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firemonkey
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04 Dec 2022, 6:24 am

If so, what makes you gifted?



kraftiekortie
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04 Dec 2022, 6:49 am

Nope. Not gifted. Deficient in some facets, average in others, pretty good in some others.

Definitely not “superior” in anything.



firemonkey
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04 Dec 2022, 7:03 am

I've heard some say that those who are gifted are neurodivergent.



kraftiekortie
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04 Dec 2022, 7:08 am

That’s not necessarily the case…..though many “gifted” people happen to be neurodivergent.



firemonkey
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04 Dec 2022, 7:29 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
That’s not necessarily the case…..though many “gifted” people happen to be neurodivergent.


I agree with you.



timf
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04 Dec 2022, 8:58 am

The same neurological variant that produces faster, more complex, or more sensitive neurology, may also present with the neurology that produces a higher IQ.

There is a joke in Mensa that if you do not have Aspergers it is because someone else took the test for you.



Gammeldans
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04 Dec 2022, 9:02 am

I don't even like the term "gifted people".

I think we all have a gift. Sure, some will not agree with me but I have made up my mind!

Also, why can't we say that the guy drivig the Fedex truck (or whatever it is called) is gifted?

People just call themselves gifted in order to brag! Or are they bragging? It sounds like bragging.


My gift is with music and drama.

I was told that I have a good voice for storytelling. Perhaps it's true.

Anyway, I don't think this is what is refered to as "gifted".


The whole thing about giftedness vs asperger's is controversial.

One big question is why "gifted people" have difficulties socializing with their peers. It is probably the same issues as with asperger's although some say it is because of giftedness. 
Even with asperger's we have many different issues depending on the person

I cannot tell because I did not study psychiatry.


What do you say?



firemonkey
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04 Dec 2022, 9:33 am

I have always had difficulty socialising with others. It wasn't an 'on developing a severe mental illness' thing. From May 2009-March 2020 I had 55/56 FB friends. Circa March 2020 I got involved with the FB high IQ community. I now have 270 FB friends, about 95% of those coming from the high IQ community.

I don't buy into the belief a person's IQ has to be within +/- 20-30 of yours for fruitful conversation to occur. I have great difficulty initiating conversations, but if someone talks to me first I'll respond as well as I can - regardless of their IQ.



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04 Dec 2022, 9:51 am

timf wrote:
The same neurological variant that produces faster, more complex, or more sensitive neurology, may also present with the neurology that produces a higher IQ.

There is a joke in Mensa that if you do not have Aspergers it is because someone else took the test for you.


I came across the concept of the Cognitive TradeOff Theory on YouTube. There is a video of a primate research facility in Japan. It shows the origins of the Chimp Test. Supposedly, it is impossible for a human to do the chimp test as fast as a chimp. There are some interesting takeaways from that I believe.

I have thought for a while that memory was not necessarily a higher thinking process. I have voiced my opinion that animals operate at a different speed than humans and pick up on a different variety of details. Some people generally did not appreciate my insight.

I like giving myself some credit for being aware of such things.

The video also says that human’s cognitive function change as they age. Given the common definition of intelligence which includes visualization and speed, the smartest people in the world as a group are toddlers. People don’t think much of that insight either.

I was watching another video that said that to be great at something assumes recognition. I assume whether or not someone is gifted is also determined by recognition. The example in that video was computer programming.

Therefore, I am not gifted.



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04 Dec 2022, 11:00 am

My third grade class was tested. I was put into the highly to exceptionally gifted category based upon my exam scores. My reading ability was off the charts (high school graduate level), science/math advanced (high school level) and reasoning was quite developed for my age. I was tutoring high school students in math and science when I was still in elementary school. By the sixth grade, I could have skipped two levels academically in all subjects, yet my teachers attempted to hold me back because I did not fit into anything socially. All of my friends were two years younger than me, as I could relate to them better than my classmates.

Over time, I honed my different gifted skills to use at my job. I know I can mentally visualize at a level that is very advanced compared to my peers. It allows me to develop new materials and theoretically test them before I go into the lab to actually make them. When I read a scientific paper, I can easily adapt the research for a new application that is much different than the original application. Many peers have asked me how I can do it. It just occurs naturally to me. I can relate to Nicola Tesla, as he had the advanced visual skills ability also. He was much better at applying them to his work than I am able to. I would be happy if I could achieve only a tiny fraction of what he did.

As for the concept of needing a certain I.Q. range to match others with conversations, this does occur on occasions. I have found that one can make the topic less complicated to the other person in such a way that they can usually understand. Unfortunately it can be challenging as a neural divergent to tell if another person understands you. I will admit that I used to do data dumping on others when a special topic was brought up. It generally overwhelmed the other person, as they were not expecting to get that much information back at one time. I learned to release much smaller chunks of data at first to see if they could absorb the information before proceeding with more.

Being gifted is not always a positive thing. I have been ostracized by peers because I do not match their way of thinking. I would have been happier in my youth if I (and others) did not know what level I was at. It would have reduced the stress of needing to perform better at classwork. Just because someone has an ability does not mean that they want to use it 24/7. In some ways I wished I would have had a more normal childhood rather than to spend it wrapped up in books all of the time because it was expected of me.



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04 Dec 2022, 11:22 am

I'm not.
Just another cognitively uneven aspie here.


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ToughDiamond
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04 Dec 2022, 11:46 am

Gammeldans wrote:
I don't even like the term "gifted people".

I think we all have a gift. Sure, some will not agree with me but I have made up my mind!

Also, why can't we say that the guy drivig the Fedex truck (or whatever it is called) is gifted?

People just call themselves gifted in order to brag! Or are they bragging? It sounds like bragging.

My gift is with music and drama.

I was told that I have a good voice for storytelling. Perhaps it's true.

Anyway, I don't think this is what is refered to as "gifted".

The whole thing about giftedness vs asperger's is controversial.

One big question is why "gifted people" have difficulties socializing with their peers. It is probably the same issues as with asperger's although some say it is because of giftedness. 
Even with asperger's we have many different issues depending on the person

I cannot tell because I did not study psychiatry.

What do you say?


I broadly agree. At school when I was about 7, I was seen as highly gifted. By the time I was 14, I was receiving damning school reports and abysmal marks on tests. I hadn't changed that much, it was the nature of the challenges, of the test conditions, that had changed. I was just a human being in the right place and then the wrong place, more or less. So I see myself and everybody else as essentially an idiot-savant. Society loves to revere and revile chosen individuals.

So, am I "gifted?" Yes and no, obviously. My aptitude profile has many highs and lows. I can excel at certain tasks and screw up on others.



paralian
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04 Dec 2022, 11:52 am

I was never specifically told I was "gifted" and my school didn't have a gifted program, but I got the message that because I was smart I was going to do well in life (I suspect they assumed that there were "easy" skills and "hard" skills, and it never occurred to them that I might struggle with something they found easy while having no trouble with what they found hard.)

I saw a youtube video once that described how gifted kids who aren't challenged academically in school, miss out on the normal progression of learning how to learn and how to study and how to cope with challenges. And then when we do face a challenge... we don't know what to do.



firemonkey
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04 Dec 2022, 12:06 pm

Based on psychometrician created and/or normed tests I 'technically' fall into the highly gifted category. I say 'technically' because 'bullying related trauma', and the subsequent SMI, has taken a huge psychological dump on my ability to live up to that potential.



Gammeldans
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04 Dec 2022, 12:09 pm

QuantumChemist wrote:
My third grade class was tested. I was put into the highly to exceptionally gifted category based upon my exam scores. My reading ability was off the charts (high school graduate level), science/math advanced (high school level) and reasoning was quite developed for my age. I was tutoring high school students in math and science when I was still in elementary school. By the sixth grade, I could have skipped two levels academically in all subjects, yet my teachers attempted to hold me back because I did not fit into anything socially. All of my friends were two years younger than me, as I could relate to them better than my classmates.

Over time, I honed my different gifted skills to use at my job. I know I can mentally visualize at a level that is very advanced compared to my peers. It allows me to develop new materials and theoretically test them before I go into the lab to actually make them. When I read a scientific paper, I can easily adapt the research for a new application that is much different than the original application. Many peers have asked me how I can do it. It just occurs naturally to me. I can relate to Nicola Tesla, as he had the advanced visual skills ability also. He was much better at applying them to his work than I am able to. I would be happy if I could achieve only a tiny fraction of what he did.

As for the concept of needing a certain I.Q. range to match others with conversations, this does occur on occasions. I have found that one can make the topic less complicated to the other person in such a way that they can usually understand. Unfortunately it can be challenging as a neural divergent to tell if another person understands you. I will admit that I used to do data dumping on others when a special topic was brought up. It generally overwhelmed the other person, as they were not expecting to get that much information back at one time. I learned to release much smaller chunks of data at first to see if they could absorb the information before proceeding with more.

Being gifted is not always a positive thing. I have been ostracized by peers because I do not match their way of thinking. I would have been happier in my youth if I (and others) did not know what level I was at. It would have reduced the stress of needing to perform better at classwork. Just because someone has an ability does not mean that they want to use it 24/7. In some ways I wished I would have had a more normal childhood rather than to spend it wrapped up in books all of the time because it was expected of me.

It really looks like you're bragging but I am not sure that you are.
I am sure that you had many skills back then that you also sucked at. You only really mentioned science but then again there are other important skills.
The whole "gifter people" thing sickens me!
I am gifted with a good storytelling voice I am told but I am no chemistry, maths or physics gifted person.
People talk about gifts with only a focus on some expert areas.

"Is ‘gifted’ a euphemism?
Being Highly Intelligent, Giftedness As much as ‘gifted’ means good things, it also implies not so good things. The autistic savant is highly gifted in one skill or trait, but may perform well below average in other areas. "
https://suemahony.com/is-gifted-a-euphemism/



shortfatbalduglyman
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04 Dec 2022, 12:46 pm

firemonkey wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
That’s not necessarily the case…..though many “gifted” people happen to be neurodivergent.


I agree with you.



"Gifted" is not yet officially defined specifically enough to have any significant implications per se

You can't separate nature versus nurture

Merely being great at something, does not make you "gifted", if you put too much energy into it

Effort, efficiency, outcome

If your efficiency is extremely high, you are "gifted"

You can't always measure the effort, efficiency or outcome