Wake up people! There is no such thing as Aspergers.

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trickie
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09 Mar 2009, 9:56 pm

I had no idea that sensitivity to noise, texture and environment were part of my personality :o

Asperger's goes beyond personality and often encompasses physical traits like bad coordination neuro scientists are now saying people with Asperger's may even walk differently or maybe thats just personality too :!:



Liresse
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09 Mar 2009, 9:56 pm

junior1 wrote:
Liresse wrote:
i am sorry.

i would not be so quick to judge whether something exists or not. i think every person in the world (nt or not) would be a good deal wiser if they got an official diagnosis for their problems. at least then they'd face up to it. that is what we are doing on wrongplanet: facing up to the truth.


I suspect that getting someone to label you can be very harmful. Now granted, i think some people who hang out around here want a label, so in their case maybe its ok, but its a strong assumption that most people would benefit from being labeled by a social construct.
please do not quote me out of context and reply to the rest of the post also. if you come into wrongplanet with an aggressive mindset you may find you come across as arrogant and unintelligent.

i am not discriminating against the arrogant or the unintelligent, but if you are trying to be respected for what you say, no one is impressed by advice from someone who is both arrogant and unintelligent.


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Last edited by Liresse on 09 Mar 2009, 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

09 Mar 2009, 9:57 pm

Okay, what do you call people who have sensory issues, problems with social skills, relating to people, reading non verbal cues, social cues, body language, understanding facial expressions, and knowing how someone would feel? What do you call when someone has difficulty seeing unwirtten rules, reading between the lines, seeing double meanings, and taking things literal?



claire-333
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09 Mar 2009, 9:59 pm

...



Last edited by claire-333 on 09 Mar 2009, 10:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Callista
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09 Mar 2009, 10:00 pm

Just because it's possible for a group of people to imagine a thing exists when it doesn't... doesn't mean that any given thing is automatically such an illusion...

The OP needs to take a logic class....

And if you want to call it something else when I get stuck in the middle of the room because I can't plan things, or when I inadvertently insult somebody for the third time that week out of ten total conversations, or when I have to move repetitively so I can think properly, or when I freeze in mid-sentence because I tried to make eye contact, or when I do the same thing for twenty-six utterly enjoyable hours because I'm obsessed with it... sure, call it something else. Make up a name, Dr. Seuss style. But it's definitely something, not nothing.

Aspies come in all personality styles. Introverted, extroverted, anxious, overconfident, easygoing, confrontational, rational, emotional, romantic, practical... you name it, there's an Aspie with that personality trait. We're nowhere near homogeneous on the personality front. There's a different distribution of personality style from NTs; but considering we have a different environment to grow up in, and different genetics, that makes perfect sense.

It's nice to say "It's not a diagnosis. I'm actually normal," but it's not true. By definition we all have significant impairments; and our ways of acting and thinking are far off average--that is, "ab-normal". Now, if you want to say, "There's nothing wrong with having AS. It's not supposed to make you ashamed. You're not supposed to have people try to fix you and make you somebody you're not," then I agree with you 100%. You just don't have to insist it's not a real diagnosis to be able to say that.


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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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09 Mar 2009, 10:04 pm

Heh, I'm amused. Another one of these topics. Hee hee have I read this before? If not, are these written by the same poster ;)



Last edited by ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo on 09 Mar 2009, 10:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cubedemon6073
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09 Mar 2009, 10:05 pm

Hey John Best

Let's cut the crap. I can tell who you are by how you write. I know where you're going at John. Next you're going to post a link to that book I'm ok, you're ok.

CubeDemon



Last edited by cubedemon6073 on 10 Mar 2009, 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Liresse
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09 Mar 2009, 10:06 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
Heh, I'm amused. Another one of these topics. Hee hee have I read this before? If not, are these written by the same poster ;)
looks like a multiple account to me.


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Ixtli
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09 Mar 2009, 10:07 pm

junior1:

Quote:
How many people here had their cells examined under a microscope by a scientist who spotted the "autism"?


In light of this comment, I won't be addressing junior1 at all.

As for the rest--is anyone else in favour of locking this thread? Have people like junior1 ever come to their senses? My impression is that this is a lost cause; he registered just to distribute this tripe and, indefensible though it may be, I doubt anything will dissuade him from it.



Liresse
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09 Mar 2009, 10:09 pm

Ixtli wrote:
junior1:
Quote:
How many people here had their cells examined under a microscope by a scientist who spotted the "autism"?


In light of this comment, I won't be addressing junior1 at all.

As for the rest--is anyone else in favour of locking this thread? Have people like junior1 ever come to their senses? My impression is that this is a lost cause; he registered just to distribute this tripe and, indefensible though it may be, I doubt anything will dissuade him from it.
aye 8)


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09 Mar 2009, 10:10 pm

I think this makes sense. I don't "have AS" but I apparently fit the diagnostic criteria. I don't mind the label. It's better than NT!



garyww
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09 Mar 2009, 10:12 pm

Don't be to hard on this person as the choice of the user name is indicative of his (or her) personality problems and low self esteem so just by registering they showed us their true being and are just crying out for help.


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junior1
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09 Mar 2009, 10:14 pm

Prosser wrote:
junior1 wrote:
buryuntime wrote:
so, you're saying autism doesn't exist either? Essentially the same thing...


How many people here had their cells examined under a microscope by a scientist who spotted the "autism"?


Which cells are you referring to?


My point is, how many here were given a blood test or a brain scan or some hard scientific measurement to spot their "autism"? I find the aspergers is autism connection sort of weird since I am not aware of any hard, biological testing which is done for it.

I mean in the words of the article author, who is clearly more intelligent than I,

Quote:

Instead, I mean that these
disorders do not “exist” and “have properties”
in the same manner that artifacts and viruses
do. For these reasons, a taxonomy of mental
disorders such as the DSM “does not simply
describe and classify characteristics of groups of
individuals, but . . . actively constructs a version
of both normal and abnormal . . . which is then
applied to individuals who end up being classified
as normal or abnormal” (Parker, Georgaca,
Harper, McLaughlin, & Stowell-Smith, 1995,
p. 93).


I'll switch to a different author

david D. Burns, author of "When Panic Attacks"


Quote:
"To my way of thinking, the DSM-IV diagnostic criteria for the anxiety disorders are rather nonsensical, kind of like Alice in Wonderland. You can assume that worrying turns into an illness called generalized anxiety disorder after six months, since that's the way its officially defined in the DSM-IV, but keep in mind that this cutoff point is arbitrary. GAD isn't a real disease in the same sense that pnemunia is a real disease. Worrying exists, but GAD doesn't. Shyness exists, but social anxiety doesn't.

Where did these diagnostic criteria come from in the first place. You may not be aware that they weren't decided on strictly scientific grounds. What actually happens is that committees of psychiatrists get together from time to time and vote on the latest versions of the diagnostic criteria. they scratch their chins and ponder about how many months of worrying are required before GAD suddenly springs to life"



Its of course the same problem with Aspergers. DSM-IV, assuming the random URL I pulled up is right, starts with

Quote:

Diagnostic Criteria For 299.80 Asperger's Disorder
A. Qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:

1. marked impairments in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body postures, and gestures to regulate social interaction
2. failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level
3. a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interests, or achievements with other people (e.g. by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest to other people)
4. lack of social or emotional reciprocity

B. Restricted repetitive and stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests, and activities, as manifested by at least one of the following:

1. encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus
2. apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals
3. stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g., hand or finger flapping or twisting, or complex whole-body movements)
4. persistent preoccupation with parts of objects

C. The disturbance causes clinically significant impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning

D. There is no clinically significant general delay in language (e.g., single words used by age 2 years, communicative phrases used by age 3 years)

E. There is no clinically significant delay in cognitive development or in the development of age-appropriate self-help skills, adaptive behavior (other than social interaction), and curiosity about the environment in childhood

F. Criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or Schizophrenia



Don't you see that they've clumped a whole bunch of traits together and called it a condition called Aspergers. Why do you need 2 manifestations of social impairement? Why not 3? Why not 1?

Delay 2 years, but not 2 years 1 month? Particularly distrubing is that you can have all the Aspergers traits but apparently still not have aspergers because condition F says they can say you have Schizophrenia instead. So..... is Schizophrenia autism? Can someone explain that autism thing to me?



bistromathics
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09 Mar 2009, 10:16 pm

I'm going to resist the urge to mock your post by saying the same thing about... lunch, or something (it's just a social construct, it's not real!). Instead I'm going to re-state your post as simply as possible.

So, basically, what you're saying is that people define and categorize phenomena perceived by the senses. A car is just as much a mental construct as lunch. I can imagine a few things that are not quite a car, or not quite lunch. I can even imagine eating pseudo-lunch in a pseudo-car.

I'm not even sure where I'm going with this. I think all I'm saying is that it's more important to talk about how people should act towards each other than to abstractify this into a discussion on how words should be defined.



junior1
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09 Mar 2009, 10:18 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
Hey John Best

Let's cut the crap. I can tell who you are by how you right. I know where you're going at John. Next you're going to post a link to that book I'm ok, you're ok.

CubeDemon


I'm not whoever you think I am, not that I can prove or disprove it. Its not like I'm just making the stuff up that I'm quoting, either.