Do we lack accurate role models.

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I donno how to explain this. But basically from what I can tell, there seems to be a lack of role models for those of us on the spectrum.

It would seem very evident that much of the characterization`s of us, are of people that are totally Asocial. Yes we suffer from natural body language, and inability to convey emotions and feelings, but this shouldn`t be confused with other things we have the ability to do quite well. The truth is most of us want to be social, we simply don`t know how to compare.

Dressing well, , caring, polite, having a wide vocab, considerate(not sensitive) honest, being understanding of people(through our inability to empathize with people), cooperative, etc are all things we can possess in spades if we desire. As these traits are learnable not instinctual.

There are things we do often that there is really no need for and can easily be over come with some simple instruction and some effort. Selfish behavior such as talking about only what interests us, is something nt do as well, we just have just have to unlearn it differently. Body language can be developed, there`s no need to walk like a old man, sure your walk may not be dynamic but it`s both physically beneficial and of social benefit to emulate more natural postures. Facial expressions are another typical problem. We may not be able to have a fully dynamic face, but learning to shed that look of worry into a more natural relaxes face is something that can be done quite easily.

Of course we`ll never possess that natural charisma that someone like a politician has. But there`s no reason we should either. Our ideal should be more of stoic, neutral third party. More of the androids you see in movies. Like the david character from prometheus.

Nt`s don`t view people logically they think by associations.

We need to develop more disciplined personas. We will always be emotionally distant, that does not mean we can look a certain way. We need to set a standard for our behaviors.

It would make sense that a more restricted strong willed persona that of a human emulating a robot would seem to be very enjoyable to most.

Last edited by Stoek on 08 Oct 2012, 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I have a very good role model.

Is this a joke or are you trying to add to the discussion, I`m not really sure.

I will agree with you on this.
If my father had any inclination of how socially inept he is, he might have come up with ways to overcome, that he could have taught me.

However, I'm at the stage of my life now where I must let the past go, and accept that there is nobody to lead me but the role model I create inside myself.
Furthermore, I look forward to the day when the next generation is in need of a role model, and my experiences will be of use to someone else.

What kind of role model do you have in mind?

I suppose Temple Grandin could be a role model, but some of her advice ("Every autistic child needs twenty hours of 1:1 therapy a week" or "If you're non-verbal, you can't work in Silicon Valley*".) shouldn't be applied to every single child with there is.

*Never mind the fact that some people with autism have other disabilities, like verbal apraxia, that prevent them from speaking. Not the autism.

Alright I just made a vid trying to get the idea out, it`s kinda unorganized rambling, but I think the ingredient might be present.


CHECK THE VIDEO

[youtube] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QvpmAScD38 [/youtube]

Last edited by Stoek on 08 Oct 2012, 8:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.

I'm not sure role models would help, especially when in this day and age, people are more pushy about perfection than say 20 years ago when it was actually ok to be fat (for example).
People are vain, and that goes for the mind as well, and feeling pressured to change because of how others see us is not the best thing.
Sure, having a role model is great, but if there's pressure to be someone other than who you are, then it's just not worth the stress.

Take a wild guess based on that special interest of his.

Re. my role models: I don't really have one single person I idolize, but I've learned a good deal about life and about myself from the experiences of other people, both real and fictional. They don't have to be autistic for me to learn from them. Exposure to a wide variety of viewpoints and life experiences seems to be the best way to get that "role model" information, whatever your neurology is, because that way you're not dependent on copying a single person who--this is the critical thing--is not you. Because everyone is different, and your role model is not you, you can't do everything the way they do it and expect it to work for you. Looking up to a role model is fine, but I do think we need to be able to learn from a lot of different people, so that we can learn to understand all the different ways people think and all the different things they believe. If you have autism, it's often hard to generalize; so the next-best thing is to build up a big database of examples to pull from, and to connect to see the patterns.

I posted on our lack of a role model in the past. It's one of the things I struggle with the most.

High aspie achievers like T. Grandin obviously aren't suitable role models for the vast majority of aspies in the world (i.e. third-world, non-English speaking, poverty-stricken, oppressed aspies in primitive societies, working from our early teens to support our parents and with no access to higher education).

I agree that people are increasingly expected to be this one thing while at work or school in our globalized culture, however it`s important to realize that people different greatly when there in their free time.

I`m not suggesting one has to behave a certain way all the time, but when at work, or other impersonal gatherings we do have to accommodate to other people and take on a role.

Everyone has to take on roles in life, whether it be as a parent, a leader, etc. For us this isn`t logical, but there is a rather simple reasoning for it, I can get into it if you wish but it takes a few paragraphs.

The important difference is we`re not trying to be liked for being one of the guys. What we need to learn is to create models for respect. People don`t like spock but he is respected as the one person that captain kirk has to listen to, despite his own ego being out of whack.

We have a role in social environments, we have some pretty strong attributes that make us great in certain roles it`d be great if we could realize that.

Being totally honest, impartial(not taking sides), not being petty, being a person of few words, considerate, reliable, emotionally restrained, etc are all things we can be very good at.

Idk, that sounds like surrendering to power play to me (some can say opinions while others are expected to not express theirs due to conflicting views, in order to prevent a possible scene), which wouldn't surprise me since society is based on who's better than the next person, who's right or wrong, etc.

Well if you wanna work alone start your own business and find your own clients sure why not.

But if you actually wanna work with others, you do have to make some effort to cooperate and to accomodate

I agree very much with this. I also don't think you have to change too too much in order to be able to work with people; the basics you have listed, such as grooming, etiquette, posture, etc. should be enough. I would add to that personality traits such as assertiveness, self-confidence (not self-esteem), and a positive attitude, which can be developed. However, you have to be mindful of your sensory triggers and work on ways to get around them. Certain work positions might be off limits to you depending on your sensitivities.

I am building my career path in social services and the only reason I sometimes don't disclose is out of fear that people will assume that I can't work with people directly. I wish attitudes about this changed, as well as the classic stereotype of the introverted autistic. I know that most pick up on my AS quite quickly, but I still don't tell them about it directly and instead try to present myself as a very social person (which I am, to the extent that my perfectionism with other aspects of life such as school allows me to be).

No offense but who are you to judge how easy or hard things like this are for people on the spectrum? For instance I am aware talking about only my interests can annoy people so I try to avoid that. As for body language aside from just not really processing that too much along with everything else can be more diffiult than it seems also some of us have co-morbid conditions like anxiety and depression which can also affect body language. For instance I know I have kind of 'defensive' body language but I am not usually aware enough of my body language to try and fake different body language and as soon as I stop thinking about it I just go back to how it was before.

Same with facial expressions, I am not usually aware of what facial expression I have so how would I control that, as far as I know you cannot simply force your brain to process more things than it can at once. I think so long as I am not purposely hurting others and take care to avoid accidently hurting them as well my behavior is fine and if someone has a problem with it they should just learn not to be a bigot towards people different from them.

But why should only the person with autism have to make those efforts? see the issue I see is a lot of times it seems the ones who struggle with things like autism are just expected to suck it up, behave differently and accommodate others but its ok for those others to ridicule us and make no effort at cooperating.......I mean it works both ways.