Lying to Attract a Mate

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I'm not bragging at all. I'm just giving a first-hand account of what happened. It's not something I'm proud of, but it is something I can talk about firsthand. And it's not that I'm BLAMING her for it, 'm saying she was already like that, I just didn't know it. By the time you get to be a certain age, you will either be A) the type of person that does what you are told, or B) the type of person that doesn't need someone to give you direction. As far as I can tell, most of the women I've seen on this board would fit into the second category. So what I'm saying is that if you want a decent girl, pick a decent girl, i.e. one that doesn't need to be told what to do.

By the way, as long as you are screaming over the keyboard, I'm not the one who needs to grow up. What ever happened to, um, forgiveness? Are we not allowed to make mistakes and learn from them? So I should go to jail forever?

I've had a lot of success lying to attract a mate, particularly if I lie on top.

But sitting and standing can be put to good use under the right circumstances.

I've seen too many posts in this forum that mention, very matter-of-factly, fronting NT behavior/interests to attract a mate. (The posts I've seen are consistently authored by men, but that doesn't mean women are incapable of this behavior. If Aspie women are posting about this, I haven't seen those posts.)

To the men who engage in this behavior: if you read this post and take it to heart, I think I can save you and your would-be partners a lot of anguish and heartache. This is how this scenario plays out: you pretend to like things that you don't in order to win her heart (clubbing, going out with her friends, being with her all the time, willing to do whatever she wants....even little things like talking on the phone, showing affection, having sex more/less than you actually want, etc.) And you succeed - you win her heart. She's in love, she thinks you're everything she's ever wanted, she can't believe her luck - all the other broken hearts she's endured have been worth it, because they all led up to you.

Then you realize you can't maintain the charade. The stress it causes you is just too much - it's exhausting, overwhelming, draining. You can't rebuild your physical, mental and emotional energy, because she's always with you, always dragging you to clubs and parties and dinner with her friends. You become angry and frustrated, and as the anger and frustration grows, you become less and less able to articulate your feelings, or to communicate at all. She's doing all the things that she's always done, behaving all the ways she's always behaved - but now her behavior doesn't make you happy. Her very presence seems to irritate you - she doesn't understand why - and you can't explain it.

You've become a different man than the man she fell in love with. But women are funny that way - they don't just fall out of love. She'll keep looking for the guy you were, and she'll catch a glimpse of him every once in a while. She'll wonder what happened - it's like someone flipped a switch: one day you were the man of her dreams, and then everything changed.

What happens next depends on how far she's invested in the relationship. Is their marriage, kids, joint property? Or does she just love you with all her heart? She wants you to be the man she fell in love with, you can't be that man. It's a conflict that can't be resolved. Eventually she'll realize what you've done - that you lied. You made her fall in love with a man who doesn't exist. And even worse, she'll realize your whole relationship is based on lies and deception.

To be clear I'm not discouraging the attainment of social skills. The ability to approximate normal eye contact, to maintain appropriate distance when speaking to another, to listen and speak at appropriate intervals - those are all skills that will help in attracting a mate. I'm not talking about expanding your comfort zone, to grow and change (as much as possible) to accommodate your mate. Those are worthy efforts that will help your relationship flourish in the long run. I'm talking about creating a persona that is not who you are, and that is beyond your comfort zone.

Without honesty in a relationship, there can be no trust. Without trust, there can be no intimacy. Without intimacy, there's no chance for real, lasting love. There will be no acceptance of you and your needs. And that's what's really critically important to understand: you have special relationship needs. Finding a partner willing to meet those needs isn't an easy task - we all know that. But a viable substitute for finding a partner willing to meet your real, actual, serious relationship needs is not pretending that you don't have those needs. Yes, you may end up with a partner, but one that didn't sign up for a relationship with an Aspie. Eventually she'll figure out what you've done, and she'll hate you for it.

If you want to find someone who's willing to work through the problems inherent in an Aspie/NT relationship, you have to have to look for someone with whom you can build a profoundly stable partnership. She's got to be able to believe what you're telling her about your limitations, your relationship history, your feelings for her and about her, what you want and need from her (including space). You have to honor and respect her enough to let her make an informed decision to be with you. You have to be honest about your ability to meet her needs.

And yes, NTs lie to each other all the time. They start relationships under false pretenses. It happens every day. And guess what? Those relationships don't last, either. When you can't believe what your partner is telling you, the relationship is doomed. Asperger's is not an insurmountable barrier to having a lasting, loving partnership. But lying is.

Why is the man responsible for her personal feelings? Surely it's up to each partner to keep their feelings under control and not dump them on the other person?

IMO the first step to being ready for a relationship is making sure you always know where the door is i.e. not having any serious romantic entanglements so, if and when the relationship runs its course, you can go back to your old life without any major emotional trauma.

The last time I put all my feelings on another person, I got arrested for harassment.

You treated another human being as an experiment, and you're still walking and talking and not too ashamed of your amoral behavior to brag about it? You weren't trying to hurt her? No, you didn't care if you hurt her, as long as you conducted your little experiment.

I don't follow your logic. That's like saying, "How can the Wall Street firms who sold me worthless mortgage securities as Triple-A rated investments be responsible for selling me bad investments?" Well, those firms are responsible because they lied about the value of the securities, and took my money under false pretenses.

I can't speak to the stuff in ASPartners or Delphi - I don't look at those forums. I don't agree that learning social skills is deceitful. If you learn how to shake someone's hand when introduced - even if it doesn't feel "natural" to you - you're still someone who is able to respond appropriately in that social situation. There's nothing wrong with that, and your life will be easier in some small ways if you're able to affect certain social behaviors appropriately.

What these women might be referring to is the attention that Aspie men often shower women with during courtship, knowing that they can't maintain that level of attention on a regular basis. Again, what men who do that don't seem to understand is that all that attention sets up a level of expectation with the women. Why wouldn't she think that's the way you truly behave? Why wouldn't she expect it to continue, at least in some amount, over the course of the relationship?

Dear hopegrows,

My apologies beforehand, you live in a delusional world. Lying is one of the best strategies for aspies. Not all aspies can use it effectively and not all aspies can gauge the compatability of their partners.

I used to be totally honest but then I started lying about everything and my successes are proof women DONT want the truth. They are not good at giving dating advice because they don't understand how their own kind works at a general level.

There's a bunch of mathematical statistics to back it up as well...

See the mathematics of a woman's delusion here:

"As you can see from the gray line, women rate an incredible 80% of guys as worse-looking than medium. Very harsh"

http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your- ... ne-dating/

Nope, that's not quite the kind of thing I've read on those forums. Trying to give attention at a level so as to appear as someone you're not isn't something I'd personally do. However, just having learnt social skills and putting them into practice can make you appear different in different environments. For example, at work you may be able to make use of social skills to such a degree that your colleagues don't notice anything particularly out of the ordinary with you, but when you go home, you unwind and don't socialise with your family at the same level. Similarly, some aspies may know how to behave on dates socially, probably giving the impression that they're sociable and talkative or whatever, and then when they've been in a relationship for a while, there are periods of withdrawal and socialise often etc. On those forums, these women often refer to that as "faking social interaction". BTW, they seem to be nasty about aspies in general, for instance claiming that aspies should never be allowed to even have relationships "they don't have empathy", or "incapable of caring" when the problems they're experiencing is most most likely due to the aspie having problems with non-verbal communication.

Anyway, isn't some level attention like standard dating advice? Like the classic example of getting her flowers or a box of chocolates for example?

My logic is that you shouldn't play the stock market in the first place. Trying to find love quick is no different from trying to get rich quick.

Yes, the company is at fault for lying to you, but that doesn't mean you couldn't have been more judicious with your money to begin with. We can't stop liars from being liars, but we can stop ourselves from being taken in by them.

Totally unacceptable and quite filled full of false beliefs in of itself. Those whom experience no delusion are in fact not human or aware even like an animal. This is a superiority complex that is gender based deriving subjective personal experience as the macro truth. Hence no one should really take it seriously and the social poisons of sexism is starting to spew here.

Do you even have WOMEN FRIENDS? I actually know and interact with people on a daily basis. Not only that I pointed to mathematics of how distorted most women's perception of reality is and gave evidence.

This does not mean all women are stupid, but it must be faced - most people are. It's the nature of the bell curve for most people to be oblivious about the limits of their own perception of the world without serious interest in the subject.

Dear hopegrows,

My apologies beforehand, you live in a delusional world. Lying is one of the best strategies for aspies. Not all aspies can use it effectively and not all aspies can gauge the compatability of their partners.

I used to be totally honest but then I started lying about everything and my successes are proof women DONT want the truth. They are not good at giving dating advice because they don't understand how their own kind works at a general level.