The surprising body part that could be causing Autism

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goldfish21
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28 Jun 2014, 11:20 am

BeggingTurtle wrote:
Don't make me giggle.


OK. I won't tell any jokes.

This thread is actually very serious whether you believe it or not.


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Klowglas
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28 Jun 2014, 11:31 am

Reproductive organs cause autism because we would't have autism if we didn't exist in the first place!

Finally, this mystery was solved on an internet forum by a guy with a cartoon avatar.



goldfish21
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28 Jun 2014, 12:02 pm

Klowglas wrote:
Reproductive organs cause autism because we would't have autism if we didn't exist in the first place!

Finally, this mystery was solved on an internet forum by a guy with a cartoon avatar.


I don't believe you're that far off from the truth, considering we inherit both our parents' genes as well as their gut flora.


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KC73
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28 Jun 2014, 1:49 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
I don't believe you're that far off from the truth, considering we inherit both our parents' genes as well as their gut flora.

And their dietary habits, Those are all things that most people forget when they argue that it can't be a diet issue because autism and mental illness run in their family. And the connection between gut and neurological disorders is so not fringe science anymore, its been demonstrated over and over across a wide range of health/brain conditions and at some point all that research will get joined up and it'll be the accepted wisdom in the mainstream. We're not there yet because of the usual drawn out resistance that accompanys new discoverys, not because the evidence isnt there already. And theres a lot of investment in Autism from all sides of the debate so a lot of people dont want to hear that diet is such an important factor.

There is definitely a genetic component to spectrum conditions, but theres genetic components to most things because we're all grown from a bunch of genes with lifetime instructions in them. Thats the "nature" part. The "nurture" part is everything else that then interacts with those core instructions, and includes what food and substances are put into the body for it to work with/defend against. And its slightly bizarre that people will accept taking pharmaceutical medications to control symptoms and mood, but scoff at the idea that changing their diet might help.



goldfish21
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28 Jun 2014, 1:58 pm

KC73 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
I don't believe you're that far off from the truth, considering we inherit both our parents' genes as well as their gut flora.

And their dietary habits, Those are all things that most people forget when they argue that it can't be a diet issue because autism and mental illness run in their family. And the connection between gut and neurological disorders is so not fringe science anymore, its been demonstrated over and over across a wide range of health/brain conditions and at some point all that research will get joined up and it'll be the accepted wisdom in the mainstream. We're not there yet because of the usual drawn out resistance that accompanys new discoverys, not because the evidence isnt there already. And theres a lot of investment in Autism from all sides of the debate so a lot of people dont want to hear that diet is such an important factor.

There is definitely a genetic component to spectrum conditions, but theres genetic components to most things because we're all grown from a bunch of genes with lifetime instructions in them. Thats the "nature" part. The "nurture" part is everything else that then interacts with those core instructions, and includes what food and substances are put into the body for it to work with/defend against. And its slightly bizarre that people will accept taking pharmaceutical medications to control symptoms and mood, but scoff at the idea that changing their diet might help.


8O :heart: :D

Pretty much exactly what I've been preaching on these forums for several months after experiencing massive improvements over the last year and a half or two. Eventually people will begin to take this stuff seriously.

It's kind of sad that the biggest objections people around here seem to have to treating themselves are that they don't want to give up eating certain foods they like (temporarily) & to me that seems downright bizarre considering the long term benefits of doing it.

You are what you eat.


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XFilesGeek
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28 Jun 2014, 2:09 pm

KC73 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
I don't believe you're that far off from the truth, considering we inherit both our parents' genes as well as their gut flora.

And their dietary habits, Those are all things that most people forget when they argue that it can't be a diet issue because autism and mental illness run in their family. And the connection between gut and neurological disorders is so not fringe science anymore, its been demonstrated over and over across a wide range of health/brain conditions and at some point all that research will get joined up and it'll be the accepted wisdom in the mainstream. We're not there yet because of the usual drawn out resistance that accompanys new discoverys, not because the evidence isnt there already. And theres a lot of investment in Autism from all sides of the debate so a lot of people dont want to hear that diet is such an important factor.

There is definitely a genetic component to spectrum conditions, but theres genetic components to most things because we're all grown from a bunch of genes with lifetime instructions in them. Thats the "nature" part. The "nurture" part is everything else that then interacts with those core instructions, and includes what food and substances are put into the body for it to work with/defend against. And its slightly bizarre that people will accept taking pharmaceutical medications to control symptoms and mood, but scoff at the idea that changing their diet might help.


I exercise and eat right.

My symptoms don't change.

My "autism" is most likely caused by the massive gap between my visual and verbal IQ, not diet. Unless there's a magic super-food that can radically alter IQ. My stimming is most likely caused, as it's been demonstrated by some studies, abnormal dopamine receptors, not diet. The only symptoms I have that are ever affected by "diet" are anxiety and depression. I'll stick to my medications.

While I concede that SOME forms of what we currently consider "autism" may be partially caused by gut issues, I'm not convinced all forms of autism are.


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LupaLuna
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28 Jun 2014, 2:12 pm

Has anybody considered that maybe autism is causing the GI problems and not the other way around. Just like your heart rate, the GI track must me managed by subconscious functions in the brain. Think of it like the ECM on your car's engine.



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28 Jun 2014, 3:12 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:

I exercise and eat right.

My symptoms don't change.

My "autism" is most likely caused by the massive gap between my visual and verbal IQ, not diet. Unless there's a magic super-food that can radically alter IQ. My stimming is most likely caused, as it's been demonstrated by some studies, abnormal dopamine receptors, not diet. The only symptoms I have that are ever affected by "diet" are anxiety and depression. I'll stick to my medications.

While I concede that SOME forms of what we currently consider "autism" may be partially caused by gut issues, I'm not convinced all forms of autism are.


As I tried to explain in my 1st and 2nd post, they are different forms of Autism. The one I called "real" autism, is caused by "circuits" in the brain that are actually "wired" differently, while the other types are not, they are not due to "circuits wired differently" (their brain is probably perfectly normal), but rather due to certain chemical reactions in the brain (and in other cases possibly due to the bacteria mentioned in this thread, which then possibly causes certain issues in the brain, or maybe the 2 are related, I have no idea). It is somewhat similar to a person who would take a certain drug and have a different behavior because of this drug, except in this case it is due to a reaction to certain components in food, which then cause symptoms similar to Autism (i.e. because it "weakens" - not sure which word to use here - certain circuits in the brain, while enhancing others).

For a person who is actually - physically - autistic (i.e. brain is wired differently) a diet won't make any difference, but for a person who is not actually/physically autistic (i.e. a person who's brain is wired "normally", like most people), a diet can make a difference. But as Temple Grandin (and others) mentioned, the brain continues to create new "circuits" and to accumulate information, so even for someone who is (physically) autistic (i.e. brain wired differently), there is always hope to overcome certain symptoms that are disabling, at least to a point. And Temple did this herself as well, she is still a visual thinker - which I actually think is great, I am myself a visual thinker - but she has changed over the years, she has become better at many things, and as she said herself, she is better at socialising, and she is much quicker at finding solutions than she was when she was younger.

(this is the diet that I have seen some parents mention on different articles and youtube: http://autism-diet.com/ , they told me that with this diet their child's Autism symptoms had disappeared, but I am pretty convinced that all these children have a normal brain, not an autistic brain)


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KC73
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28 Jun 2014, 3:17 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:

I exercise and eat right.

My symptoms don't change.
.


The problem is we've all been told that theres a right and healthy way to eat thats the same for everyone, and thats not the true case. Its about eating and living right for your particular make up and giving your body and brain the optimum conditions for its particular genetics and chemistry etc to flourish in. So you could be eating what looks like a great diet, but if its not the right one for your optimum functioning then its not eating "right". I have an inherited genetic disorder and "doing the right things" ,according to mainstream teachings, with diet, makes me ill because my it doesnt meet my bodys specific needs. for example I need to eat a lot of salt, on medical advice, and theres a lot of fruit that i'm not supposed to eat. When I spent some time on medical meal replacement drinks I got sick because the "complete daily nutrition" wasnt what my body could work with. Medicinal diets arent necessarily the same as the ones that are promoted as healthy.

Quote:
My "autism" is most likely caused by the massive gap between my visual and verbal IQ, not diet. Unless there's a magic super-food that can radically alter IQ. My stimming is most likely caused, as it's been demonstrated by some studies, abnormal dopamine receptors, not diet.

Diet has been shown to have a measurable effect on IQ, and diet also affects how well dopamine circuits are able to work. Its not magic, if you put the wrong type of fuel into any other vehicle it wont work as well as it could with the right fuel for it and our bodies are no different. Except we dont come with instructions about which fuel mix to use.

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The only symptoms I have that are ever affected by "diet" are anxiety and depression. I'll stick to my medications.

Thats very dismissive both of your bodys fuel source and of the emotions that exist to tell your conscious mind that something is wrong and needs attention and change. Medications are a new thing in human evolution, they're almost all derived from plants so theyre not that removed from "diet", the "science" behind many of them is not nearly robust as we're led to believe, and they make a whole lot of money for a small group of people who have a vested interest in promoting them as superior to the plants themselves and the food we eat. Of course its easier to pop a pill and deny responsibility for issues on the grounds that theyre caused by things beyond our control, and I am nowhere near a saint myself at doing the right things to stay healthy when its "easier" not to, but thats not a factual argument against diet being something that affects autistic symptoms.



KC73
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28 Jun 2014, 3:41 pm

[quote=goldfish21]Pretty much exactly what I've been preaching on these forums for several months[/quote]
Wow, I've just read the thread in your signiture 8O I had no idea that the gut-brain link is considered so controversial here. But I guess everyone believed the world was flat once and laughed at the idea it was round..

I do think that the diagnoses of autism and aspergers are labels for a behavior syndrome rather than the name of an actual "thing", so it makes sense that there are several root causes of those behaviours/ways of being. Thats the case with most things. And that does make it nonsensical to talk about people with these labels as if we've all got the same core "fault". As other people have said, there are some people with observably different brain wiring/ activation patterns and some people with NT brains but spectrum symptoms. I dont think that means those latter people arent "really" autistic because while they have those symptoms they are experiencing the world and life through that autistic lens. And I do think we should push for acceptance of differently wired/activated brains, but also that anything that makes us more able to function with these untypical brains is a good thing.



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28 Jun 2014, 3:50 pm

XFilesGeek wrote:
I exercise and eat right.

My symptoms don't change.


I've had several extended periods in the past where I exercised and ate right, yet my symptoms did not change.

It was only when I went on a completely medicinal diet & supplements AND made the extraordinary effort to treat myself via high volume herbal enemas as described in the thread in my sig that I improved dramatically. I've since been consuming more and more intestinal repairing supplements as well as daily probiotics. It's made a world of difference in my life.

Regular "eating right," cannot cleanse the digestive tract as it needs to be IF it's in the state mine was in.


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NGC6205
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28 Jun 2014, 4:01 pm

Perhaps it is because there has been so much pseudoscience related to diet over years, not just with Autism, that I have become a very strong skeptic of almost all non-mainstream theories. That is not to say I believe we have a perfect understanding of nutrition, physiological, and all GI-related pathologies, but just because science will never be 100% right and major parts of current theory were once against the establishment, does not mean in itself that any given non-mainstream theory is likely to ever become mainstream. That is also not to say I am against fully willing and knowledgable participants experimenting on themselves with non-harmful non-mainstream diets, especially if it appears to work. I just will never personally accept it until it is well established by rigorous experiments and well accepted by mainstream medical authoriies.



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28 Jun 2014, 4:12 pm

Shadi2 wrote:
As I tried to explain in my 1st and 2nd post, they are different forms of Autism. The one I called "real" autism, is caused by "circuits" in the brain that are actually "wired" differently, while the other types are not, they are not due to "circuits wired differently" (their brain is probably perfectly normal), but rather due to certain chemical reactions in the brain (and in other cases possibly due to the bacteria mentioned in this thread, which then possibly causes certain issues in the brain, or maybe the 2 are related, I have no idea). It is somewhat similar to a person who would take a certain drug and have a different behavior because of this drug, except in this case it is due to a reaction to certain components in food, which then cause symptoms similar to Autism (i.e. because it "weakens" - not sure which word to use here - certain circuits in the brain, while enhancing others).


I don't know whether these two types you describe exist or not. Maybe they do, maybe they don't.

The article I linked to in the OP says that up to 90% of those on the autism spectrum have tummy troubles. That's 90% of people diagnosed with autism. IMO, the correlation seems extremely strong, and in my experience, the digestive issues cause the neurological, sensory, and behavioural ones.


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goldfish21
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28 Jun 2014, 4:15 pm

KC73 wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Pretty much exactly what I've been preaching on these forums for several months

Wow, I've just read the thread in your signiture 8O I had no idea that the gut-brain link is considered so controversial here. But I guess everyone believed the world was flat once and laughed at the idea it was round..


Mmmhmm. On the bright side, there's at least a positive discussion going on in this thread now. 8) The more and more articles that have come out over the months about studies proving what I've shared, the more people here on these forums are beginning to accept it as possible - or even probable - vs. outright calling me a liar. That's progress.

I have no personal vested interest in people believing me in terms of it benefitting ME, either financially or my ego. I simply persist in sharing what I've done because I believe in the value of it and hope that others are able to experience the same improvements to their lives as I have.


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28 Jun 2014, 4:22 pm

NGC6205 wrote:
Perhaps it is because there has been so much pseudoscience related to diet over years, not just with Autism, that I have become a very strong skeptic of almost all non-mainstream theories. That is not to say I believe we have a perfect understanding of nutrition, physiological, and all GI-related pathologies, but just because science will never be 100% right and major parts of current theory were once against the establishment, does not mean in itself that any given non-mainstream theory is likely to ever become mainstream. That is also not to say I am against fully willing and knowledgable participants experimenting on themselves with non-harmful non-mainstream diets, especially if it appears to work. I just will never personally accept it until it is well established by rigorous experiments and well accepted by mainstream medical authoriies.


Maybe. I'm sure there's been a lot of snake-oil salesmen selling remedies for every ailment throughout time.

Aside: I'd like to point out that I'm still not selling anyone anything. I've freely given away the knowledge of what has worked for me in hopes that it works for others for their own benefit.

I find it odd that you acknowledge that these things may work, yet are not willing to try them yourself unless some mainstream medical authority tells you it's ok. If such a dietary experiment can't really do any harm, I don't see why people aren't willing to give it a shot themselves and find out if it works. To me, time & quality of life are much too valuable to waste. I wouldn't want to sit around for several years waiting for someone to tell me that it was OK to try something that has worked for others already. I'd just try it and find out for myself in a matter of weeks/months - and obviously, I did. I just don't see the logic in putting my health in someone else' hands as if they're more capable of making a decision about my body than I am. If mainstream doctors are that far behind for whatever reason, then so be it, I'll just leave them in the dust and deal with things myself. Done & done. I just can't fathom thinking that I need a doctor's permission or seal of approval to do something that benefits my health, and because of that can't really figure out why others take the position that you do.


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