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GreenTeaLatte
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22 Aug 2017, 10:23 am

Can Ptsd from continued childhood trauma look like an Asd?
I have been going to therapy for a while now , At one time I had a diagnosis of an adjustment disorder and then after a couple weeks at a hospital I was diagnosed Bipolar, general anxiety and Ptsd but after taking a written test with a psychologist I am now diagnosed with only Ptsd, anxiety and depression.
My husband and I have been seeing my therapist together and he mentioned Autism to her and she thought that my behaviors such as lack of eye contact and low social skills can be explained through trauma and my increased need for routine and structure are due to low homelife stability as a child but if I am interested in trying to test for it I would have to write a list of good reasons as to why to give to the psychologist.
So I guess Im just not sure how they differentiate the effects of childhood neglect and emotional trauma from the behaviors typical in someone with ASD, and would it be even worth talking to the psychologist, should I just take my therapists words for it....
Also Autism has to be there from the start but I dont have anyone still left in my life to say what I was like as a child so Im not sure how that would work...
Tbh Im just frustrated. I feel like everyone else is able to glide through life, understand who they are and effectively build bonds and function normally while I feel like Im close to drowning most days...



kraftiekortie
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22 Aug 2017, 10:27 am

In order for one to be autistic, one has to have had autistic behaviors in infancy or very early childhood.

I seems very much like PTSD---based on what you wrote.

Did you have any speech delays as a child? Any delays, period?

Even if it turns out you're not autistic, you're still very much welcomed here on WP. Many people with many disorders can establish common ground with each other.



GreenTeaLatte
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22 Aug 2017, 10:47 am

I did have coordination issues and had to take special classes I guess, also I had some issue with reading and took some program for it but by the time I was in highschool I excelled in reading and spelling so it could not have been too bad. But as far as speech delays I really dont think so. Thank you for your reply



kraftiekortie
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22 Aug 2017, 10:49 am

How did you play when you were a very young child?

Autistic kids tend not to play "appropriately."

They might spin a fire truck around, instead of pretending to "drive" the fire truck and pretend to be a firefighter.

Or they might think of a doll as a ball, and throw it around---rather than think the doll is a baby to be taken care of.



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22 Aug 2017, 10:55 am

That's a tough one because you can also have an Autistic version of PTSD. I recommend you doing as much extensive research on both subjects as you can to see if you fit one more than the other. But like kraftie said, either way, we want you in our community.


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GreenTeaLatte
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22 Aug 2017, 11:38 am

I don't know what I was like as a young child, I have very few select memories and have heard a few things but most of my life is a blur, my sense of time is awful, so I can't place an event I remember on any particular timeline. I don't remember playing with toys until I was a bit older, I preferred boys toys when I did, I liked collecting animal and dinosaur figures, catching bugs, things I could put together like blocks and Legos, puzzles, when I was given barbies I took them apart. I was a tomboy I guess, I asked a lot of questions on how things work and why.
I guess what I'm wondering is if I did try to take a test would it matter because I don't have a reliable source of information on what I was like as a child? I've definately done research but I feel like both things seem to fit, would getting help for just ptsd be okay?
But regardless thank you for welcoming me!



kraftiekortie
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22 Aug 2017, 11:45 am

it's not unusual for girls to prefer "boys' toys." I've known many girls/women---straight, gay, and otherwise who grew up as "tomboys." Some of them turned out to be feminine; others not so much.

You might just have been a child who was curious about things---nothing to do with gender, but everything to do with being a person.

I don't "sense" autism--but one never knows.

When you do seek an assessment, try to find a clinician who specializes in adult autism.



Earthbound_Alien
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22 Aug 2017, 11:51 am

Hi, ive been curious about this myself as I grew up in a violent household and experienced a lot of physical and psychological abuse when I was growing up.

I have symptoms of both ASD and PTSD though so it's very hard to tell.

Yes I am socially wary of people due to said abuse and bullying when I was younger and this affects my social skills but at the same time I also had (and still have) physical sensitivity issues (such as having to have my labels cut out of my clothes growing up, not being able to wear certain materials, intolerant of noisy places and so on and so forth.

Then again I also differ from those on the spectrum in certain ways in that I get really into my favourite hobby (or passionate as I like to call it...others would call me down right obsessed :D) but my interests actually change and can be quite broad (as opposed to narrow).

There are many things that can and often do fascinate me although I will always have one that dominates over the others (but again, my dominant interest can alter over time Ie...previously it was paleolithic nutrition and the effects of nutrition on brain function and although that still sits in the background as a part of my lifestyle (paleo diet) my main fascination is now Minimalism particularly the Japanese minimalist movement...if interested read Goodbye, Things by Fumio Sasaki).

Basically Im a paleo minimalist whom is interested in Japanese minimalist culture, taking a wild survival course ancestral lifestyles.

I also like cross stitching too...so I have some more everyday hobbies in my repertoire.

When it comes to social issues, even if i get past my shyness from the trauma, I am still a very quirky person.

I don't think NT but I am not quite ASD either.

Broad hobbies and not narrow ones, no routines, no rituals (wore off when I stopped taking antidepressants and stopped getting ocd), get stuck socially, quirky, intense about hobbies, physical sensitivities and definitely in no way do I think like a Neurotypical (trauma or otherwise...i find NT thinking far too illogical and I can't work with it. Far too based on their emotions to be rational, bizarre and nonsensical. A lot of their social conventions are utterly pointless for example and an utter waste of my time. Their thinking absolutely does my head in..no offence meant to NTs).

The majority of my contacts have Aspergers although they tend to be male...therefore present with different quirks to me (I am female).

I guess you have to look through the list of quirks and symptoms for females, compare those with PTSD and see if you share more traits from one category than the other or if you share traits from both of them.

Its very possible to have both an ASD and PTSD. Even Autistic people get traumatised.

Write a list of all the traits and symptoms you have from both the Asd traits and symptoms and the PTSD ones and compare.

PN look up traits for females. Read Aspergirls and other books by females with autism. These books give more information than the DSM criteria which is based on the male stereotype and is stunted as a result.



Earthbound_Alien
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22 Aug 2017, 12:15 pm

GreenTeaLatte wrote:
I don't know what I was like as a young child, I have very few select memories and have heard a few things but most of my life is a blur, my sense of time is awful, so I can't place an event I remember on any particular timeline. I don't remember playing with toys until I was a bit older, I preferred boys toys when I did, I liked collecting animal and dinosaur figures, catching bugs, things I could put together like blocks and Legos, puzzles, when I was given barbies I took them apart. I was a tomboy I guess, I asked a lot of questions on how things work and why.
I guess what I'm wondering is if I did try to take a test would it matter because I don't have a reliable source of information on what I was like as a child? I've definately done research but I feel like both things seem to fit, would getting help for just ptsd be okay?
But regardless thank you for welcoming me!


Becareful with labels.

I am not sure where you are but also if using the NHS check your notes.

They have made an absolute mess of mine. When I spoke about my being assaulted as a child some years ago they have writen down that I 'have a long history of violent assualt and that my poor long suffering family had to put up with me' making me sound as though I was the perpetrator and not the victim. Actually my family were in and out of jail and psychiatric hospitals for violent crimes and mental health issues. I have never been in either. I have no criminal record and ive never spent time in a psychiatric unit...even when depressed the drs considered me to be too rational to need that level of care (me and my mostly logical brain).

I need to actually get my notes challenged before I can even consider a referal for assessment for Asperger's, especially as they want to read my notes before meeting me to see what other diagnoses I have recieved. I had to pull out of a recent assessment because I read my notes and realised they are absolutely full of errors and assumptions that are not based on fact and ranging from accusing me of violent crimes ive not commited through to hating msyelf when I have never ever done any such thing.

I think they will find I am a fairly open minded person whom is very accepting of difference and imperfections (even if NTs do confuse the hell out of me and i think their thinking is nonsensical they have a right to be nonsensical if they want to be and some of them can be very nice people) and practice acceptance as opposed to self flagellation.

Thus far I remain undiagnosed and right now challenging my notes feels like too much hassle for sleepy old me (I have sleep problems in the form of EDS and a tendencey to nod off at the wrong times) and so I am procrastinating when it comes to sorting it out.

Also when I did tell people that I was awaiting an assessment (when I was on the waiting list) they started to treat me as though I was learning disabled. Given my academic grading from courses I have studied in the past I find this to be most insulting. I am not intellectually impaired and nor are any of the Asperger's contacts I know.

Blinking cheek!



Earthbound_Alien
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22 Aug 2017, 12:26 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
In order for one to be autistic, one has to have had autistic behaviors in infancy or very early childhood.

I seems very much like PTSD---based on what you wrote.

Did you have any speech delays as a child? Any delays, period?

Even if it turns out you're not autistic, you're still very much welcomed here on WP. Many people with many disorders can establish common ground with each other.


In many respects i prefer the word differences. People with differences can sometimes establish common ground together.

Differences can be positive, negative or neutral.

The word disorders always has negative connotations. As in wrong, or bad, or incorrect or broken.

Yes I know a lot of people have difficulties in a world that's not accepting of difference but the lack of acceptance can often be more of a disability than the differences are. Many NTs have yet to realise this.



kraftiekortie
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22 Aug 2017, 12:37 pm

For some people, autism is a "difference." For others, it's a "disorder."

Whether it's one or the other doesn't have anything to do with the quality of the person.



Earthbound_Alien
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22 Aug 2017, 12:43 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
For some people, autism is a "difference." For others, it's a "disorder."

Whether it's one or the other doesn't have anything to do with the quality of the person.


No but we live in a society that doesn't see it that way.



kraftiekortie
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22 Aug 2017, 12:49 pm

Of course I agree. They do.

We have to teach them otherwise.



GreenTeaLatte
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22 Aug 2017, 1:07 pm

Earthbound_Alien wrote:

I guess you have to look through the list of quirks and symptoms for females, compare those with PTSD and see if you share more traits from one category than the other or if you share traits from both of them.

Its very possible to have both an ASD and PTSD. Even Autistic people get traumatised.

Write a list of all the traits and symptoms you have from both the Asd traits and symptoms and the PTSD ones and compare.

PN look up traits for females. Read Aspergirls and other books by females with autism. These books give more information than the DSM criteria which is based on the male stereotype and is stunted as a result.




Yes my husband and I have done this and a lot of the quirks I have are explained through Ptsd but some we could not like having tactile issues (I cant wear certain clothes, just touching jeans makes me feel so bad (I cant describe it but its awful!), I get overloaded on stimulus quite easily and have 'meltdowns' Ive had them since I was a teen, Wearing earplugs and avoiding too much physical contact helps in crowded areas, I learned to socialise through 'mimicing' just...not the right things I guess (when in highschool I was told I acted a lot like an anime character lol), I have obsessions and hyperfocus on them but they tend to change and then cycle (I do know when I was younger I would watch a single movie over and over again to an obsessive level, I had the whole script of Atlantis almost memorized completely before that it was Jumanji), and I do "hand-flap", bounce, or rock when excited or stressed, I used to have a hard time with sayings or sarcasm (one I remember very clearly was "Dont all raise your hands at once" but no one was even raising their hands :/)though not so much as an adult, I also have most of the traits listed on Rudy Simone's website and scored quite high on an online test.

My childhood best friend has two autistic sisters and his mom gave me information to contact a neurologist a while back. I just didn't have the insurance to go at the time.

Is this a good resource to bring up to a psychologist though?



kraftiekortie
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22 Aug 2017, 1:21 pm

If the psychologist specializes in adult autism----definitely yes.

Hopefully, a psychologist who doesn't specialize in it will understand.

Autism is a neurological disorder, probably more than it is a psychological disorder, even though it can manifest like a psychological disorder.



zer0netgain
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24 Aug 2017, 5:59 am

Do you have sensory issues? I'd think that would be distinct to Autism rather than PTSD. Of course, I'd not be surprised if many with Autism have PTSD issues from growing up Autistic.