Attwood mentions Complex breathing patterns-have?

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little_blue_jay
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22 Oct 2014, 12:59 pm

So I've been curious about this for a while - on pg. 267 of Tony Attwood's book he lists motor tics, and under Complex tics the last one is "Complex breathing patterns".

So far as I can see nowhere else in the book does he elaborate on that particular tic - if I'm wrong on this please point out a page number!

I very often notice that I breathe weird. Now I am 99% sure I have POTS (I realize not everyone has heard of it, here's a link)
http://www.dinet.org/index.php/informat ... s-symptoms

but not diagnosed with it. When I am having a flare-up (mine comes and goes for weeks at a time) I will have bad shortness of breath.

However lately I catch myself breathing odd when not in a flare-up. Mainly high up in the chest, with very quick fast short breaths. I have to tell myself to exhale fully, and then I feel for a moment that I'm not getting enough air. I've mentioned this to my doctor and he's listened to my lungs many times and he's not concerned about it. I've had a lung perfusion test which I passed.

I also catch myself holding my breath. Odd I know. I do tend to be an anxious person, but alot of the time when this happens I do not feel anxious at all. Then I realize how I'm breathing, mainly because it dawns on me that I'm starting to feel lightheaded, then I wonder why I'm breathing like that, not fully exhaling, holding etc. and then I might start to get anxious, but I wasn't anxious at the start :huh:

Also I only tend to be anxious when alone (my roommate is away alot) but I have caught myself holding my breath or breathing shallow when he is here, or when my other quirky guy friend is keeping me company for a bit.

I am curious if anyone here knows what Attwood is talking about, with "Complex breathing patterns"?

Has anyone here who is diagnosed been told when they were getting diagnosed that they do use "complex breathing patterns"?

What do those patterns look like and/or feel like?


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AspieUtah
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22 Oct 2014, 1:21 pm

Looking for descriptions or examples of complex-breathing patterns, I found:

?Among more forceful or complex breathing patterns, ?skull shining breath? or ?breath of fire? can cleanse the sinuses and improve lung function. It involves taking one deep inhale through the nose and then exhaling in short powerful bursts, about one a second for 10 seconds, and repeat three times. (Because this breathing can increase heart rate, those with high blood pressure or other heart conditions should consult their doctor first.) ?Alternate-nostril breathing,? which can clear the mind and reduce stress, is a complex pattern also best learned from a qualified instructor.?

http://www.mylittlebird.com/2014/09/a-f ... ath-of-air

?Exclusive use of Lamaze without pharmacological pain relief fell out of fashion in the early ?80s as epidural anesthesia became widely available, and as scientific literature began showing that those complex breathing patterns didn?t really help mitigate pain.?

http://www.newstatesman.com/lifestyle/2 ... childbirth

Based on these descriptions, I would conclude that complex-breathing patterns include any extraordinary, repetitious or intentional breathing.


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little_blue_jay
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22 Oct 2014, 1:33 pm

But if Attwood considers them "Complex motor tics" then I would have understood that they were done involuntarily?

He lists other Complex motor tics such as Touching objects, Licking, Pinching, Waving both arms like bird wings, Animal noises, etc. Basically what we would call "Stimming", only he does not use that word.

The list is in a section called "Involuntary Movements or Tics" pg. 266.


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Diagnosed "Asperger's to a moderate degree" April 7, 2015.
Aspie score 145 of 200
NT score 56 of 200
AQ score: 47
RAADS-R score: 196
"Everyone inside the circle is normal. Everyone outside the circle should be beaten, broken, and reset, so they can be brought inside the circle. Failing that, they should be institutionalized, or worse, pitied. Why would you feel sorry for someone who gets to opt out of the inane courteous formalities, which are utterly meaningless, insincere, and therefore degrading? Can you imagine how liberating it would be to live a life free of all the mind-numbing social niceties? I don't pity this kid. I envy him." Dr. Gregory House, speaking of a boy with autism, House M.D.


Last edited by little_blue_jay on 22 Oct 2014, 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

AspieUtah
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22 Oct 2014, 1:37 pm

little_blue_jay wrote:
But if Attwood considers them "Complex motor tics" then I would have understood that they were done involuntarily?

He lists other Complex motor tics such as Touching objects, Licking, Pinching, Waving both arms like bird wings, Animal noises, etc. Basically what we would call "Stimming", only he does not use that word.

I took it to mean that even the complex breathing patterns were involuntary?

Yep. I agree with you about that.


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Diagnosed in 2015 with ASD Level 1 by the University of Utah Health Care Autism Spectrum Disorder Clinic using the ADOS-2 Module 4 assessment instrument [11/30] -- Screened in 2014 with ASD by using the University of Cambridge Autism Research Centre AQ (Adult) [43/50]; EQ-60 for adults [11/80]; FQ [43/135]; SQ (Adult) [130/150] self-reported screening inventories -- Assessed since 1978 with an estimated IQ [≈145] by several clinicians -- Contact on WrongPlanet.net by private message (PM)


little_blue_jay
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22 Oct 2014, 1:39 pm

I'm very curious if anyone here can describe more about this. Especially if when they got diagnosed they were told that they do some type of Complex breathing pattern, or if a parent of an autistic child has noticed their child doing this.


_________________
Diagnosed "Asperger's to a moderate degree" April 7, 2015.
Aspie score 145 of 200
NT score 56 of 200
AQ score: 47
RAADS-R score: 196
"Everyone inside the circle is normal. Everyone outside the circle should be beaten, broken, and reset, so they can be brought inside the circle. Failing that, they should be institutionalized, or worse, pitied. Why would you feel sorry for someone who gets to opt out of the inane courteous formalities, which are utterly meaningless, insincere, and therefore degrading? Can you imagine how liberating it would be to live a life free of all the mind-numbing social niceties? I don't pity this kid. I envy him." Dr. Gregory House, speaking of a boy with autism, House M.D.


Tizerize
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22 Oct 2014, 4:26 pm

little_blue_jay wrote:
I ... catch myself holding my breath. Odd I know. I do tend to be an anxious person, but alot of the time when this happens I do not feel anxious at all. Then I realize how I'm breathing, mainly because it dawns on me that I'm starting to feel lightheaded, then I wonder why I'm breathing like that, not fully exhaling, holding etc. and then I might start to get anxious, but I wasn't anxious at the start :huh:

i accidently hold my breath sometimes too ~ it happens when i get engrossed in a film or when (eg) i'm thinking 'too hard' about something. The last time it happened (a couple weeks ago) i was walking outdoors, trying to figure something out, and suddenly had to put my thoughts on hold so i could cross a road ...when i got to the other side i realized i'd accidently put breathing on hold too.

I also hold my breath on purpose sometimes, just for a little while, if / when i notice an unpleasant odour (becoz that's got to be better than 'breathing' in eg cigarette smoke which upsets my brain / nervous system) but i don't think that's why i sometimes hold my breath by accident ~ i've been doing the concentration related holds longer, since i was a kid, tho i don't think it happened as often back then (at least not so i noticed)


AspieUtah wrote:
Looking for descriptions or examples of complex-breathing patterns, I found ...... ?Exclusive use of Lamaze without pharmacological pain relief fell out of fashion in the early ?80s as epidural anesthesia became widely available, and as scientific literature began showing that those complex breathing patterns didn?t really help mitigate pain.?

After escaping (eg) a crowded train i sometimes catch myself doing 'lamaze' type breathing ...i think it helps me physically adjust to having my personal space back, & to having enough room to move freely once again. I have no idea when i started doing that ~ it wasn't / isn't planned (after all, it did nothing for me when i went into labour!)

little_blue_jay wrote:
He lists other Complex motor tics such as Touching objects, Licking, Pinching, Waving both arms like bird wings, Animal noises, etc. Basically what we would call "Stimming", only he does not use that word.

Another thing i sometimes do after i've been confined to a tiny, uncomfortably crowded space for any length of time is to raise and twist my arms ~ my elbows get very tense when i'm trying to protect my body (/nervous system) from unwanted physical contact. I imagine the 'bird wing' motion (and even twirling) could bring similar physical and psychological relief...but i could be totally wrong about that ~ sometimes, altho not often, i bite without meaning to, hard (down onto my finger if it happens to be in my mouth, or, just as painfully, onto my toungue, or onto nothing but air), and i can find no logical reason for it ...but tourettes related actions are often as confusing for the subject as they are to observers.


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