I can't seem to take a joke, they seem too mean to me.
15 May 2014, 3:52 pm
If they didn't know you had autism, they'd find something else about you to blame. They're just looking for something wrong with you so they can brush you off -- if there's something that makes you incapable of understanding what they understand, or that makes you offended by something they believe is inoffensive, to them it probably means they don't have any reason to think about what they said or consider your perspective at all, nor do they have to take any responsibility for how their words might affect you or anybody else.
Autism may be part of why someone finds a joke offensive instead of funny, but that doesn't mean that finding the joke offensive is wrong nor that the joke is not mean/offensive. There are non-autistic people who find derogatory humor offensive, too.
In my experience, most people who really mean no harm by jokes and actually care about the feelings of those they might be offending tend to apologize for causing offense, will listen to why you're offended and accept your perspective as valid even if they disagree with you, and can deal with the idea that someone finds their humor offensive without making it out like there is something wrong with that offended person.
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"Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving." -- Terry Pratchett, A Hat Full of Sky
Love transcends all.
15 May 2014, 4:02 pm
If mere physical proximity of another male person was the cause of such feelings then you (and every other straight man on earth who is repulsed by gay men) should be repulsed by straight guys just as much as gay guys.
_________________
"Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving." -- Terry Pratchett, A Hat Full of Sky
Love transcends all.
15 May 2014, 4:51 pm
It's not about the actual proximity but the thought of what they might be thinking about doing to me.
Again, it's not rational, and I can't give an any more detailed explanation than that. And again, I'm talking about reasons, not justification - even if it's completely unjustified, that doesn't make te question "why people do it" any less interesting.
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Maths student. Somewhere between NT and ASD.
15 May 2014, 8:28 pm
It's not about the actual proximity but the thought of what they might be thinking about doing to me.
Okay, but I don't see how that connects in any way to your evolution/competition theory.
I understand that, but I still think that your evolution/competition theory makes no sense.
_________________
"Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving." -- Terry Pratchett, A Hat Full of Sky
Love transcends all.
15 May 2014, 8:40 pm
These aren't really jokes, nor does this have anything to do with autism. You just don't like it.
Source: one of my Aspie friends is a perv.
_________________
Shedding your shell can be hard.
Diagnosed Level 1 autism, Tourettes + ADHD + OCD age 9, recovering Borderline personality disorder (age 16)
15 May 2014, 9:55 pm
I quite clearly said that I don't support the idea (that is, the conscious thought) that gays are wrong - I talked about evolution in relation to a feeling that cannot be consciously changed. Also, I gave it as a speculative reason, not as a justification; an irrational feeling does not require a justification in the first place as, imho, it does not make one a good or a bad person.
perhaps then it's time to investigate the source of the feeling.
15 May 2014, 10:04 pm
Using the word p**** that way is like using the word fa***t to mean despicable. The basic concept that is reinforced every time someone calls someone else a p**** is that women are essentially inferior to men and it's a truly terrible thing to be like a woman. When people use fa***t or gay as a term of abuse they are agreeing with and reinforcing the proposition that homosexuals are essentially inferior and it's terrible and unacceptable to have that orientation.
It is no coincidence that the people who would use these terms that way also use the word rape to express the idea of scoring a decisive victory or suffering a humiliating defeat. The operating concept is that a key part of male superiority is to physically penetrate others. To penetrate is heroic, in that ideology, and to be penetrated is disgusting and contemptible.
The problem is not that you don't get humor but that you see things too clearly. These jokes are part of our civizations nasty supposedly hidden side. Seeing them for what they are is breaking a social convention that demands that we should either go along with the subtext of male supremacy or be quiet and pretend it is not happening.
People are often disgusting and disappointing, but they are under enormous social pressure to conform so going along with this vile stuff may not always indicate that they deeply believe it or support it.
^THIS
16 May 2014, 7:03 am
I'm glad I'm not the only one really horrified by that.
Winning at things isn't all that important. But winning at a video game is generally a kind of nice thing.
But rape is horrible and horrifying. So someone comparing winning, something that's at least a little good, to rape, it really horrifying and disturbing.
16 May 2014, 9:46 am
Using the word p**** that way is like using the word fa***t to mean despicable. The basic concept that is reinforced every time someone calls someone else a p**** is that women are essentially inferior to men and it's a truly terrible thing to be like a woman. When people use fa***t or gay as a term of abuse they are agreeing with and reinforcing the proposition that homosexuals are essentially inferior and it's terrible and unacceptable to have that orientation.
It is no coincidence that the people who would use these terms that way also use the word rape to express the idea of scoring a decisive victory or suffering a humiliating defeat. The operating concept is that a key part of male superiority is to physically penetrate others. To penetrate is heroic, in that ideology, and to be penetrated is disgusting and contemptible.
The problem is not that you don't get humor but that you see things too clearly. These jokes are part of our civizations nasty supposedly hidden side. Seeing them for what they are is breaking a social convention that demands that we should either go along with the subtext of male supremacy or be quiet and pretend it is not happening.
People are often disgusting and disappointing, but they are under enormous social pressure to conform so going along with this vile stuff may not always indicate that they deeply believe it or support it.
Excellent post.
Also this:
When you complain about it, you're complaining about the liberty from respecting other people, this small violence, they've entitled themselves to, and yep, they'll be upset. It's worth speaking up anyway.
The place where I used to work had plenty of joking around, which could sometimes be a bit more verbally aggressive than I was entirely comfortable with, but it was never racist, it was never sexist, and I cannot imagine anyone there ever using the word "rape" in that way.
This stuff you're describing is not humour, IMO. It's arseholery, and you're right to call it out (if you feel up to it).
16 May 2014, 12:58 pm
But rape is horrible and horrifying. So someone comparing winning, something that's at least a little good, to rape, it really horrifying and disturbing.
I don't understand this. How is shooting people down any better?
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Maths student. Somewhere between NT and ASD.
16 May 2014, 1:52 pm
Alot of ground to cover here. Alot of issues.
Jokes in general. Jokes directed at the OP himself.
The "rapestomped" thing is over the line IMHO. I woulda said "I kicked his ass" in that situation ( nonsexual male-on-male violence is a perfectly fine way to describe a simulated violence game).
"p****" does mean "wimp" or "wuss". But folks also use the word "dick" as an epithet (meaning 'meanie').
I dont follow you around in your life so its hard to say. My guess is that in some instances you dont get jokes, or are offended by jokes that I would laugh at, and bond with people over. But at other times folks really are bullying you under the guise of joking. Both things may be going on. One issue merges into the other.
You may need some coaching from a therapist.
But one thing you might try when folks say "I was just joking" after you express outrage at what they said- is to say "oh Im sorry. I thought that jokes were supposed to be FUNNY. It wouldve been recognizable as a joke if it had been funny". That will piss them off. When they express their anger then you can then say "you need to grow a thicker skin!".
Some people will poke fun out of affection to bond with you-with mock insults. But other folks will pretend to do that who are real bullies (pretend to be pretending to insult, but are really insulting you---I know-human interactions are complex). Ive experienced both things from different individuals in the same workplace in the same time period. If you're a socially impaired autistic its probably hard to tell the difference.
17 May 2014, 2:31 am
TC, I think its fine for you to be uncomfortable about such things. People who would tease you about those things are fairly immature.
That being said.. I can't say too much about the racism stuff, just seems pretty phony to me but the trash talking in video games is pretty common.
I mean.. you need to compare the activity the person is doing to the person's crude jokes about rape.
Most video games don't allow you to rape, but heck.. in certain games (grand theft auto, various first person shooters..) you can steal, get strip dances, jack cars, mug people, beat civilians to death with baseball bats, do drive by shootings on the elderly, hire and consort with prostitutes, sell and deal drugs, rub out eyewitnesses, get into shoot outs with cops, etc etc. I mean unless its mario bros-- these are a huge chunk of popular game titles that have gratuity through violence.
I mean if its ok to pretend to do those things in a game-- joking about rape to these types of people isn't suddenly crossing the line. Also if this individual was a guy (who was playing the game) this type of razzing/teasing isn't unheard of regardless, game player or not.
17 May 2014, 8:00 pm
That being said.. I can't say too much about the racism stuff, just seems pretty phony to me but the trash talking in video games is pretty common.
I mean.. you need to compare the activity the person is doing to the person's crude jokes about rape.
Most video games don't allow you to rape, but heck.. in certain games (grand theft auto, various first person shooters..) you can steal, get strip dances, jack cars, mug people, beat civilians to death with baseball bats, do drive by shootings on the elderly, hire and consort with prostitutes, sell and deal drugs, rub out eyewitnesses, get into shoot outs with cops, etc etc. I mean unless its mario bros-- these are a huge chunk of popular game titles that have gratuity through violence.
I mean if its ok to pretend to do those things in a game-- joking about rape to these types of people isn't suddenly crossing the line. Also if this individual was a guy (who was playing the game) this type of razzing/teasing isn't unheard of regardless, game player or not.
Er...yes, joking about rape is crossing the line. The context doesn't matter. If you're joking about rape, you have a serious problem.
18 May 2014, 1:57 am
^ Yeah i'm not saying its not an issue, but i'm saying in the content that we have around nowadays, equally bad things are already being glorified and that this is common.
I specifically was referring to this because it was video game players talking trash. In the video game genre "first person shooters" and one of the draws to these types of games is literally "killing" and murdering people in a video game. I'm not trying to insensitive here--the issue is that the content we have has caused (in my opinion) our generation to become desensitized. Rape and murder are acts of depravity and in a lot of popular competitive games you are killing the friend your playing against.
I was trying to explain the potential rationalization of the behavior of such individuals. You'll find no disagreement with me on the behavior itself.
18 May 2014, 10:40 am
I specifically was referring to this because it was video game players talking trash. In the video game genre "first person shooters" and one of the draws to these types of games is literally "killing" and murdering people in a video game. I'm not trying to insensitive here--the issue is that the content we have has caused (in my opinion) our generation to become desensitized. Rape and murder are acts of depravity and in a lot of popular competitive games you are killing the friend your playing against.
I was trying to explain the potential rationalization of the behavior of such individuals. You'll find no disagreement with me on the behavior itself.
Oh, all right. Well, in that case, she should stop hanging around with these people. Why spend time with people who think like this, and who want her to be okay with it? Ugh, there are nicer, saner people in the world.
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