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Seba7290
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24 Jun 2018, 12:17 pm

A person on Quora claims that

“The ones who have classical autism are like my sister; not able to function in society well, will most likely need to be supervised for the rest of their lives. Those with classical autism also tends to be nonverbal, regardless of speech therapy, pretty much remaining nonverbal, and may have lower IQ. Having Aspergers still have the same symptoms as autism, the only difference is that those with Aspergers are usually able to function in society better, blend in to the point you may not even notice them unless you pay close attention to detail.”

I have “classic” autism (albeit high-functioning) and this is making me scared for my future.

Sorry if this post feels a bit paranoid



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24 Jun 2018, 12:21 pm

You don't need to apologize. It's ok to be scared. We will try to help you understand whatever you need to understand. What exactly are you afraid of? Like what specifically are you afraid of?


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Seba7290
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24 Jun 2018, 12:39 pm

That I will never live independently and will always need supervision like this person is implying. Like having classic autism always means you’re completly unable to functioning in society.



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24 Jun 2018, 12:51 pm

Well, here is the deal. That might be but then again that might not be. There are plenty of people who started out with very severe issues but who have learned to overcome some of these issues and have been able to get to the point where they can live quite independently. So do not ever think that you cannot improve your situation. There are some people who have not been able to improve their situations but that does not mean that that is true for everyone. There are even members of this site who started out very severe and who have made tremendous progress which has really changed their lives. So all you can do is to do your very best. Set goals that you want to achieve and do everything you possibly can to achieve them. But if you realize that these goals are too much and that they are hurting you, you can change them to accommodate what you need. There is no shame in any of this.

There is also no shame in needing help. I live alone, my husband no longer lives with me, and I have been living alone for several years now. I am considered very high functioning. But there are many times when I also need help with even the most basic things. And because no one will help me, I just have to go without until I can do the things myself again. So there might be times when I can't eat for a few days or I can't shower for a few days, and I just have to wait until my brain resets itself so that I can do those kinds of things again even if it takes a while. So we all need some kind of help even if we are considered very high functioning. But I think that you can absolutely make improvements. There are lots of programs to help you and I don't see any reason at all why you can't improve in some areas. You might even possibly be able to improve in all areas of your life but even if you can't improve in all areas, I know for sure that you can improve in some.

If you are nonverbal, you might need a communication device. But that is ok. Verbal is very overrated.


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Seba7290
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24 Jun 2018, 1:38 pm

skibum wrote:
Well, here is the deal. That might be but then again that might not be. There are plenty of people who started out with very severe issues but who have learned to overcome some of these issues and have been able to get to the point where they can live quite independently. So do not ever think that you cannot improve your situation. There are some people who have not been able to improve their situations but that does not mean that that is true for everyone. There are even members of this site who started out very severe and who have made tremendous progress which has really changed their lives. So all you can do is to do your very best. Set goals that you want to achieve and do everything you possibly can to achieve them. But if you realize that these goals are too much and that they are hurting you, you can change them to accommodate what you need. There is no shame in any of this.

There is also no shame in needing help. I live alone, my husband no longer lives with me, and I have been living alone for several years now. I am considered very high functioning. But there are many times when I also need help with even the most basic things. And because no one will help me, I just have to go without until I can do the things myself again. So there might be times when I can't eat for a few days or I can't shower for a few days, and I just have to wait until my brain resets itself so that I can do those kinds of things again even if it takes a while. So we all need some kind of help even if we are considered very high functioning. But I think that you can absolutely make improvements. There are lots of programs to help you and I don't see any reason at all why you can't improve in some areas. You might even possibly be able to improve in all areas of your life but even if you can't improve in all areas, I know for sure that you can improve in some.

If you are nonverbal, you might need a communication device. But that is ok. Verbal is very overrated.


I am verbal. But is it generally true that people with classic autism without intellectual disability have more problems functioning in society than those with aspergers? I would like some statistics on that.



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24 Jun 2018, 1:45 pm

Seba7290 wrote:
A person on Quora claims that

“The ones who have classical autism are like my sister; not able to function in society well, will most likely need to be supervised for the rest of their lives. Those with classical autism also tends to be nonverbal, regardless of speech therapy, pretty much remaining nonverbal, and may have lower IQ. Having Aspergers still have the same symptoms as autism, the only difference is that those with Aspergers are usually able to function in society better, blend in to the point you may not even notice them unless you pay close attention to detail.”

I have “classic” autism (albeit high-functioning) and this is making me scared for my future.

Sorry if this post feels a bit paranoid


Sounds like this person who told you all of this is confused in their terminology.

If youre "high functioning" then you are NOT "classic" Kanner type autistic. You are already not in the category in question. So none of that applies to you.

Someone who is actually diagnosed as "high functioning autistic" is usually quite similar to someone dxd with aspergers, and both would be quite different from a low function autistic.

Dr. Asperger discovered one part of the austism spectrum in Austria in thirties and forties. And the American Dr.Kanner discovered another part of the AS in the fifties and sixties. Only decades later was autism thought of a spectrum-a spectrum big enough to include both of the syndromes named for the above discoverers.

But what Kanner considered autism back in the Sixties was ONLY what today is called "low functioning" autism, or "type three" autism. He turned down patients because he only considered the most extreme to be in his newfound category.

Only decades later did they recognize that other folks have lesser degrees of autism, and at about the same time the English speaking world recognized aspergers as a diagnosis and lumped it in with the new concept of autism as a spectrum.

So today when folks talk about "classic autism", or about "Kanner type autism", they mean that narrow category that Kanner classified as "autistic" prior to the "spectrum" concept taking over. And that narrow type is what we now call "low functioning", or "Type III" autism.

So if you are already labeled "high functioning autistic", or as type I, or even as type II, you are already outside the boundry of "classic autism".

So...yes a person who is what is sometimes today called "Classic Kanner type autistic" is indeed a person who needs a lot of support. Not necessarily totally nonverbal. But couldn't survive by themselves in society. But apparently you are not in the category. So don't worry.

Now a whole bunch of folks are gonna jump in and quarrel with me, and tell me that these functioning labels are all just labels and every autistic is an individual. Which is all true. But in theory that's how the labels work. And therefore you don't need to worry that youre gonna grow to be THAT extreme of a basket case.



Seba7290
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24 Jun 2018, 2:00 pm

I don’t think all of them were what we would call “low-functioning” today. The very first person Kanner diagnosed went to college, traveled around the world, and now lives independently.

And I thought “classic autism” referred to autistic people that had a delay in learning to speak



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24 Jun 2018, 2:00 pm

I don't know if there are actual statistics like percentage lists that you can find. I guess you can try to google it but I don't even know what you would put in the search.

Now to answer your question from a more practical point of view, it is kind of a difficult question to answer because I think that the answer is both yes and no. Now I am not an expert in the subject and I am not going to pretend to be one. I can only speak from my own experiences and my own personal observations so please keep that in mind anytime you read anything I post or write anywhere.

What I have personally observed is that nowadays, if you are lower functioning and you are obviously disabled, a lot of society tends to accept you more than if you are higher functioning. Because they can visibly tell that you are disabled and that you have struggles, they tend to accept the fact that you have these challenges and they don't hold them against you. Yes, it is more difficult to navigate things in society because you are very challenged, but society gives you a break because they can tell that you are very challenged and they know that it is not your fault that you are this way. They are more likely to accept and understand that you are doing the best you can with what you have.

When you are very high functioning, you will often have many of the same challenges that a lower functioning person might have but because you look normal, no one in society will believe that you have these challenges. Well some people who are educated will but most people who are ignorant will not. They will say that you are having these struggles because you are lazy or undisciplined or whatever reason they would have for not doing something. They tend to refuse to believe that you legitimately cannot do some of the things that they expect you to be able to do. They think that because every normal person can do these things you can also and so they put those expectations on you and don't allow you to be accommodated for your disability even though you really struggle. Even trying to get services which you are just as entitled to get as any lower functioning person because you need them also, becomes a huge challenge because you are often denied services because people think you look too normal even though your challenges are huge and even though some of your challenges can be even more difficult than some people who are lower functioning.

So yes, in some ways, it can be easier to get by in society if you are higher functioning but in other ways it can be almost impossible to survive the expectations that society puts on you.


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24 Jun 2018, 2:01 pm

Seba7290 wrote:
A person on Quora claims that

“The ones who have classical autism are like my sister; not able to function in society well, will most likely need to be supervised for the rest of their lives. Those with classical autism also tends to be nonverbal, regardless of speech therapy, pretty much remaining nonverbal, and may have lower IQ. Having Aspergers still have the same symptoms as autism, the only difference is that those with Aspergers are usually able to function in society better, blend in to the point you may not even notice them unless you pay close attention to detail.”

I have “classic” autism (albeit high-functioning) and this is making me scared for my future.

Sorry if this post feels a bit paranoid


Assuming we start with a rating of 100% lets enumerate the assertions as parts and then assign them three ratings.

True
someplace in the middle
Untrue

1)The poster has a sister (assumed to be true)
2)Classic Autistics are unable to function in society (often but not universally true)
3)Classic Autistics require supervision for most their lives. (sometimes and not universally true)
4)Classic Autistics are non verbal. (often but not universally true)
5)Speech therapy doesn't significantly help classic Autistics (it depends on the person and is sometimes but not always true)
6)Classic Autistics may have low I.Q.'s (Impossible to know without a way to read their minds)
7)People with Asperger's have the same symptoms as as classic Autistics (only sometimes true, with variation from person to person)
8 )People with Asperger's are usually able to function better in society (than classic Autistics) ...(true...usually)
9)NTs will not notice People with Asperger's without paying close attention (often but not always true)

OK, time to count the parts. Tally? NINE parts...lucky that. 9/9 to begin, how much is definitely true...let's see.
we will put all the parts that are mostly true and above in the true category which will be first.

1)The poster has a sister (assumed to be true)
2)Classic Autistics are non verbal. (mostly but not universally true)
3)People with Asperger's are usually able to function better in society (than classic Autistics) ...(true...usually)
4)NTs will not notice People with Asperger's without paying close attention (often but not always true)

OK, so that's all the stuff that is definitely and mostly true, final rating? 4/9

Next, stuff that's not "true or false" enough of the time to confidently be called one or the other.

1)Classic Autistics are unable to function in society (often but not universally true)
2)Classic Autistics require supervision for most their lives. (sometimes and not universally true)
3)Speech therapy doesn't significantly help classic Autistics (depends on the person. sometimes but not always true)
4)Classic Autistics may have low I.Q.'s (Impossible to know without a way to read their minds)

Hmmmm 4/9 again. Moving on. Stuff that's Mostly untrue or outright false.

1)People with Asperger's have the same symptoms as as classic Autistics (only sometimes true, with variation from person to person)


It varies from person to person so this just does not quite make the cut. Of course it can happen but it can;t be claimed with real confidence to say HOW true it is. Well...that's it 1/9

OK! time for the grand total!

In response to the original post "How True is this Statement?" the answer is .............

The statement is approximately 44% true 44%Realistically undecidable and 11.% False for reason of presenting a scenario that has tremendous variation as always or often being one way. SO!

there you go! Don't worry! it is only 44% true! :D



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24 Jun 2018, 2:12 pm

In order to get an Autism diagnosis of any kind, you have to have core traits and symptoms whether you are diagnosed with what used to be Asperger's or with what used to be classic Autism. The only difference between the two was that Asperger's did not not have a language delay. So you cannot say that people who have a diagnosis that used to be called Asperger's, which is now ASD level 1, have different symptoms than a person who has classic Autism or ASD level 2 or 3. The only differences might be in the severity levels of those symptoms or in how consistently they persist, not in the actual symptoms themselves. We all have to have a minimum amount of the same core traits and symptoms and they have to be impairing in our daily lives in order to get any ASD diagnosis to begin with. So to say that people with Asperger's do not have the same symptoms as people with classic Autism is a false statement. The severity levels can differ and how people exhibit or manifest them can differ but the symptoms are the same.


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25 Jun 2018, 10:14 am

There are "high-functioning" people who also happen to have "classic" autism.

Having "classic" autism does not preclude you from success, despite the statistics.



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25 Jun 2018, 12:03 pm

“Kanner’s Autism” is not a diagnosis in any manual nor are functioning labels. They are descriptors and the what they mean is often based on the person using it or hearing/reading it thinks it is.

What is described below are the most common professional usage of terms.
“Low Functioning Autism” - Autism with below average intelligence/IQ below 70
“High Functioning Autism” - Autism with average to above average intelligence
“Aspergers Syndrome” - High Functioning Autism without language delay before age 3
“Kanner’s/Classic Autism” - Any non-Aspergers Autism

Autistics with average intelligence and no language delay were supposed to be diagnosed with Aspergers.
A genius autistic that had a language delay under the common professional usage should be described as classically Autistic, same goes for a highly verbal autistic that had a language delay.


The professional functioning labels descriptions have nothing to do with the ability to function in society.

Often the abilities of low functioning/severe autistics are underestimated, same holds true in regards to the difficulties of high functioning/mild autistics.


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25 Jun 2018, 12:11 pm

Seba7290 wrote:
A person on Quora claims that

“The ones who have classical autism are like my sister; not able to function in society well, will most likely need to be supervised for the rest of their lives. Those with classical autism also tends to be nonverbal, regardless of speech therapy, pretty much remaining nonverbal, and may have lower IQ. Having Aspergers still have the same symptoms as autism, the only difference is that those with Aspergers are usually able to function in society better, blend in to the point you may not even notice them unless you pay close attention to detail.”

I have “classic” autism (albeit high-functioning) and this is making me scared for my future.

Sorry if this post feels a bit paranoid


He's confusing the term classic autism with level 2 moderate and level 3 severe autism. Like to him lv 2 and 3 are the definition of classic autism, but that's incorrect.



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25 Jun 2018, 12:22 pm

It‘s just one opinion of one specific person on quora. Don‘t be afraid :) this person might have no idea what he or she is talking about. Also I herad from countless sources that all autistic people do or can improve throughout their lives!


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25 Jun 2018, 8:49 pm

I am not improving. I am getting worse.


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