I'm Not An Aspie. I Lied During My Assessment.

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EzraS
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21 Sep 2017, 4:34 am

There's a lot more out there than just autism. The whole neuro-deverse thing. I've come across those on a general support forum, who did not have autism itself, but whatever else that was just a disabling. We even started a sub-form called "Island of Misfits". We could all relate to one another quite well.

I think when it comes to a person who's not autistic getting an asd diagnosis, maybe it's a for lack of a better term kind of thing to try explaining whatever neurological issue they do have. Maybe "bog standard" can be translated as neuro-diverse. Or maybe NAFU (Neurologically All F***ed Up).

I consider all NAFU my brothers and sisters of the f***ed up brain disorder, whatever it may be called.



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21 Sep 2017, 8:58 am

Chronos wrote:
Leeds_Demon wrote:
I re-read my assessment report and in it, there is a big, stonking lie. I told the psychologist, who assessed me that I regularly say things that offend people, (I was assessed in 2009). Well, I don't. I might have told my mum, when I was younger, that I didn't want to be like her and I may have asked a lecturer why she didn't wear make-up, but that's about it.

When I did the Austism Test and my initial result said that I had NT & ND traits. So I changed my answers, so that I had more ND traits. I also bumped up my AQ score.

Given that I lied during my assessement and that I don't have any typical aspie traits, such liking lists/organisation/systemising/being good at maths, etc, I can't be an aspie. I'm just an anti-social loner, with a very good long term memory.

You don't have to be autistic to not make any friends. I can read people's emotions. I don't have meltdowns - when I'm riled with someone, I can become vicious. Maybe the only reason I don't socialise is because I don't have any money, or friends; it's possible to not have any friends, even if you're an NT. It's not because I become exhausted from interacting.

I read a blog post about sensory overload and the author was comparing her dislike of a certain food, to eating raw chicken. I hate peas/celery/cooked onions/cucumber, bit if I ate a pea, I wouldn't think I was eating chicken. I've never had a meltdown if I ate some candied peel. I'm ok with bright lights and I like playing my music loud, but not too loud, so as to disturb the neighbours. As I onky have one type of sensory overload, I can't be an aspie.

Yes, folks, I lied. No biggie. If I was an aspie, I would have never lied/over-exaggerated. But I did.


If I recall, the question typically goes something like "People often tell me I say offensive things." And one is supposed to answer true or false, or some spectrum ranging from "never true" to "always true".

What has always puzzled me about this is, what if the person offends people and the people don't inform them they were offended, or what if the person never has the chance to offend people because they never interact with them? Would this not throw off the scoring?



And what if this was something in the past? Adults often don't tell others when they were offended. What if you notice you tend to offend people but they never tell you they are offended but you just know because they don't talk to you again or you can tell by their reaction or by how they respond? What if you don't talk much, of course people wouldn't often tell you this.

That is why I don't like these tests. It's too black and white.


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21 Sep 2017, 9:10 am

Lying to us is one thing, but lying to yourself is just not right. How will you be able to better understand yourself if you won't clearly define yourself during your evaluation.
Having doubts is good, it only means you really wanna know the truth but to consciously manipulate information to achieve a certain outcome is only taking you further away from the truth.


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21 Sep 2017, 9:23 am

Leeds_Demon wrote:
I re-read my assessment report....

I had this conversation with one of my diagnosticians just last week. While I have come to appreciate and understand my written assessment, I considered it initially (in the first couple weeks) to include some blunt descriptions of my deficiencies while having underrepresented my beneficial behaviors and characteristics. While I didn't criticize the diagnostician's writing style, she volunteered her opinion that diagnosticians are expected to emphasize deficiencies while ignoring benefits. Otherwise, an assessment might be easily challenged by future clinicians to the overall detriment to autists like us. She said that she hoped this kind of writing style wouldn't be needed in the future.

So, the fact that your diagnostician emphasized a couple of "offensive" statements, it was done to bolster the validity of your diagnosis while still remaining truthful. Unless you don't want a diagnosis for autism, you might want to understand why diagnosticians do their best to help their clients. I did, and I actually like my written assessment now.


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21 Sep 2017, 1:33 pm

So what, what are you telling us for?

I guess that's the last we will hear of the lying lass from Leeds.


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22 Sep 2017, 4:12 am

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It sounds like something people might try but I seriously have a feeling it's not as easy as that -- as someone else said, a qualified assessor will actually build things into the assessment that are designed to catch out lies. They make it so that you don't even notice those parts of the mechanism, if you will.

They try to make it so you cannot detect the mechanism. But most psychometric testing is far from sophisticated.
I found this kind of mechanism to "catch out" lies and inconsistencies confusing - they often just keep repeating the same statement / question, slightly altered or re-worded - do that enough times and someone with an analytical mind, excellent recall, and a tendency to notice patterns starts to get the impression that being asked the same question repeatedly, and answering it in the same way, is reinforcing something too much. Often something you didn't think was a big deal to begin with, but they keep making you restate it, and you start to get the impression that you're over stating it, and you shouldn't be making a big deal out of nothing by continuing to reinforce the answer with that much material. You start thinking you aught to temper the intensity of that response a bit by "balancing" it with the opposite, so as to better reflect the degree with which you believe it.
Psychometric testing, apparently, does not work on me. I was told that by the psychiatrist who applied it for a job screening. Amusingly he started angling the psychopath route on me because the alexithymia thing mimics those traits at times, and apparently psychopaths can't be screened using standard psychometric tools either.
If psychometric testing doesn't work on an autistic, it wouldn't surprise me if the standard ASD assessments don't even work on some atypical autistics.


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22 Sep 2017, 5:37 am

So you're trying to say I DON'T have excellent recall, can be analytical, or notice patterns? Just because I made a generalized statement about what they, indeed TRY to do? Sorry, I'm not in fact a complete stranger to all three, but this is not about me.

My post was generalized to try to convey something to the OP.

I never said I FAILED to recognize the mechanism they use in the assessment. . . .

WHAT the fck, today???? Seriously.



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22 Sep 2017, 5:47 am

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So you're trying to say I DON'T have excellent recall, can be analytical, or notice patterns? Just because I made a generalized statement about what they, indeed TRY to do? Sorry, I'm not in fact a complete stranger to all three, but this is not about me.

My post was generalized to try to convey something to the OP.

I never said I FAILED to recognize the mechanism they use in the assessment. . . .

WHAT the fck, today???? Seriously.

Ooook, now it's my turn to what the fck.
Defensive much??? I wasn't saying any of that, least of all to you. I was just contributing with an angle I had experienced with psychometric testing myself, and directing it to the OP by using your comment to illustrate the point - just because that's what made me think of it. There's nothing Machiavellian going on here. I think you might be reading something into that comment that isn't there, for whatever other reason.
We have posted back and forth and PMd between us here before quite equitably - you should know I wouldn't be the one trying to start anything with you, or insinuate anything against you. I don't do things like that because generally, I can't understand it enough.


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22 Sep 2017, 5:54 am

Maybe I'm being defensive because there has been a lot of people piling on to stuff I say lately in a way that has the outcome of being a put-down even IF they hadn't intended to insert a put-down, but there's an inherent suggestion and I'm sick of it.

Someone today even disinterred a zombie thread from more than two years ago to make a point that denies and attacks something I said two and a half years ago, and which is a pointless argument --- why would that person even bother to suddenly do that? Rhetorical question.



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22 Sep 2017, 6:08 am

Leeds_Demon wrote:
I re-read my assessment report and in it, there is a big, stonking lie. I told the psychologist, who assessed me that I regularly say things that offend people, (I was assessed in 2009). Well, I don't. I might have told my mum, when I was younger, that I didn't want to be like her and I may have asked a lecturer why she didn't wear make-up, but that's about it.

When I did the Austism Test and my initial result said that I had NT & ND traits. So I changed my answers, so that I had more ND traits. I also bumped up my AQ score.

Given that I lied during my assessement and that I don't have any typical aspie traits, such liking lists/organisation/systemising/being good at maths, etc, I can't be an aspie. I'm just an anti-social loner, with a very good long term memory.

You don't have to be autistic to not make any friends. I can read people's emotions. I don't have meltdowns - when I'm riled with someone, I can become vicious. Maybe the only reason I don't socialise is because I don't have any money, or friends; it's possible to not have any friends, even if you're an NT. It's not because I become exhausted from interacting.

I read a blog post about sensory overload and the author was comparing her dislike of a certain food, to eating raw chicken. I hate peas/celery/cooked onions/cucumber, bit if I ate a pea, I wouldn't think I was eating chicken. I've never had a meltdown if I ate some candied peel. I'm ok with bright lights and I like playing my music loud, but not too loud, so as to disturb the neighbours. As I onky have one type of sensory overload, I can't be an aspie.

Yes, folks, I lied. No biggie. If I was an aspie, I would have never lied/over-exaggerated. But I did.


What a waste of time, energy and money.

Time- yours and the therapist

Energy-why bother getting out of bed to just BS around?

Money-I believe NHS is "free", but someone is footing the bill on this mess. My husband's assessment costs up $2K cash up front. Credit card payment would tacked on an extra $500 to the bill.

I find it fascinating when people BS around taking tests for mental health/developmental disabilities. Why do adults piss away their valuable time on Earth for something they obviously don't give a s**t about? The test giver doesn't really care if you "lie". They get paid just the same. Garbage data in garbage data out.

I guess it got your rocks to feel like you "pulled one over" on the man. It's odd because the "man" doesn't care, and that stupid report will be floating around in your medical charts.

So, you don't have ASD, but you have a huge helping of LOOK AT ME attention seeking behavior. Otherwise, why would you have the burning need to post here about a test result from 8 years ago? Yay to you? You lied on a test and got an diagnosed with ASD. I guess that is a #winning somewhere on the Earth.



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22 Sep 2017, 6:15 am

BirdInFlight wrote:
Maybe I'm being defensive because there has been a lot of people piling on to stuff I say lately in a way that has the outcome of being a put-down even IF they hadn't intended to insert a put-down, but there's an inherent suggestion and I'm sick of it.

Someone today even disinterred a zombie thread from more than two years ago to make a point that denies and attacks something I said two and a half years ago, and which is a pointless argument --- why would that person even bother to suddenly do that? Rhetorical question.

I hope I haven't said anything wrong to you. WrongPlanet.net is chockablock with cranks. Always has been, always will be. Yesterday, I posted a new topic related to memory loss among autistic middle-aged men. The replies this morning appeared quite dismissive (and maybe hostile) even though I said little about the post except quoting its abstract and commenting sarcastically that memory loss among men of my age was "just great." Yet, it seems that I was to blame?!? Honestly, there are days when I loathe WrongPlanet.net.


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22 Sep 2017, 6:52 am

AspieUtah, no, not you.

There have been one or two other members -- but no, not C2V either! -- who I just feel like I'm judged and looked down upon when they don't even know me, my full story, details of things, and if they did they would have a different picture on a lot of the "whys" I did do this or didn't do that, instead of seeing things in me as failures.

That's all a whole other story I wont bother to go into further but you know the kind of thing I mean. I guess I'm just feeling a bit "got at" lately around here. It's funny, but we all come here mostly to find support and relating among people with many shared issues and challenges, and yet even among ourselves we fail to understand each other, give each other a hard time, and some even pull the "superior" game, a kind of "I'm better than you because I overcame something you didn't/ did something about something you didn't / got my act together while you haven't". . . that ype of thing. It's not hard to start seeing that even where it isn't now, for me.

C2V, I apologize for seeing that in your post. You and I get along very well and often see things in the same way, and I know that you were not attacking me directly.

As per my PM reply, I guess I just read the implication because I've been feeling like I've lately been on the receiving end of some of those passive aggressive people who do do that kind of thing.

I have felt triggered by stuff here lately and it's all of the "walk a mile in someone's shoes" type of thing.



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22 Sep 2017, 6:57 am

Agree with Tawaki.

What a sad waste of time, energy and money -- government money -- if it's really the case that the OP is not on the spectrum and lied to get a diagnosis.

I tend to a theory that the OP actually is on the spectrum and thus the diagnosis is correct despite her belief that she successfully fooled anyone, but that she is simply in some kind of anger and denial now, for whatever reason.



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22 Sep 2017, 8:43 am

BirdInFlight wrote:
Agree with Tawaki.

What a sad waste of time, energy and money -- government money -- if it's really the case that the OP is not on the spectrum and lied to get a diagnosis.

I tend to a theory that the OP actually is on the spectrum and thus the diagnosis is correct despite her belief that she successfully fooled anyone, but that she is simply in some kind of anger and denial now, for whatever reason.


I get anger and denial. My husband needed the assessment
(for a legal paper trial), and didn't believe he is on the spectrum. So hubby was an extra heaping mad about of this.

I found the best tester in our area. There are some sketchy people, and if my husband could logic away the test results he would.

He also tried to NT the test. That was a huge fail. The results were case book Aspergers. The doctor told my husband he almost didn't need to do the testing, but it was where the data would break between Aspergers and HFA. (Level I or Level II ASD). My husband is on the spectrum, but was the doctor wasn't sure where.

My husband is forever saying he has schizoid personality disorder. WHY? It makes him feel better that he "chooses" to be how he is. Three doctors have told him this isn't really possible. He doesn't fit the SchPD criteria.

I have Bipolar I. I'm on the least amount of medication since I don't know when. Once in a while I think maybe the doctors were all wrong, and it sucks having this heavy duty diagnosis. But obviously something was wrong, and I needed the help.



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22 Sep 2017, 8:51 am

I also remember being in denial. I knew I was different but I didn't like being told I was normal. Then when I did have a diagnoses and my mom told me about it, I wasn't happy and didn't like to hear the news. I know this doesn't make sense, that is how feelings are. They don't always make sense and they are not always logical.


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22 Sep 2017, 9:10 am

Leeds_Demon wrote:
I re-read my assessment report and in it, there is a big, stonking lie.


I'm sorry about that. Now, I think you should ask yourself why you lied and what were you trying to achieve with that. Note though that I am not saying you should post what you find about that here. It's a very personal thing.

From many accounts today we know that Aspies can lie, not all of them are geniuses and the "lack of empathy" thing sounds less and less of a truth. Even classic autists can lie and manipulate others.