there is a mild probability of having a different form of social impairment. Something like ''Hi, I like you. Would you like to meet mr. Knife?'' disorder. It must have something to do with humans, as I find most other animals (more) pleasant to be around.

A thread in this forum section, which goes by the name of The Autism Social Rule Book, has made me want to withdraw from using this website. Call me ridiculous, but someone saying to do white lies in order to be accepted or liked upsets me. Logic concludes that, as long as there will be people out there, who are easily butthurt and self-centered enough to dislike you for an honest statement, there will be a lot of space for white lies. If it suits people for their own benefit, they will lie. If it helps you or makes you happy, though, go for it. Lie your silly little heart out. Again, I'm not here to tell you otherwise, this is simply my opinion. It's your choice what vocals that tongue of yours forms. In fact, I can understand that you must adapt in order to survive socially and, in a way, it's good to see progress, even in this form.
I was hoping that, maybe some day, I'll meet someone who won't clench up at a silly question like ''How do I look today?'' Tell me you don't like my shirt, that I have something on my face, that I should kill my hairstylist. Although the last would be amusing, as I cut my own hair.

Be frank. Tell me you don't like me and would rather be elsewhere. And then? Then you can feel free to walk away. My life doesn't depend on you, I can continue it and all the deeds entitled to it without your liking.


Congratulations, you've somehow made it to this point without poking through your eyeball with a pen!

Please note that this post was not made in order to insult anyone, so I'm sorry if I came off as rude, obnoxious, arrogant, ignorant or whatever else bothers you. It's just the way I write and I'm not forcing you to like me. Especially not with my terrible writing style. However, I would appreciate some feedback to go with what I've written so far and some additional questions I have. Oh, yes, and if I've somehow upset any of you, feel free to express that, as well. That's healthier than keeping it in and I can understand people being frustrated with me as I can be terribly difficult. There will be no hard feelings or verbal wars, so shake off that hesitance holding you from clicking on the post button.

Questions:
1.) If the diagnosis will be positive for Asperger's syndrome, will it cause trouble at job searches? Am I obliged to mention such things on my Curriculum Vitae or during interviews?
2.) Beside OCD and ADD, what could be causing some of the symptoms pertained to Asperger's syndrome?



Last edited by Niiuchien on 18 Sep 2011, 4:54 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Sparhawke
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18 Sep 2011, 4:39 pm

I will get to reading it in a moment :)



kBillingsley
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18 Sep 2011, 5:07 pm

You do not need to tell people about any mental conditions, it is more-or-less a "don't ask, don't tell," paradigm. Whatever you may have, you do not sound like a person afflicted with Antisocial Personality Disorder (often stated as the colloquial "psychopath," or "sociopath," or "Dexter Morgan.") If it is not Asperger's Syndrome, then your symptoms may be a manifestation of PDD-NOS, which is a melange of autistic traits that do not fit into any of the conventional autism spectrum disorders. You figured yourself out, and this is a good thing: do not be discouraged by others in trying to better yourself, high-functioning autistics can appear perfectly normal with enough training. Great post, and good luck.



LittleBlackCat
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18 Sep 2011, 5:31 pm

My understanding was that you do not need to tell your employers about any mental health conditions BUT if they ask about your health and you don't tell, they have the right to sack you on the spot if they then find out later. Also, if you don't tell you have no rights to reasonable adjustments in the workplace or protection from discrimination. That's the situation as I understand it in England anyway.



1000Knives
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18 Sep 2011, 6:21 pm

I kinda feel the same way as you on all this. I feel quite out of place here also. But, I don't really "hate" other humans, I just don't really understand them and their thought process. Rather, I understand their thought process and don't care to have it. But me, I try to be Christian, sometimes I do a good job, other times not as much, but that shapes my view of people a lot. To me, God cares about them, and wants me to, so I try. Sometimes the other humans don't like me, a lot of the time actually. A lot of times the humans won't take my advice or help. I try the best I can to give them knowledge that I know, but most of the time they don't care.

However, I feel a bit like Ezekiel 33, "8 When I say to the wicked, ‘You wicked person, you will surely die,’ and you do not speak out to dissuade them from their ways, that wicked person will die for[a] their sin, and I will hold you accountable for their blood. 9 But if you do warn the wicked person to turn from their ways and they do not do so, they will die for their sin, though you yourself will be saved."

That's somewhat the way I view life. If I know or maybe feel like I've done the right thing, and other people still hate me for it, it's not my problem. So in that sense, I suck at social rules, because I put myself to higher rules than "social rules" like telling white lies to people habitually to make things easier. So I know my life is going to be hard for that reason, but it's what I want. People might think I'm weird or crazy or whatever for being religious that way, but it's what I want. The way I see it, I think God possibly put me on the Earth as a somewhat "special" person.

I do have some common traits to Aspergers people, and I don't, also. I'm not actually Aspergers, I don't think, or maybe I am. I'm actually nonverbal learning disorder, which sort of acts the same as Aspergers, but it's a bit more scientific, the people diagnosing me said it wasn't strong enough for an AS diagnosis, but at the same time, I was trying to be as normal as possible with them (it was from court.) It's basically my verbal IQ and nonverbal IQ have a huge gap, and I may have small right brain problems. In a lot of ways, I feel like especially self diagnosed Aspergers seems a bit more like "I'm a nerd" than a serious medical condition. I have a friend with diagnosed Aspergers (since childhood) whose been great friends with me for a good portion of my life now. What he told me about when I found out my NVLD diagnosis was a real thing was "Things like that are only good for introspection" and that's coming from someone who was in special ed in school for "real" Aspergers. He almost never brings it up in conversation, he just gets on with life, and I sure as hell do not think he posts here. He's 22 and has just moved on. To him, it's just another thing, good or bad, it's the way it is, and he's gotta live with it.

But, I post on here anyway, to acquire knowledge and give it back to people the best I can. If they don't care or think it's weird, it probably does in some way hurt me, if I'm honest with myself, but I don't really care enough to change my actions. I don't really feel like I "belong" here either though. It's a place of commonality, just as Celicasupra.com is a place of commonality for me as I own a Celica Supra. I can give and get knowledge at both places, and it's just different things to give and acquire knowledge about. Maybe I do deep down want a place to belong, but in my mind, I don't, belonging means compromise, and that's something I'm not too great at doing. I don't fit in with the mostly "nerdy" people on this board very well at all, matter of fact, I used to go to an anime club for the same reason, a place to meet people similar to me. But they weren't, so once it got less about anime, and more about "hanging out" I didn't care. That's fine, but I'm not a nerd, even though I do things very common to nerds. I do lots of things completely contrary to nerds, too. So it's the same way with Aspergers, I use this forum as a place to give and receive knowledge, if I make friends along the way, then I do (but I doubt that, I've had better luck with friends on car messageboards and places) if not, then I don't. I'll probably get bored of learning about NVLD/Aspergers anyway soon, and probably leave in like a month.

As far as needing humans, I empathize with you somewhat. The way I try to do things in my life is simply to try to learn things so I do not need other people. However, other people, to some degree, are required, or at the very least are a reality of life now that is unchangeable. An example in the difference in my thought process, though, is my sister refuses to go anywhere without someone with her. Like she said she'd go ice skating if her friends went with her. I see that thought process a lot. Me, I've never had that thought process, if I wanted to do something, I'd do it friends or not, I guess I'd like friends, but if they don't come, well, I'm still going ice skating. A lot of the times I make friends and acquaintances along the way. I feel my thought process is a healthier thought process than my sisters, but unfortunately, it's considered odd by society.

As far as finding people, there are people that are good, and suit you, but they're hard to find, and at least for me and girls, I don't believe even worth the effort to bother trying to find. I assume you're living with your parents right now, and you've described them as good people, right? They exist, you've said it yourself. As far as Aspergers and Aspergers community, it's like this I think. White people generally feel more comfy around white people, and blacks around their kind, etc. However, we all need to get along regardless of skin color, but to deny the differences between these groups of people is ridiculous. Same with "Aspies" and "Nuerotypicals" there's good and bad in both of them. And if we were to have a society of all neurotypicals or Aspies, it'd be either lame or boring or both. Hell even this board proves it, the world would be a terribly boring place if it was all just inhabited by Aspergers people.

For me, all that my NVLD diagnosis helped me with was finding different "coping" strategies. Like doing sports really helped me, oddly, in driving. Sports trained my other parts of my brain to be better. That's all you can hope for out of an Aspergers diagnosis, to learn different things about you and if you want to better yourself or change yourself, you can learn the way to do it. If you don't care to change anything, then obviously, don't.


You can look into nonverbal learning disorder, by the way. You can do an initial check yourself with a verbal IQ test and a performance (math, etc) IQ test and see what the gap is like. For me, also, whenever I see an article on NVLD, it's always a dead ringer for me, whereas Aspergers was one of those things I never considered, but NVLD can manifest as Aspergers, too, as I believe it does with me. NVLD is not autism spectrum disorder really, (though at the same time, Aspergers I believe might have nothing to do with lower functioning autism) it's just a deficiency in right brain. One thing that surprised the hell out of me was reading a lot of Aspies are visual thinkers. I'm not at all, I think basically in longer versions of what I'm writing here. I cannot even envision being a visual thinker, obviously I can visualize things, but to use that thought process for everything perplexes me how it's even possible. Maybe look into NVLD, but the big problem, NVLD is rarer than Aspergers. Aspergers is about 1/100, whereas NVLD is like 1/1000. So you're not going to find a support network or whatever for it, or maybe even treatment as an adult.

I don't know, I think I've made a longer post than you in response to you, so I'll stop now. And I do have a bit of a religious "spin" on things, but it's part of my thought process now, so yeah. Most people on here seem to be atheists or just very hateful of religion or the concept of God, that's another thing that makes me feel out of place here, too. But, it's whatever. I hope what I said was informative or helpful to you in some way. Also I've been told I talk about myself too much, which I did in this post I believe.



The_Perfect_Storm
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18 Sep 2011, 9:16 pm

This is ridiculous. You're upset because you don't feel special anymore? You're upset because people tells lies? Get over yourself. How can you talk about people spreading 'white' lies and then go on to imply you feel like stabbing people with "mr. knife". I don't actually think you're capable of anything like that of course. You're just being an idiot.

Stop acting so 'butthurt'. People may share some symptoms with you but they're not going to experience it in the same way as you do. People tell lies. Deal with it. Small scale lies aren't a big deal. No one cares.

Bad luck about your dad, cares more about his reputation then he cares about you. Honestly I thought that would piss you off the most considering tiny white lies upset you..

1.) You're not obliged. Or at least nobody is where I live, to my knowledge. f**k it, just don't tell them anyway.
2.) Asperger's syndrome causes the symptoms pertaining to Asperger's syndrome.

---

"However, I would appreciate some feedback to go with what I've written so far and some additional questions I have. Oh, yes, and if I've somehow upset any of you, feel free to express that, as well. That's healthier than keeping it in and I can understand people being frustrated with me as I can be terribly difficult. There will be no hard feelings or verbal wars, so shake off that hesitance holding you from clicking on the post button."



Don't need you to tell me how to act in your thread kid. I can think for myself.

It's clear you value honesty quite highly... have you ever been in a position to really hurt someone with the 'truth' as you see it? I think you're naive. Honesty isn't as valuable as you seem to believe it is. Stop telling people that you've got it right and they've got it wrong. Stop acting like you're better than everyone else.



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19 Sep 2011, 8:22 am

AS and psychopathy are practically mutually exclusive, from a neuro-science point of view - despite similar reasoning systems. Unless you're lying about everything you just typed, the chances of ASPD being applicable are practically nil, though ASPD/sociopathy and psychopathy are not synonyms, so it is possible that you're just an anti-social dickhead because of autism (i'm not suggesting it, just explaining your inferrence 8) )

as for your questions:

1 - you're not obliged to tell anyone about a developmental disorder because it is not classfied as a medical handicap, atleast not in the UK, so while a diagnosis shouldn't have any negative implication on job seeking, the simple fact that you have AS could f**k it up spectacularly in the interview process.

2 - there are alot of connections between ADD (inattentive vs hyperactive, imo) and AS. "AS generally gives the ability to focus extremely intensely to the exclusion of anything else on a subject of interest, something which a true ADHD person doesn't have. But there is enough overlap of symptoms to make someone less aware of AS to conclude comorbid ADHD." (taken from another forum). Generally speaking, it's just another way to make money by diagnosing and treating "disorders" that are observable even in the most NT of brains.

if you want my personal opinion on what is causing your symptoms, i'd take a massive shot in the dark and go with "i'm 19...".



kfisherx
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19 Sep 2011, 9:03 am

Twist wrote:
AS and psychopathy are practically mutually exclusive, from a neuro-science point of view - despite similar reasoning systems. Unless you're lying about everything you just typed, the chances of ASPD being applicable are practically nil, though ASPD/sociopathy and psychopathy are not synonyms, so it is possible that you're just an anti-social dickhead because of autism (i'm not suggesting it, just explaining your inferrence 8) )

as for your questions:

1 - you're not obliged to tell anyone about a developmental disorder because it is not classfied as a medical handicap, atleast not in the UK, so while a diagnosis shouldn't have any negative implication on job seeking, the simple fact that you have AS could f**k it up spectacularly in the interview process.

2 - there are alot of connections between ADD (inattentive vs hyperactive, imo) and AS. "AS generally gives the ability to focus extremely intensely to the exclusion of anything else on a subject of interest, something which a true ADHD person doesn't have. But there is enough overlap of symptoms to make someone less aware of AS to conclude comorbid ADHD." (taken from another forum). Generally speaking, it's just another way to make money by diagnosing and treating "disorders" that are observable even in the most NT of brains.

if you want my personal opinion on what is causing your symptoms, i'd take a massive shot in the dark and go with "i'm 19...".


LOL! ^^^THIS^^^ x 1000%



Louise18
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24 Sep 2011, 7:57 pm

The_Perfect_Storm wrote:
This is ridiculous. You're upset because you don't feel special anymore? You're upset because people tells lies? Get over yourself. How can you talk about people spreading 'white' lies and then go on to imply you feel like stabbing people with "mr. knife". I don't actually think you're capable of anything like that of course. You're just being an idiot.

Stop acting so 'butthurt'. People may share some symptoms with you but they're not going to experience it in the same way as you do. People tell lies. Deal with it. Small scale lies aren't a big deal. No one cares.

Bad luck about your dad, cares more about his reputation then he cares about you. Honestly I thought that would piss you off the most considering tiny white lies upset you..

1.) You're not obliged. Or at least nobody is where I live, to my knowledge. f**k it, just don't tell them anyway.
2.) Asperger's syndrome causes the symptoms pertaining to Asperger's syndrome.

---

"However, I would appreciate some feedback to go with what I've written so far and some additional questions I have. Oh, yes, and if I've somehow upset any of you, feel free to express that, as well. That's healthier than keeping it in and I can understand people being frustrated with me as I can be terribly difficult. There will be no hard feelings or verbal wars, so shake off that hesitance holding you from clicking on the post button."



Don't need you to tell me how to act in your thread kid. I can think for myself.

It's clear you value honesty quite highly... have you ever been in a position to really hurt someone with the 'truth' as you see it? I think you're naive. Honesty isn't as valuable as you seem to believe it is. Stop telling people that you've got it right and they've got it wrong. Stop acting like you're better than everyone else.


Wow. I don't think I have met anyone i think less of than you.

Honesty is of vital importance to autonomy.



lokilost
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24 Sep 2011, 10:34 pm

I don't know why, but I think I like you.

I was certain I wasn't even human, and no, I don't feel any more connection here than I do with any other group of people or individual persons. It's not uncommon if you are raised not knowing where you fit in surrounded only by neurotypicals. In my case, people around me plain told me I wasn't human, my brain must be made of pure s**t, and that's why my eyes are brown, and that if everyone else does something one way, and I don't, assume I'm wrong and change, because everyone else is more important than me. I stopped talking for two and a half years, and no one noticed. The only way I survived was to believe I was 100% unique, here for some special purpose that the world couldn't even imagine, and that all I had to do was survive and escape those people, and I'd be the greatest thing that ever lived. Was I disappointed and shocked when that turned out to be wrong? Yes. Will I ever feel 100% human, or part of any group, autistic or not? No. Does it help to have others who understand and I can ask for advice on my problems and challenges now that I have to deal with the realization that I'm not going to magically wake up and save the entire universe by being weird? Quite a bit, actually.



TwistedReflection
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24 Sep 2011, 10:57 pm

Am I the only one who thought that the OP was actually trolling? No offense meant, OP, but I could detect subtle manipulation at work on your part. I know, because manipulation is one skill I happen to be adept at.

I get the feeling that you know exactly who you are and are simply looking for attention. I'm not trying to tell you that you're a bad person, but remember that some people on WP are less socially aware than others and are therefore predisposed to falling prey to those who excel at mind games.

As for whether or not you're an "asocial psychopath", I would say that it is highly likely, but that's my opinion based on what I understood of your post.



animalcrackers
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24 Sep 2011, 11:38 pm

General feedback:

Niiuchien wrote:
[...]my terrible writing style.


I'd describe your writing style as humorous, albeit scathing and obnoxious.

Niiuchien wrote:
This is going to be long and boring.[...]I've come to the conclusion that I'm either a terribly asocial person, I've been dropped on the head as an infant one too many times or I'm just crazy. Not the pleasant, funny kind, either. [...] Call me ridiculous, but [...] Congratulations, you've somehow made it to this point without poking through your eyeball with a pen! [...]Please note that this post was not made in order to insult anyone, so I'm sorry if I came off as rude, obnoxious, arrogant, ignorant or whatever else bothers you. It's just the way I write and I'm not forcing you to like me. [...]


For a person who doesn't care about what anybody thinks of them, you sure offer a lot of apologies and self-effacing comments! (Granted, I can imagine that these comments might be intended solely to give people a reason to respond to you despite how offended they might be....but without knowing you, I make no assumptions.)

Niiuchien wrote:
Be frank. Tell me you don't like me and would rather be elsewhere. And then? Then you can feel free to walk away. My life doesn't depend on you, I can continue it and all the deeds entitled to it without your liking.


You seem curiously pre-occupied with whether or not people like you....which is odd when you're saying you really don't care if others like you. Perhaps the impression of pre-occupation is an unintented consequence of your attempt to drive the point home? (If so, this can be translated into a purely editorial comment: the above point, in particular, seems redundant and may be counter-productive.) I won't tell you I don't like you--I have no particular feelings/opinion about you either way, because I don't know you.

Whatever your issues happen to be, I wish you luck with figuring them out.



Last edited by animalcrackers on 25 Sep 2011, 1:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

liveandletdie
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25 Sep 2011, 12:11 am

I didn't get why the post was offensive....but maybe it just went over my head =/.

I don't think you need to feel connected to people whether it be in general, on this forum, or in a colony in the woods.
There are people who don't connect to others, and resent any connection that might be made.
Doesn't make you strange/not aspergers/aspergers.

Seems like a separate issue entirely, and as others have said could be you growing up and trying to find where you fit in and feeling like you don’t fit in with the other humans and that makes you angry. =/


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25 Sep 2011, 12:45 am

Louise18 wrote:
Wow. I don't think I have met anyone i think less of than you.

Honesty is of vital importance to autonomy.


Lol okay.

I don't think you know what autonomy means.

You think it's important to be honest all of the time? Fine. I disagree. The world disagrees. Dishonesty is as much a part of the human race as any other trait.

I'm not really sure what I wrote there to get you to despise me. When I read the OP's post he came across to me as some naive, self-absorbed hypocrite. I don't mind expressing that opinion.

If the honesty thing is what really gets to you... I'm not trying to be manipulative. I just think there are times when lying is a better alternative. I don't want to hurt the people I care about with my honesty.

This is pretty much a perfect example of where honesty can get you into trouble :P I'm the worst person you've ever met!