21 Aug 2006, 5:29 am
Just a couple more points (by the way, why is this thread in 'games sports and fitness'??).
Black duck - would you feel comfortable drinking human breast milk?. Because Cow milk is meant for calves, not for humans. We are the only species that carries on using milk after weaning, it's quite perverse really!. I know most of us are brought up thinking it's ok, but why would anyone actually want to drink a Cows breast milk, or eat a Chickens Period???
21 Aug 2006, 6:07 pm
22 Aug 2006, 4:22 am
24 Aug 2006, 6:50 pm
24 Aug 2006, 9:24 pm
25 Aug 2006, 3:59 am
BazzaMcKenzie wrote:
TubbyChef wrote:
Maybe we have actually finished the Vegan discussion. I know I come off a bit full-on at times but actually I dislike a lot of other Vegans (I have known many over the years) as they are somewhat judgmental and patronising!.
I'm a down-to-earth realist type Vegan!. I just do what I can.
We'll agree to disagree, shall we?.
I'm a down-to-earth realist type Vegan!. I just do what I can.
We'll agree to disagree, shall we?.
Actually we agree on quite a bit.
I do not like the way animals are treated in abbotairs. I especially hate battery hen farms and never buy cage eggs or chickens. I care for the environment, and believe that if you look after wild habitat, that wild animals will take care of themselves. I care for wild animals "as a whole" and hunt individual animals.
I get a bit full on too.
Kind regards
Whilst I appreciate your 'kind regards' and the fact that we have managed to finish our personal debate cleanly, I'm a bit pissed off that you have posted a private message in this space. Please don't do that to me again
25 Aug 2006, 11:02 pm
27 Aug 2006, 6:10 pm
27 Aug 2006, 6:33 pm
30 Aug 2006, 7:12 pm
30 Aug 2006, 9:18 pm
12 Sep 2007, 2:09 am
As for me, reading these posts will not change my diet.
We had (in the family) a time when we were all vegetarians (after Chernobyl, that explains the reasons enough). WE sometimes eat soy bean and tofu... So, last year when I made this decision, it was not too hard to follow through.
although these posts may help us rethink our dietary situation, eventually, one should ask the question(s) :
- Would we rather eat meatstock, or would we not ?
- Would we rather eat vegetal products, or not ?
- Would we rather have an all-round diet, or omit certain foods ?
- Would we rather have a diet "free" from murder, cholesterol, fat, ... (and/ or guilt) ?
Or, for what reasons? Be it beliefs, views, ethics, morals, etc... ?
TubbyChef wrote:
Um, Fish *is* meat - dead Fish meat! - e.g NOT included in a VEGEtarian diet!.
Indeed, so as chicken.
Some of my relatives claim to be vegetarians and still eat chicken. I eat fisf (and seafood) only for a source of protein, and because I like it
Quote:
Some "vetetarians" I know are happy to eat seafood but not meat. This never makes sense to me.
as chicken to me.
But, I get the impression that certian forms of vegetarianism only omits "red" meat diet (e.g. lamb, pork, beef, ...)
blackduck wrote:
Nobody's hands are free from the blood of other animals, not even vegetarians
Not that I agree, but good point. Then again, if we really thought about it, what to eat, then?
Quote:
And if they can come up with a way for child molesters and mass murderers to die relativeley painless deaths, surely they can let my food die the same way
Either way, it is a form similar to capital punishment (i.e. giving them the electric chair, or that fatal dose)... Besides, we are no gods to do that.
Quote:
I find it so very depressing that I even have to have this conversation - if i had just one wish it would be for the world to be a Vegan World - for the Planet, the Animals, and for Humanity and Compassion
The more I think of it, the more my resolve to be one increases.
NB: Yogis and buddhist monks are vegans. Yet they don't certain vegetables (e.g. onion, garlic or other vegetables growing underground) as it goes against their beliefs.
I am not (yet) a "non-meat" eater for the slaughter. Yet I chose to be for the diseases that come with the meat stock.
True, genetically modified vegetables/ fruits are not good. We must take care on what we eat...(Living in the countryside, with a large garden is a good solution to this problem, at least for our OWN healthy diet).
29 Sep 2007, 4:16 pm
Serissa wrote:
This is true and I admit it; however if you go long enough without meat you kind of forget what it used to taste like and veggieburgers are an accpetable alternative due to the fact that you've forgotten that meat tastes better. 
((This is not to try to convert you, but to say it did stop bothering me after awhile.))
((This is not to try to convert you, but to say it did stop bothering me after awhile.))Not everyone does think meat tastes better. Meat really, really disgusts me. In fact, I get physically ill from eating it, and I associate the smells of cooking meat with nausea. I won't eat meat substitutes that are flavoured like meat at all, rather I eat things like black bean burgers.
I'm actually vegetarian because I can't tolerate meat, and I still get a hard time.
29 Sep 2007, 6:10 pm
Brittany2907
The ultimate storm is eternally on it's
Joined: 9 Jun 2007
Age: 32
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,718
Location: New Zealand
10 Oct 2007, 2:47 am
Serissa wrote:
This is not meant to be a rant, exactly, but simply to point out a definite trend of what nearly amounts to prejudice.
I find it kind of funny and kind of sad that so many people can be personally offended if someone is a vegan or a vegetarian and immediately demand a convincing argument in favor of their food choices. ((I'm not a vegan, I am a vegetarian, but I can still speak from personal experience on the basic point I'm making.)) If I were to say "I never eat oatmeal" then I doubt it would get the same reaction as "I never eat meat."
If it were oatmeal the person would likely say some derivative of either commiseration, a defense of oatmeal as a healthy choice of food, a defense of oatmeal as "yummy" or a simply query as to why oatmeal was distasteful. The conversation would be allowed to end after one more round of responding more likely than not, as in, "yes, it's healthy but I eat _ instead" being sufficient for the first option, "I really don't like the taste/texture" being a good enough defense against the second or fourth option, and the third option requiring no defense. There is generally no offense taken to not choosing to eat oatmeal, or whatever you're choosing not to eat.
However when the conversation comes around to meat, if the person eats meat, the first question is "do you eat fish/do you eat chicken?" Then, "Why are you a vegetarian?" OR "It's not healthy to be a vegetarian" OR some kind of response which questions the "moral superiority" of vegetarianism- EVEN IF NO SUCH MORAL SUPERIORITY WAS MENTIONED. The topic will then drag on until the other person feels vindicated, not until it had been addressed. People who find out you do not eat meat will ask you every time they see you if you are taking supplements or have gotten enough protein, will flaunt hamburgers or whatever they're eating in front of you and say "MMMMMMMMM. Good" or try to give you a new reason why vegetarians are causing more harm than good in the world every time they see you.
I do not claim to be morally superior for being a vegetarian. I DO eat enough protein (although it's more convenient if not necessarily easier for me than a vegan as I do eat dairy products and eggs). I have my own reasons for not eating meat and I really should not need to justify them. Yet, people tend to be extremely offended on some basic level by the idea of not eating meat; not only will they argue but they generally want to "convert" me and would take it as a personal victory if I had a hamburger or something.
It feels a lot like harassment to me. My dad told a couple of people that I am a vegetarian the other day and they set in on me; I told him not to tell anyone else because of it. It's like I have to be "in the closet" about it. It just seems unfair.
I find it kind of funny and kind of sad that so many people can be personally offended if someone is a vegan or a vegetarian and immediately demand a convincing argument in favor of their food choices. ((I'm not a vegan, I am a vegetarian, but I can still speak from personal experience on the basic point I'm making.)) If I were to say "I never eat oatmeal" then I doubt it would get the same reaction as "I never eat meat."
If it were oatmeal the person would likely say some derivative of either commiseration, a defense of oatmeal as a healthy choice of food, a defense of oatmeal as "yummy" or a simply query as to why oatmeal was distasteful. The conversation would be allowed to end after one more round of responding more likely than not, as in, "yes, it's healthy but I eat _ instead" being sufficient for the first option, "I really don't like the taste/texture" being a good enough defense against the second or fourth option, and the third option requiring no defense. There is generally no offense taken to not choosing to eat oatmeal, or whatever you're choosing not to eat.
However when the conversation comes around to meat, if the person eats meat, the first question is "do you eat fish/do you eat chicken?" Then, "Why are you a vegetarian?" OR "It's not healthy to be a vegetarian" OR some kind of response which questions the "moral superiority" of vegetarianism- EVEN IF NO SUCH MORAL SUPERIORITY WAS MENTIONED. The topic will then drag on until the other person feels vindicated, not until it had been addressed. People who find out you do not eat meat will ask you every time they see you if you are taking supplements or have gotten enough protein, will flaunt hamburgers or whatever they're eating in front of you and say "MMMMMMMMM. Good" or try to give you a new reason why vegetarians are causing more harm than good in the world every time they see you.
I do not claim to be morally superior for being a vegetarian. I DO eat enough protein (although it's more convenient if not necessarily easier for me than a vegan as I do eat dairy products and eggs). I have my own reasons for not eating meat and I really should not need to justify them. Yet, people tend to be extremely offended on some basic level by the idea of not eating meat; not only will they argue but they generally want to "convert" me and would take it as a personal victory if I had a hamburger or something.
It feels a lot like harassment to me. My dad told a couple of people that I am a vegetarian the other day and they set in on me; I told him not to tell anyone else because of it. It's like I have to be "in the closet" about it. It just seems unfair.
I have been vegetarian for about 5-6 months and vegan for about two and a half months. I have been lectured several times about how I am going to turn pale and my bones are going to break etc. But I know that wont happen because I am getting the right nutrients.
I have also had that "if you were starving on a mountain with only a cow to eat, would you eat it?" type of question. Really is irritating that people just don't think. I don't go around asking meat eaters, "if you were stuck on a mountian with only a crop of corn, would you eat it,?.
I also have to feel that sometimes I have to keep my veganism to myself because I don't want to be lectured about it. Thats the sad thing about this world...no one accepts ANYTHING different from the "norm".
10 Oct 2007, 7:50 pm
