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beneficii
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10 Jan 2015, 5:26 am

Fnord wrote:
Magneto wrote:
I think people *should* tell their partners if they're trans*, because relationships need to be based on openness and trust. You shouldn't go into a relationship hiding a really important part of yourself from the other person...
It certainly seems to be applicable under the concept of "Full Disclosure". I mean, if a woman is barren or if a man is impotent or sterile, then these are conditions that should be disclosed to a potential marriage partner, right? Does it matter if the condition is a birth defect, the result of medication and/or medical procedures, or caused by an infection? Doesn't the person that you are vowing to love, honor and respect under all conditions for the rest of your life somehow deserve to not only know that you can't become a parent by natural means, but why? Shouldn't this disclosure come before an engagement is made and the vows are spoken?

If a trans-person is hoping for full acceptance after making a full disclosure, then they may be sorely disappointed, and more often than not. I am not the only person in the world who believes "Once a man, always a man" no matter how much estrogen and progesterone a man receives, or however skillful his cosmetic surgeon may be; and just because someone could date a trans-person, it does not mean that they should.

I am sorry that some people will be offended by the previous paragraph. It is not my intent to insult anyone, and I feel no hatred toward trans-people, either. I am just pointing what should be obvious - just because someone wants to be accepted for whatever identity they have for themselves, it does not mean that anyone else must accept them under that identity, as well ... unless of course there is some legally enforced acceptance of that identity, such as in education, employment, housing, et cetera.

So if you believe yourself to be one thing, and everyone else accepts you only as something else, then that is just something that you have to deal with, one way or another.


Out of curiosity, since they missed out on a male puberty, would you say Nicole Maines and Kim Petras were ever men? There seems to be a conceptual issue here, because, after all, no one is born as a man or a woman--you grow into being a man or a woman by going through puberty and becoming an adult.

Of course, I agree with you regarding those who completed male puberty and then went on hormones/had surgery.


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alisoncc
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10 Jan 2015, 10:29 am

Fnord wrote:
If a trans-person is hoping for full acceptance after making a full disclosure, then they may be sorely disappointed, and more often than not. I am not the only person in the world who believes "Once a man, always a man" no matter how much estrogen and progesterone a man receives, or however skillful his cosmetic surgeon may be; and just because someone could date a trans-person, it does not mean that they should.

I am sorry that some people will be offended by the previous paragraph. It is not my intent to insult anyone, and I feel no hatred toward trans-people, either. I am just pointing what should be obvious - just because someone wants to be accepted for whatever identity they have for themselves, it does not mean that anyone else must accept them under that identity, as well ... unless of course there is some legally enforced acceptance of that identity, such as in education, employment, housing, et cetera.


I would politely suggest that you have your head up your *rrse. If any other people have a problem with me as a woman then by definition it's they who have the problem not me.

You come across as one of those people who hang out in areas that cause you grief just so you can be offensive. This is an "LGBT" forum board after all. Typical male with their brains between their legs.

Alison


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beneficii
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10 Jan 2015, 11:45 am

alisoncc wrote:
Fnord wrote:
If a trans-person is hoping for full acceptance after making a full disclosure, then they may be sorely disappointed, and more often than not. I am not the only person in the world who believes "Once a man, always a man" no matter how much estrogen and progesterone a man receives, or however skillful his cosmetic surgeon may be; and just because someone could date a trans-person, it does not mean that they should.

I am sorry that some people will be offended by the previous paragraph. It is not my intent to insult anyone, and I feel no hatred toward trans-people, either. I am just pointing what should be obvious - just because someone wants to be accepted for whatever identity they have for themselves, it does not mean that anyone else must accept them under that identity, as well ... unless of course there is some legally enforced acceptance of that identity, such as in education, employment, housing, et cetera.


I would politely suggest that you have your head up your *rrse. If any other people have a problem with me as a woman then by definition it's they who have the problem not me.

You come across as one of those people who hang out in areas that cause you grief just so you can be offensive. This is an "LGBT" forum board after all. Typical male with their brains between their legs.

Alison


Uh, no. He is simply a heterosexual male who does not wish to have sex with a man, because that's not what heterosexual males want to do. Though he says he can spot trans women, if you did manage to trick him he would not be happy to find out it was really a man and not a woman he had sex with.

It's just like how Lesbians do not wish to have sex with men, regardless of the hormonal and surgical alterations they have undergone.


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Fnord
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10 Jan 2015, 11:51 am

I would further suggest that responding to polite rejection with open hostility will not exactly win any friendship awards, either.


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beneficii
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10 Jan 2015, 1:34 pm

Fnord wrote:
I would further suggest that responding to polite rejection with open hostility will not exactly win any friendship awards, either.


My apologies for my earlier rudeness to you.


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alisoncc
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10 Jan 2015, 7:16 pm

beneficii wrote:
Uh, no. He is simply a heterosexual male who does not wish to have sex with a man, because that's not what heterosexual males want to do.


Yet chooses to frequent a GLTB forum, why? Just to stir, cause offence, or to get contributors banned when they hit back?

I am well familiar with Trolls on website forums with their jaundiced views of the world. He needs to be careful, might get infected by associating with those who do come here for valid reasons. Could end up a GLTB himself. Now wouldn't that be worth doing?


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beneficii
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10 Jan 2015, 8:14 pm

alisoncc wrote:
beneficii wrote:
Uh, no. He is simply a heterosexual male who does not wish to have sex with a man, because that's not what heterosexual males want to do.


Yet chooses to frequent a GLTB forum, why? Just to stir, cause offence, or to get contributors banned when they hit back?

I am well familiar with Trolls on website forums with their jaundiced views of the world. He needs to be careful, might get infected by associating with those who do come here for valid reasons. Could end up a GLTB himself. Now wouldn't that be worth doing?


He was merely answering the question in the thread's title.


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ForeignObject
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10 Jan 2015, 11:47 pm

WOW! What have I started here?

I would never lie about my sexuality to any man. I still have my penis and I tell them right off the bat (Not that I have a penis, but that I am a transitioning female) so that there is no misunderstandings.

In a perfect world, it wouldn't matter, but we don't live in a perfect world, so you gotta be careful. If a woman was born a man but changed into a woman, I think that it is best to tell that person upfront that you have had sex reassignment surgery. Even if you are fully male or female, some people think like Fnord (I believe it was him) and that no matter how much surgery you have, you are still your original sex to them.


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11 Jan 2015, 5:07 am

The fact that anybody would make a fuss over believing that trans people are out to "deceive" is really not all that different than straight guys who think gay guys are out to hit on them, or going back to the '50s, than when gay men were depicted as mentally ill people who preyed on children. Not that there hasn't been a bad apple here or there, but this is all just rooted in harmful stereotypes. Trans people seek to live as and be publicly perceived as their identity, but I've never met one who wasn't up front about their transitioning to friends, loved ones and partners. 'The Crying Game' was just a work of fiction, guys.



Assasta
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25 Jan 2015, 12:28 pm

Wow... What a direction this thread has taken!

To answer an honest question with an honest answer:

I am attracted to androgynous femininity. Well, more specifically I am attracted to androgynous people, usually women. I identify as a lesbian and am attracted to women, especially androgynous women (in terms of personality and/or looks). When I think about men, and male bodies, I am more likely to fantasise about a purely physical, one time exchange! With a woman I am more likely to imagine a beautiful, long term relationship with emotions involved.

For me it's not about what's in between someone's legs, but about how masculine or feminine they are.

So, I would probably be more likely to be attracted to a TS, male or female, if they were more androgynous. Either a male who embraced femininity, or a female who embraced their masculine side.

In my experience transexuals tend to move towards the more extreme masculine or feminine ends of the gender spectrum... Wanting to be seen as very 'masculine male' or 'feminine female'... And for that reason I've never been attracted to a transexual.

I wouldn't rule it out, but they tend not to be androgynous, and that's just my thing.

That all being said, I'm happily married and shouldn't really be thinking about theoretically dating anyone! :)



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26 Jan 2015, 9:21 pm

Assasta wrote:
Wow... What a direction this thread has taken!

To answer an honest question with an honest answer:

I am attracted to androgynous femininity. Well, more specifically I am attracted to androgynous people, usually women. I identify as a lesbian and am attracted to women, especially androgynous women (in terms of personality and/or looks). When I think about men, and male bodies, I am more likely to fantasise about a purely physical, one time exchange! With a woman I am more likely to imagine a beautiful, long term relationship with emotions involved.

For me it's not about what's in between someone's legs, but about how masculine or feminine they are.

So, I would probably be more likely to be attracted to a TS, male or female, if they were more androgynous. Either a male who embraced femininity, or a female who embraced their masculine side.

In my experience transexuals tend to move towards the more extreme masculine or feminine ends of the gender spectrum... Wanting to be seen as very 'masculine male' or 'feminine female'... And for that reason I've never been attracted to a transexual.

I wouldn't rule it out, but they tend not to be androgynous, and that's just my thing.

That all being said, I'm happily married and shouldn't really be thinking about theoretically dating anyone! :)


That is true. I tend to act towards the 'feminine female' type when I go out in public and in private. I'm the most effeminate looking male trying to look female as possible as a human can. :heart: :heart: :heart:


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stonejcartman
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26 Jan 2015, 9:37 pm

That would 100% depends on the personality of the person. Personality is more attractive than gender



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27 Jan 2015, 8:47 pm

I have no preference for cis or trans and I am a bisexual, so I'd date just about any person of any sex or gender identity.



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29 Jan 2015, 2:14 pm

I would date anyone that I was sufficiently attracted to and that I felt a strong connection to, regardless of what combination of body parts they have or by what manner those body parts came into being, so, yes, I would date someone who is transsexual.


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MathIm
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30 Jan 2015, 4:46 am

a good thread! i like this. if she/he is kind i'll date! in a chat room i know two persons i want to date. one person is mtf and the other person is ftm!



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02 Feb 2015, 10:14 pm

MathIm wrote:
a good thread! i like this. if she/he is kind i'll date! in a chat room i know two persons i want to date. one person is mtf and the other person is ftm!

Image

Thank You.


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