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Sarcastic_Name
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10 Apr 2008, 2:22 am

I've been meaning to ask this for a while now, and this has probably been asked before. With all the whining, self-pity, and general moodiness of a lot of people here; why do you then turn around and say that'd you never want to change and love to be as "unique" as you are? It makes no sense to me. AS isn't just something you accept, it isn't just some problem you force yourself to live with, it's simply a small part of the whole that is you. If you want to whine about your life, fine by me. But when someone complains about something in which the simple solution is to change and get over it, but refuses to change because they choose to accept who they are, I see nothing but a whining hypocrite who doesn't deserve whatever it is they're after. Sure, AS is probably chemical. Sure, AS is probably genetic. Sure, you well most likely always have problems creep up in your life caused by it. But to just stand around and whine about it, rather than take the f*****g initiative and do something about yourself is just stupid. You practice, you fail, you try again, you learn. Just because you don't get something right the first time, or aren't as good as other people at something, doesn't mean it's time to quit. It means it's time to work hard and try your f*****g hardest to not be the same way you've always been. I have nothing left to say.


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Pundit23
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10 Apr 2008, 2:45 am

First off, we contradict ourselves because we contain multitudes.

Some people come to this forum seeking support and relief from problems in RL, so of course there will be cries of pain, surrender, and pathos.

I'm sure if given the choice, plenty of people would choose to be NT just so that they could stop suffering. However, since we can't cure, only manage, it is best not to dwell. Pride is the greatest defense against shame &/or self loathing.

I agree that AS is not something you're forced to accept: you were you long before you ever heard of Asperger's, and you will remain you long after; and the title doesn't change who you are.
--However to say that AS is in any ways "little" makes me question whether you're not just a stock character troll who has no idea how much suffering some people go through. AS is a title that allows us all to find one another, but the symptoms have closed/are closing more doors than you could imagine (or perhaps more than you know about). I have sensitivity to certain fabrics, which has forced me to ostracize me from any style that could possibly grant me acceptance. And that's only the start of it.

...and then because I'm running out of time, I'll just conclude by saying the fact that we havent committed suicide, due to the social isolation many of us have experienced, is a testament to our ability to fail, get back up, and try again. Anything you see here is part of that process, and if that process pisses you off so much, then GTFO.

GTFO, and when you've climbed up and down the ladder so many times that you're hands are bleeding, and all you want is some moral support and attention, remember what you said today.

(And if I've misunderstood something that you said, my apologies: the general tone of your writing pissed me off so much that it's become hard for me to read.)
(And please dont counter flame childishly, I've at least answered you sincerely and constructively.)



Thomas1138
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10 Apr 2008, 2:57 am

Well I need to answer that question in two parts:

1. Change is not only difficult, it can sometimes be nigh impossible. I don't know your personality, but if you're an extreme extrovert, it would be silly to expect you to suddenly become an introvert. If you're a warm person, it's not likely that you're going to learn to be cold.

It's not a matter of effort. Take a look around and you'll see all sorts of stories where people, through great effort, learned the skills they needed to get by. Skills that you never even thought about. They are still different though, despite all there efforts, despite all the gains that they've made. No matter what they do, no matter how well they learn to mimick normal behavior and pick up tricks for understanding others, there is still going to be a chasm between them and everyone else.

It's not whining. It's reality. And shame on you for assuming that those commisterting about their various difficulties are not doing their best.

2. The other part of your question seems to be based on a theoretical magical fix and some of our unwillingness to take part of it.

Well, I can only speak for myself, but I like who I am and am, for the most part, a happy person who goes through each day fascinated by a dozen things. Yes, I get lonely from time to time. Yes, there are days when I feel I'm a failure. But every person has their faults (and I look at the world and see things in the typical person that I find bafflingly dysfunctional). The fact is I like who I am. Trading my strengths and weaknesses for another set does not appeal to me.



krex
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10 Apr 2008, 3:01 am

You have been a member here for 3 years and posted over 3,ooo times...having a bad night are you? I don't think the attitudes of the people here have changed that much have they...I mean, you just noticed?

First off,there is a saying that I think is apt to your statement..."You see what your looking for". If that is the only thing that you see then...etc,etc.


And just for the my personal respect for logic....try using some. Your arguement is so full of holes. The people here don't appear to e to be complaining about their AS traits as much as the intolerance of other people to them. It's true that the sensory issues and NVL can be lessened but learning to intellectually learn how to interpret non verbal communication is not going to rewire my brain so that it become inate.

I don't want to be an NT an AS a male a female old or young...I want to be a human(actually I think I would rather be a bear but that's another post :oops: )<---I kid,I kid....that has the right to develop the traits that I respect to the best of my abilities and it just happens that things like honesty, hard working, focus and intellectual curiosity are traits that others attibute to AS that I admire...that is why I'm here...why are you?


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10 Apr 2008, 3:02 am

What you just said was the reason why I left the aspie community for two years. I got sick and tired of all the whining and moaning about being different and not even trying to succeed and work on their symptoms, like working on being flexible. At first I thought we were all being treated badly and my mother told me lot of aspies just want special rules and they use their disability as an excuse. I didn't believe her at first but after she said that, I started to realize she was right because it made me read posts differently. So I lost interest in the community. I decided to come back hoping I be a good role model for the other aspies out there. There are some out there who think they can't do this, can't do that because of their condition. I thought the same for myself when I was a teen for a short bit. I thought I would never be able to get married and have kids, have a job, live by myself and my mother kept telling me "oh yes you can."
But I decided in my late teens I didn't want to be crippled by my AS so what did I do, I fought through my inflexibility, I fought through my anxiety, I took my mother's advice about how to work with other people, how to not invade people's personal space, she gave me this rule; if I am less than my arm length away, I am standing too close so I have to back up.
One time when I said why can't others do the same as I did, I got attacked by someone on here because she said it was something an NT would say and why should she change her way of thinking.
I should have just said back to her "and you sound like someone who want to use their Aspergers as an excuse just like the rest of them."
But I told her that is not changing her way of thinking, it's called coping and I used examples like when a dyslexic learns to read and write, is that changing their way of thinking?



Who_Am_I
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10 Apr 2008, 3:15 am

Because being happy with oneself and being unhappy with one's life are two different things. Also, even if your thinking and behaviour is the cause of your problems, it is difficult to
1. Recognise this.
2. Work out how to change things.
3. Actually change things.

Change is difficult for anyone, and people on the spectrum seem to have huge difficulties with it. That doesn't mean that it is invariably impossible, though, just that for most of us it will take a great deal of effort.


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Thomas1138
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10 Apr 2008, 3:19 am

BTW, I found this on another board:

Sarcastic_Name wrote:
I troll casually sometimes, just cause it can be fun. Trolling is just simply stirring up trouble, it's how it's done and how badly that determines the damage.



krex
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10 Apr 2008, 3:22 am

Well...it doesn't look like you changed your interest to be more NT?

The basic reality the Op over looked is that we are all at different ages and points on the spectrum...to claim that ALL of us should ALL do A is "black and white" thinking. You think only people with AS complain or whine or feel discouraged (or ask for support when they are having a rough time?)Go hang out with more NT's. That is about all I hear at my job, other then complaints about other people and how stuipid they arettttthat is not an AS condition...it is a human condition. Many of them would be much happier if they developed some AS traits but....nobody tells them they have to try to be more AS or have no right to ever feel bad or hurt or complain about being treated unfairly.


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krex
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10 Apr 2008, 3:27 am

Thomas1138 wrote:
BTW, I found this on another board:

Sarcastic_Name wrote:
I troll casually sometimes, just cause it can be fun. Trolling is just simply stirring up trouble, it's how it's done and how badly that determines the damage.



Well, I don't mind trolls who provoke thought and debate. I think that it helps me think out my own opinions to have my beliefs challenged and I like to hear how others process information as well.


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Kaleido
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10 Apr 2008, 3:33 am

I think the point is that this is a support forum and probably the only place some people have to come and say what is really going on for them. Feelings are quite hard to understand and I think its really important for people on the spectrum to talk about them.

We cannot judge what people are doing about their issues unless they choose to disclose their struggles even though we might see fellow members talking about what they are feeling.

Personally, I come on here with big smiles and hopefully a positive attitude, but who is to say that I do not also go through times of feeling suicidal for instance or times of frustration at not being able to make the changes I might like for all kinds of reasons.

What you see is not always whats going on for people.

There are some courageous fellow members here who despite their great honesty about how hard they find life, are in fact, setting a great example by carrying on with their lives, supporting this board with their posts and generally being warm and caring towards others.



10 Apr 2008, 3:43 am

I don't care for trolls either. I've trolled before but my way of trolling is posting random stuff for humor like the time I asked all those Benny & Joon questions. But I decided to stop trolling because I want to be taken seriously, not have people assume one of my serious posts is one of my games. It's like crying wolf with your posts when you keep trolling. If I want to troll, go to Zomg or Intensity or go to the Random discussion where I can post silly stuff like "Does this girl have Bipolar?" and post a youtube video of Amanda Bynes doing her Ask Ashley skit on All That from the 1990's.



oblio
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10 Apr 2008, 3:51 am

Pundit23 wrote:
First off, we contradict ourselves because we contain multitudes.

I agree that AS is not something you're forced to accept:
you were you long before you ever heard of Asperger's,

and you will remain you long after



is that a threat?


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Daewoodrow
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10 Apr 2008, 5:09 am

I save all my whining for my blog, where nobody has to read it. So I can safely say i'm not one of these whiners you mentioned.
But I understand why people come here and contradict themselves. The way I see it, it's simple really, most Aspies feel they are are superior to Neurotypicals on some levels, in fact on many levels. And yet being constantly surrounded by Neurotypicals everyday, we are treated like the inferior ones, and subjected to a feeling of loneliness and degradation that we wouldn't have to suffer if everyone else saw how overstated emotional conversation is.
So. The acceptance of who we are comes from the feeling of great potential. The whining comes from the need for people who appreciate this potential, and from finally being presented with an audience who sympathise with our lack of appreciation. In short, people come here for validation. Don't blame them, they are afterall only homosapien.



poopylungstuffing
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10 Apr 2008, 5:19 am

Believe me. If I truely could control the level of emotional distress I can be under at times, I certainly would.
I understand that i bring alot of it upon myself, but I still can't escape from it.



tybald
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10 Apr 2008, 5:44 am

Yeah I whine occasionally. So does everyone at times. I agree that there are people in all walks of life who are pathological complainers and excuse users and there's as many in the NT world as anywhere else. It doesn't mean that everyone who ever has a moan about things is one of them. Also remember that AS is often strongly linked to depression and anxiety and people suffering from these things need help and encouragement.

That said I do agree that people using any condition/disorder/disability as an excuse for not making the most of themselves is wrong, and often cheapens the efforts of those who genuinely cannot help themselves. Personally I feel that AS has given me a number of disadvantages but also some compensatory gifts. Although the disadvantages get me down sometimes I agree that its my responsibility to make the most of the advantages I do have, even if I don't always get it right. I feel thats a duty I have to myself and to the world in general.



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10 Apr 2008, 6:59 am

of course the only logical retort is to whine about all the whiners.........


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