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soulecho
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01 Oct 2011, 4:56 am

Verdandi wrote:
Sibyl wrote:
He goes on to suggest that adults/teachers intervene to equalize the balance to some extent. But I wonder whether the root of the phenomenon might happen at this stage. I suspect HFA might operate the same way.


This seems unlikely. Research into the subject has found neurological differences in transgender people. There's no reason autistic transgender people would be any different.

Also, there's a study that I need to dig up that involved screening all of the transgender clients in a particular area/at a particular clinic for autism, and they found that 6% of the clients were autistic.


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Co-Occurrence of Autism Spectrum Disorders in Individuals with Gender Dysphoria



Joe90
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01 Oct 2011, 5:16 am

I am female, and I have a female brain. I may struggle with conforming as a female, but I can't conform as a man either - that's even harder. I don't want to anyway. I only don't wear make-up because I can't be bothered. I stand and sit like a ladie, and I love giving men ''the eye'' and flirting around with them. I don't like short skirts because I'm quite a private person who doesn't like tarting up, but I wear hot pants in the summer, and keep my legs shaven and I rub moisterising cream on them to keep them soft and....ladie-like.


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monstermunch
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01 Oct 2011, 5:20 am

I used to be a tomboy when I was a little girl. When I was 10, I used to wear Arsenal shirts and shorts, (because I supported Arsenal), and I loved playstation games like football ones and car ones. Oh, and I was really into cars aswell. I was actually more of a boy than what my boyfriend was!

I'm not a lesbian though.



Magneto
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01 Oct 2011, 6:13 am

Quote:
He says that Aspie boys are often welcomed by the girls, who feel sorry for them because they are usually either bullied or just plain left out, not being very good at the sports skills, (same ball-catching and other team actions I've mentioned before) and the last ones chosen for the team.

Hmmm. Or maybe I just preferred hanging around with the girls in primary school? That was my first primary school, a lot of the time, but in my second (mainstream) one I had more male friends, and in most of my education I've been in special schools, so there have been very few females to be friends with...

But, I generally wanted to be like the girls... and that's been from nursery...


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Verdandi
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01 Oct 2011, 6:52 am

I suspect that Attwood might not know what he's talking about in that part of the book. He seems to be looking for elaborate explanations for what are likely pretty straightforward situations.



kopetski
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02 Oct 2011, 9:45 am

This is interesting.
I'm gay since I can remember. Now I'm 31 years old, found out this year about Asperger and things are changing in my head.
I only had 1 relationship (with female) and that wasn't quite what I expected. Girls are hard to get. AND I'm not happy with someone near me.
I don't want to date guys either, eventhough that would be easier (they just want ANY girl, as far as I can tell).

Since i've been reading into Asperger, I found out that some people don't really feel like they belong to any gender.
I've read about guys not having a libido that they should have and I know myself.. I never cared for being a woman. always wore pants, never wanted a skirt or makeup, always climbing in trees and playing with cars.. Don't tell anyone, but I have a folder with pictures of CARS and girls in bikini, but they are actually IN MY WAY :evil: ..
Nowadays I'm even thinking I'd rather be a guy. I would definitely not mind having smaller boobs, or just be totally flat-chested, and be taller and stronger, so I could just go wherever I wanted without the fear of being harrassed. Now I'm this skinny, insecure girl :( As for dating or friends, my gender doesn't matter anyway.

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As for myself, I just don't feel terribly gendered at all. My body is female, but I don't really know what that's actually supposed to mean. I never fit in with other girls, but I don't wish that I'd been born a guy either. I just never felt like I belonged to any group at all.



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02 Oct 2011, 12:04 pm

kopetski wrote:
I never cared for being a woman. always wore pants, never wanted a skirt or makeup

What's that got to do with being a woman? :?:


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kopetski
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02 Oct 2011, 2:52 pm

I know some women refuse to go outside if they don't have their makeup on. Or where you being sarcastic ?
Girls want to be girls, I don't know..



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02 Oct 2011, 2:57 pm

kopetski wrote:
I know some women refuse to go outside if they don't have their makeup on. Or where you being sarcastic ?

Feminist. :wink:


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kopetski
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02 Oct 2011, 3:00 pm

ow :P
I thought I was gay and a bit feminist but now with my gender-vagueness I am reconsidering my reasons to be gay and why I do all the stuff I do :?



mb1984
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02 Oct 2011, 3:43 pm

I'm also a transguy, still female bodied though. I'm hoping to start hormone therapy in the near future though, I'm seriously worried about my mental health if I don't.
I'm wondering how my socializing might "improve" once I become more comfortable with my physical self. I don't really care, because I don't want to socialize, but I am curious how much of my anxiety is from my dysphoria.

I was always a "tomboy" to others, but I really thought I was a boy, until I started puberty and things started making more sense. I don't know how to act like a girl, even if I try to wear girl clothes and make-up, I think I look like something from a horror show. I feel silly and like I am in drag, and I've had that feeling since I was able to assert myself about what I liked. Even my mannerisms are not female, and I find myself constantly checking and rechecking how I am moving or sitting, depending where I am. I am also an extremely hairy female, and I don't care to spend time with hair removal, so that draws a lot of looks.
I just can't wait to feel like myself.


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kopetski
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03 Oct 2011, 2:53 am

but I just wonder whether this physical transition is really necessary.. if we would be living in a world that did not emphasis the existence of only two genders/sexes, would you be ok being the hairy tomboy with female parts ?

I don't feel like changing bits because people need to see either a man or a woman, but I'm just ME. Of course, in this crappy world, and you get guys chasing you because of boobs and women looking down on you because lack of femininity. I'd be really ok if I was alone in this world (dream on..)

Hairs too here, I do shave my legs twice in summer but pfff.. all the fuss. It's not like I'm going to meet interesting people that might be attracted to me, lol.



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03 Oct 2011, 3:04 am

kopetski wrote:
but I just wonder whether this physical transition is really necessary.. if we would be living in a world that did not emphasis the existence of only two genders/sexes, would you be ok being the hairy tomboy with female parts ?


Many people who physically transition say they find it necessary. And even if they don't explicitly say so, why do it, otherwise? It brings about all kinds of problems for most who go that route. It seems illogical to me that a random person who does not themselves want to transition would have any special or new insights into the question of transitioning that most probably haven't already thought of on their own. I know people who delayed transitioning as long as they could for whatever reasons, and it made things worse for them, especially in terms of stress and mental health. The only thing that really helped was actually physically transitioning.

We'll never live in a world that does not emphasize the existence of the gender binary, and even if we did there's no reason to expect no one would ever want to transition.



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03 Oct 2011, 4:38 am

I have a weird problem. I read about transgender people saying that they feel they have been assigned the wrong body for their brain, ie they have a female body but wish it was a male body.

But what if you have the opposite problem, you feel you have been assigned the correct biological gender, but you have a brain that is too masculine for the female body? I feel as if I should be more feminine and I wish I was more feminine, but my brain has been wired in this male way and it isnt what I want. I wish I was more female in mind than I am in reality.
I want to be female and want to be friends with other females but I dont fit in with them because I think they know on some level that my brain isnt quite female enough for me to be like them. I am always struggling to be like them, and not because society wants me to.


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kopetski
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03 Oct 2011, 5:38 am

zen_mistress wrote:
But what if you have the opposite problem, you feel you have been assigned the correct biological gender, but you have a brain that is too masculine for the female body? I feel as if I should be more feminine and I wish I was more feminine, but my brain has been wired in this male way and it isnt what I want. I wish I was more female in mind than I am in reality.
I want to be female and want to be friends with other females but I dont fit in with them because I think they know on some level that my brain isnt quite female enough for me to be like them. I am always struggling to be like them, and not because society wants me to.


That's part of what I'm trying to find out about myself. But in my brain, I'm not male or female, I think. So that makes me act/dress kinda androgynous.
And then the most practical way of being seems to be in a male body, you have less annoyances (or not?) and less fuss, so that's why I'm thinking that should be more fitted for me. But not because I hate my parts or so.

If you want to be female out of internal reasons, ok. But don't try to be more feminine just to get people to like you. I found people appreciating me for what I am. I'm real (weird, nerdy, eccentric) and honest. The ones appreciating this are rare but they do exist.



n3rdgir1
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03 Oct 2011, 10:26 am

Sibyl wrote:
Chromosomes do work like that. An X paired with a Y, XY, makes a boy. XX makes a girl. There are quite a few people around with three chromosomes in that position, an abnormality. XXX may be super-feminine, and XXY can make a woman with masculine traits. I am not sure that I remember what XYY looks like. Some star women athletes (who look like girls and have been raised as girls) have tested XXY, and now at the Olympic level, and I'm not sure how far down, they're testing for this, and those poor girls aren't allowed to compete in women's events.


I feel the need to point a few things out, as molecular biology is one of my strongest obsessions. There are two main genetic factors that determine biological sex in humans (and most mammals), the SRY section of the Y chromosome (which can in very rare instances be found on an X chromosome) and the androgen receptor gene which is located on the X chromosome.

As long as the androgen receptor gene is fine and the Y chromosome has a functioning SRY section, no matter how many X chromosomes you have will result in a penis and testes. So YY, Y, XY, XXY, XXXY, etc. will all have a penis (and not be competing as female in the Olympics). If the androgen receptor gene is defective, you can have varying degrees of feminization with a Y chromosome present. This is the current prevailing thought as to why trans women exist. A mutation in the receptor can lead to complete, partial, or mild androgen insensitivity syndrome (CAIS, PAIS, or MAIS). People with CAIS are usually born with a Y chromosome, vagina, no uterus, and internal testicles in place of ovaries. They are usually raised female and are often not diagnosed until puberty due to a lack of periods. PAIS usually prsents as masculine women and MAIS as feminine men although these are often presented as a range of intersex symptoms.

There are also other intersex conditions like Swyer, but almost all intersex conditions are related to the SRY or androgen receptor defects.