Why do I mostly hear negative stories about social skills?

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BenderRodriguez
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03 Jul 2019, 9:12 am

*in reply to Pepe*
There actually have been members here who made these type of threads and eventually made changes and progress and found a better life or partners. Most move on and stop posting, Nick007 is still around and often gives good advice and a couple of others drop by once in a while.

Some, on the other hand, openly admit that they don't want to change (even just to improve their own health and well-being) or go out looking for people and things they desire, but wait to be found... It used to exasperate me some years ago so I just distanced myself. It's like banging your head against a wall - Fnord knows it best, he's been incredibly resilient in trying to offer concrete, practical advice in exchange for abuse.

Now I just think it's incredibly sad and futile, a self-fulfilling prophecy. But I had to fend for myself from a very early age and was basically forced to adopt a "I'll do this or die trying" kind of attitude. So maybe I don't understand what it's like for them.


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03 Jul 2019, 9:25 am

I think it just reflects the fact that one of the primary features of the disorder is social problems.

If you went to a forum for people who are wheelchair bound, you would hear a lot more stories about the difficulties of getting around, using bathrooms, getting in and out of buildings/vehicles, etc than you would success stories about those same topics.



Fnord
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03 Jul 2019, 9:37 am

BenderRodriguez wrote:
... Some, on the other hand, openly admit that they don't want to change (even just to improve their own health and well-being)...
Some have openly declared that suggestions of self-improvement are "heinous".
BenderRodriguez wrote:
It used to exasperate me some years ago so I just distanced myself. It's like banging your head against a wall - Fnord knows it best, he's been incredibly resilient in trying to offer concrete, practical advice in exchange for abuse.
Some of the abuse comes from people in authority who are more concerned with "keeping the peace" than with resolving issues. Their actions serve only to perpetuate the problems.
BenderRodriguez wrote:
Now I just think it's incredibly sad and futile, a self-fulfilling prophecy. But I had to fend for myself from a very early age and was basically forced to adopt a "I'll do this or die trying" kind of attitude. So maybe I don't understand what it's like for them.
For me, it was both "Do or Die" and "I'll Show Them!" Later, I was to learn that success is its own reward, and that people are attracted to those who achieve success.

:D


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dyadiccounterpoint
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03 Jul 2019, 10:30 am

I have a good story. About a year and a half ago I was in a severe position and had to call upon all my social ability to evolve from that state. I used all my realizations about cognitive empathy and managing expectations to become very well liked at my workplace. They even offered me a place to live on the property for about a year.

Yes, my social ability did collapse in the end and I did alienate former allies, although I am still liked overall because of the quality of my work.

It taught me that, yes, one can consciously regulate the self, after acquiring sufficient knowledge about human behavior and communications, to achieve competency. It is a vulnerable competency because it is regulated and not innate, but it is possible. It takes practice and a willingness to confront undesirable social situations. Some individuals might be too disabled to be able to achieve this, I concede.

I'll admit this doesn't translate into deep connection building, which is the key to making romantic relationships. I still struggle with things like affection and touch. I still do not understand how flirting works. I still don't want to go out to social events beyond the workplace. Nevertheless, it has provided me a goal of making improvements. I'd like to start trying again soon.


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BenderRodriguez
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03 Jul 2019, 11:10 am

^
Great example!

I think for many of us this is the first step towards some form of social competency: slowly moving on from feeling trapped in an unfair and seemingly uncontrollable vicious circle of failure and frustration towards wanting to make our lives even just a little bit easier. Having your livelihood depend on such things can be a pretty strong incentive.


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Antrax
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03 Jul 2019, 4:23 pm

Maybe because autism is primarily diagnosed by a deficit of social skills?


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Pepe
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03 Jul 2019, 11:01 pm

Fnord wrote:
blazingstar wrote:
I once posted what I thought was a supportive message to a person who was experiencing the loss of a relationship and/or the inability to have one, I don't remember which. The response from the OP was a snarky how nice it was that I was happy and rubbing it in to those who are not. So I tend not to do that anymore...
In my opinion, that kind of trollish behavior (not yours, theirs) has no place on this website. It's like finding a little lost puppy that is whining and obviously starving, but when you try to help, it tries to rip out your throat. I guess that the only way such people can feel good about themselves is to play the "Bait & Trap" game.

The Bait: A tale of misery and a plea for rescue.
The Trap: A snarky attack against a rescuer.

Since they can't (or more likely won't) lift themselves up, they can only feel good by bringing others down.



There is more than a bit of a power tripping in snapping back.
I think that is the Zeitgeist in many areas of the media like Twitter (is that the place where twits post, btw :scratch:)
and Facebook.
A lot of ferals on the internet forums also.
And unfortunately, there seem to be quite a few unpleasant autistic people around too.
Something I wasn't really expecting.

I think it is time for me to wake up and smell the coffee.
Did someone say "coffee"? 8O

BTW
That wasn't a puppy you were trying to pick up.
It was a wolf cub that thought you were trying to eat it. :mrgreen:


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Raleigh
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04 Jul 2019, 12:27 am

BenderRodriguez wrote:
It used to exasperate me some years ago so I just distanced myself. It's like banging your head against a wall - Fnord knows it best, he's been incredibly resilient in trying to offer concrete, practical advice in exchange for abuse.
fnord wrote:
Some of the abuse comes from people in authority who are more concerned with "keeping the peace" than with resolving issues. Their actions serve only to perpetuate the problems.

Do you mean the 'people in authority' who repeatedly asked for certain members to refrain from making sarcastic and trollish remarks to others?
and then those same members continued making sarcastic and trollish comments thinking it was ok because they weren't addressing the OP directly?
Yep, it was definitely the 'people in authority' at fault.


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JD12345
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04 Jul 2019, 6:55 am

Negative stories are always more common than positive ones, perhaps because they generate views/hits/subscriptions.

I'm on the BBC News website home page right now. The top story concerns the loss of thousands of jobs at a bookmakers. The other main stories are about subjects such as hospitals struggling to treat patients, two railway workers dying after being hit by a train, disabled toilets not being big enough and a student paramedic being killed in an ambulance crash. There are several others that are, at best, neutral.



goatfish57
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04 Jul 2019, 6:57 am

Excellent discussion of the pros and cons of giving advice. I have stopped posting about the positive accomplishments in my life and all the steps I have taken to achieve them. Hard work is hard work. There are few easy solutions to complex problems.

We are often faced with social problems that make absolutely no sense. Why the hell is this person angry, upset, hostile, viscous and nasty? When someone treats me nicely, I am thrilled, happy all day. When an attractive woman takes a moment to be friendly, I am in heaven. Such small little things have big meaning to me.

My parting advice is learn to talk with your face. Speaking proper face makes life so much easier.


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04 Jul 2019, 9:17 am

One of the reasons Denis Istomin inspires me so much is that he was able to put traumatic life events behind him and succeed in life. He has had a decent tennis career and has competed admirably against the top men in the game, with victories over David Ferrer and Novak Djokovic. He has also done quite well playing against Rafael Nadal, even though the Spaniard far outclassed Denis on court.



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04 Jul 2019, 10:33 am

dyadiccounterpoint wrote:
I have a good story. About a year and a half ago I was in a severe position and had to call upon all my social ability to evolve from that state. I used all my realizations about cognitive empathy and managing expectations to become very well liked at my workplace. They even offered me a place to live on the property for about a year.

Yes, my social ability did collapse in the end and I did alienate former allies, although I am still liked overall because of the quality of my work.

It taught me that, yes, one can consciously regulate the self, after acquiring sufficient knowledge about human behavior and communications, to achieve competency. It is a vulnerable competency because it is regulated and not innate, but it is possible. It takes practice and a willingness to confront undesirable social situations. Some individuals might be too disabled to be able to achieve this, I concede.

I'll admit this doesn't translate into deep connection building, which is the key to making romantic relationships. I still struggle with things like affection and touch. I still do not understand how flirting works. I still don't want to go out to social events beyond the workplace. Nevertheless, it has provided me a goal of making improvements. I'd like to start trying again soon.


That is a great story and thank you for posting. I have had similar experiences in that I have learned to perform in certain situations and in that context, people like me a lot, even love me. But it is a superficial type relationship because it is a work environment. But it is exhausting and sometimes I can't keep it up.

Reading this kind of story, gives me support in that, yes I can get through this. Helps for the times it feels like I can't do it at all, ever, and will never be able to cope again. Thank you.


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04 Jul 2019, 1:47 pm

Hollywood_Guy wrote:
Why is it that with a lot of people with autism or Asperger it's so easy to find negative stories from them about their lack of social success and things like dating. Aren't there any more inspiring and positive success story experiences about social stuff coming from the regular Joe, non-famous aspies?


Probably because autism is a disability and it affects your social skills and makes it harder for you to socialize and make friends. I don't think any successful aspies are going to be hanging out on autism forums. I have seen some around like oliveoilmom, fnord is here, who else who has been to college or has gotten married and is happily married and has raised happy children? Or who has raised their kids successfully as a single parent and managed to do it all on their own without any additional support to ensure their kids are happy and their needs are met? I remember Karla Fisher and she seemed real successful which is why I was surprised to hear her AS was pretty severe. She did lot of stuff I would not be able to do such as raising kids alone. I think her name here was kfisherx. How many aspies are here that fully support themselves and have jobs and aren't on any type of disability and they make money successfully and are not on any welfare? Angelrio seemed like a successful aspie too but he was pretty harsh with his posts. All these aspies might go unnoticed because they are so successful, they don't really stand out. kfisherx has talked about her social difficulties and sensory issues while the rest haven't said much about theirs and only posted success stories so it's like they had overcame their autism.

I notice the ones who do have success have had their autism doubted by others, including by those on the spectrum. So it wouldn't surprise me if they choose to not talk about their success. When they do, they do not define themselves by their autism and put it in their profiles and stuff. It could be because they don't want to be called a liar or because they don't define themselves by it or because they feel it's not their concern and not really a problem for them.

Years ago when Social security Administration decided to sign me up for SSDI, they sent me to an appointment to be evaluated by a doctor. All he did was ask me questions and it was about my life like my reason for moving here and asking me about my ex and why things didn't work out and asking me about my work and my relationship. I wonder if that got me denied SSDI because it all seemed to be good and the fact I met a lot of men online and met up with them in real life but I didn't tell him they were all ABDL. I didn't want to share that side of myself. He didn't do any other tests with me and the appointment was maybe an hour long. I didn't check the time. They also sent no packet to my mother either for her to fill out or to anyone else or even contact my previous work places and previous therapist. He also didn't ask me any specific questions for if I had any problems and struggles so I didn't share those. I also wasn't fidgeting because I was sitting in this nice coffee sofa and I barely looked at him. It was more like a conversation we were having.


And another thing, I stopped caring about if people think I am autistic or not. If they want to doubt me, fine. It's the internet and people will be ignorant and think they are qualified to give a diagnoses based on texts and photos and stories. I will mind as well share things to help others on it and maybe others can take my advice to try.


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04 Jul 2019, 4:48 pm

Pepe wrote:
BenderRodriguez wrote:
Hollywood_Guy wrote:
I sympathize with the struggle to get a partner or find a date, that's why I posted this, I'm reckoning that I might be more "doomed" than I thought after all.

But that's what I'm trying to tell you: you're not doomed, nobody is. Those of us who have good lives might not post here that much about it (for various reasons), but we exist. It's possible.


I am puzzled about this overwhelming emphasis on finding a partner.
Is that the only way most people here find fulfilment?

Evolution has geared most of us to want to find a partner and to live on after our death through "our" children, but it is, after all, simple genetic instinct.

What about Platonic relationships?
Quote:
Platonic love (often lower-cased as platonic[1]) is a type of love, or close relationship, that is non-sexual. It is named after Greek philosopher Plato, though the philosopher never used the term himself. Platonic love as devised by Plato concerns rising through levels of closeness to wisdom and true beauty from carnal attraction to individual bodies to attraction to souls, and eventually, union with the truth. This is the ancient, philosophical interpretation.[2] Platonic love is contrasted with romantic love. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platonic_love


I'll say that it's not really something I super emphasize on right now, but I wouldn't want to go through entire life with never having that at all. I think that part of it is because the society we live in, medias like TV and movies culturally sell and emphasize overly-positive the idea of sex and romantic ideas.



dyadiccounterpoint
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04 Jul 2019, 4:56 pm

blazingstar wrote:
dyadiccounterpoint wrote:
I have a good story. About a year and a half ago I was in a severe position and had to call upon all my social ability to evolve from that state. I used all my realizations about cognitive empathy and managing expectations to become very well liked at my workplace. They even offered me a place to live on the property for about a year.

Yes, my social ability did collapse in the end and I did alienate former allies, although I am still liked overall because of the quality of my work.

It taught me that, yes, one can consciously regulate the self, after acquiring sufficient knowledge about human behavior and communications, to achieve competency. It is a vulnerable competency because it is regulated and not innate, but it is possible. It takes practice and a willingness to confront undesirable social situations. Some individuals might be too disabled to be able to achieve this, I concede.

I'll admit this doesn't translate into deep connection building, which is the key to making romantic relationships. I still struggle with things like affection and touch. I still do not understand how flirting works. I still don't want to go out to social events beyond the workplace. Nevertheless, it has provided me a goal of making improvements. I'd like to start trying again soon.


That is a great story and thank you for posting. I have had similar experiences in that I have learned to perform in certain situations and in that context, people like me a lot, even love me. But it is a superficial type relationship because it is a work environment. But it is exhausting and sometimes I can't keep it up.

Reading this kind of story, gives me support in that, yes I can get through this. Helps for the times it feels like I can't do it at all, ever, and will never be able to cope again. Thank you.


I am humbled by your appreciation. You are most welcome!


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