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Rant: People first language police online

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BirdInFlight
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04 Jun 2014, 6:25 pm

I have wondered about another description too, and would like to get opinions here, since it's similar to the topic at hand -- is it wrong to use "have" and "has"? As in: " He has Asperger's" "She has high functioning autism" "I have -- "etc?

I was told by a clinical social worker that it's wrong to talk about "having" and "has" with autism and Asperger's because it's "not like having a cold" as she put it.

Is she correct -- should one not say "has"? I thought it was okay to use "I have, he has"? :?

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Marybird
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04 Jun 2014, 6:49 pm

BirdInFlight wrote:
I have wondered about another description too, and would like to get opinions here, since it's similar to the topic at hand -- is it wrong to use "have" and "has"? As in: " He has Asperger's" "She has high functioning autism" "I have -- "etc?

I was told by a clinical social worker that it's wrong to talk about "having" and "has" with autism and Asperger's because it's "not like having a cold" as she put it.

Is she correct -- should one not say "has"? I thought it was okay to use "I have, he has"? :?

.

Does it make more sense to follow it with condition or disorder?
I mean you can have the condition, but can you have the autism?

I think if you use have or has, then condition or disorder is implied.



LoveNotHate
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04 Jun 2014, 6:55 pm

Doesn't such self-referencing make it difficult to relate AS to oneself ?

How do you respond when someone asks if you have AS ? Answering, "I am autistic", does not answer the question.

This is improper, because of "have" ? ...
-I have AS
-I have Asperger Syndrome

This is proper ? ...
-I am Asperger.
-I am Asperger Syndrome.


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Last edited by LoveNotHate on 04 Jun 2014, 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Marybird
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04 Jun 2014, 6:59 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Doesn't such self-referencing make it difficult to relate AS to oneself ? How do you respond when someone asks if you have AS ?

this is improper .. because of "have"...
-I have AS
-I have Asperger Syndrome

this is proper ...
-I am Asperger.
-I am Asperger Syndrome.


Aspergic?
Autistic sounds better.



LoveNotHate
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04 Jun 2014, 7:01 pm

Marybird wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Doesn't such self-referencing make it difficult to relate AS to oneself ? How do you respond when someone asks if you have AS ?

this is improper .. because of "have"...
-I have AS
-I have Asperger Syndrome

this is proper ...
-I am Asperger.
-I am Asperger Syndrome.


Aspergic?
Autistic sounds better.


Answering, "I am autistic", does not answer the question. There are different kinds of "autistic".

Aspergic :) Is that even a word ?


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Last edited by LoveNotHate on 04 Jun 2014, 7:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Azereiah
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04 Jun 2014, 7:01 pm

"I am an Aspie" is the closest thing, but it's not a formal phrase.



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04 Jun 2014, 7:09 pm

Trifling liberal crap strikes again.



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04 Jun 2014, 7:14 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
I find the "people first" language to be insulting. The preposition "with" makes autism look like an object being carried---like "a man with a cane" or "a woman with a parasol"---rather than an inherent personality trait. You don't carry around autism. It's part of who you are! You can't prop it against an armrest when you sit down in a chair, like a cane. You can't fold it and leave it sitting in a closet, like a parasol. It's always there. It makes your life difficult. It causes you to put in tons of extra effort to get through the day. You can never get rid of it. If someone can be "with" something, they can also be "without" it. So the "with autism" construct is unfitting and patronizing. There is absolutely nothing wrong or insulting about saying "autistic person". Now, "autist" is bad, because you're not acknowledging their humanness, just their neurology.


I agree. It is dumb. It's like saying "a person with introvertedness" instead of "introverted", or "a person with artisticness" instead of "artistic".


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BirdInFlight
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04 Jun 2014, 7:23 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Doesn't such self-referencing make it difficult to relate AS to oneself ?

How do you respond when someone asks if you have AS ? Answering, "I am autistic", does not answer the question.

This is improper, because of "have" ? ...
-I have AS
-I have Asperger Syndrome

This is proper ? ...
-I am Asperger.
-I am Asperger Syndrome.


Well, exactly -- this is why I thought the person who told me "have" is wrong couldn't be correct about that. Because, just as you point out, you can't exactly say "I am Asperger"! :lol: I respect this person's opinion a lot, but this was one thing I thought she was way off base about.

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04 Jun 2014, 7:44 pm

You're all missing the point. Call yourselves what every you want, and bless your hearts.

Do you want people to talk to a person with a condition, or talk to a condition?

The point of this was never to change the way people with disabilities felt about themselves, it was to change the way that able-bodied people felt about them.

If you're cool with people treating you as a condition, then go for it, I guess. I'm pretty sure that everyone who mentioned political correctness just hates getting called out on their bigotry in other areas, though, so y'all can just shut the hell up about that.



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04 Jun 2014, 8:20 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
You're all missing the point. Call yourselves what every you want, and bless your hearts.

Do you want people to talk to a person with a condition, or talk to a condition?

The point of this was never to change the way people with disabilities felt about themselves, it was to change the way that able-bodied people felt about them.

If you're cool with people treating you as a condition, then go for it, I guess. I'm pretty sure that everyone who mentioned political correctness just hates getting called out on their bigotry in other areas, though, so y'all can just shut the hell up about that.


I get that language is powerful. But intent is also significant. To nitpick about language usage in this manner is not as helpful as it may seem. People should be aware of their impact on others when they choose their words, but those hearing them should not assume malintent or necessarily take offense. Good will is more effective than petty indignation.



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04 Jun 2014, 8:23 pm

I agree, Ann.

Are you a dog-groomer?



Ann2011
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04 Jun 2014, 8:52 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I agree, Ann.

Are you a dog-groomer?


I am on a trial period to see if I fit in. : ) She is really nice. She needs a "girl, Friday," someone to plug the holes. The farm is gorgeous!



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04 Jun 2014, 8:53 pm

Ann2011 wrote:

I get that language is powerful. But intent is also significant. To nitpick about language usage in this manner is not as helpful as it may seem. People should be aware of their impact on others when they choose their words, but those hearing them should not assume malintent or necessarily take offense. Good will is more effective than petty indignation.


Amen. To assume that people view someone "as a condition" just because they don't use person-first language is arrogant.



Last edited by starkid on 05 Jun 2014, 6:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

jrjones9933
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04 Jun 2014, 9:06 pm

Ann2011 wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
You're all missing the point. Call yourselves what every you want, and bless your hearts.

Do you want people to talk to a person with a condition, or talk to a condition?

The point of this was never to change the way people with disabilities felt about themselves, it was to change the way that able-bodied people felt about them.

If you're cool with people treating you as a condition, then go for it, I guess. I'm pretty sure that everyone who mentioned political correctness just hates getting called out on their bigotry in other areas, though, so y'all can just shut the hell up about that.


I get that language is powerful. But intent is also significant. To nitpick about language usage in this manner is not as helpful as it may seem. People should be aware of their impact on others when they choose their words, but those hearing them should not assume malintent or necessarily take offense. Good will is more effective than petty indignation.


Did you or Starkid actually read the post I wrote? It's like you're replying to someone else entirely. As I originally wrote, I care more about the effect on the speaker than on the listener.



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04 Jun 2014, 9:08 pm

Refer to yourself however you want to. Anybody who thinks that switching the order of words around is going to change how somebody else sees you is fooling themselves.

Say whatever you feel comfortable with, but if someone else who has it asks you to refer to them in a different way then by all means do that, because that's their personal preference and how they think of themselves.

I say "I have AS" when I actually bring it up in conversation, and at times I use "aspie" to refer to myself or others who have AS.

I guess all the really offensive words and phrases have been weeded out of the vernacular so now we have to dig really deep and grasp at straws and twist it around with armchair psychobabble to find something to be offended over.

Use whatever words you want to use. None of them are offensive.


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