men who won't date fat women

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Nessa. I tried to make fun of it, but right now you are ashaming yourself. Your last posts are about blaming someone for a photo.

Ok, is anyone hurted by that photo. No. Its her photo and she can do with it what she want.

But right now you are ashaming yourself with your behaviour because what you are saying the last posts is: "People! Do you see that? The woman is showing a photo with wet hair and bare shoulders and noone is hurted by that! So she is doing nothing to blame about! Come on people, we gotta blame her for doing nothing to blame about!"

Right now you are pointing on absolutly nothing. Noone is affected negative with that photo, and I dont think that many people are so focused on that photograph as you do. As example I thought it to be a beach photo, because of the wet hair and the bare shoulders, never watched it that close. You mentioning it now, I recognize its a bath. So its a photo of a woman with wet hair and bare shoulders in a bath. I also dont get it why you are so upset by that, because normally shoulders are not the highly sexual body parts, and you see them all day.

It seems to me, you simply want to blame her right now for something, simply because you dislike her right now. And there is nothing bad about disliking someone, but trying to convince other people to dislike a person as well, and pointing as explanation why we should do so on "the bare shoulder of hell" is not helping you, but in the opposite: It lets you really look bad right now.

False analogy. To lose weight, burn more calories than you eat; to make sure that most of the weight loss is fat and not muscle, base your diet on proteins. This will actually save money because it will enable you to eat less. A fat percentage in the low average range has nothing to do with fashion and media; it's all about how we're programmed from Mother Nature's side.

A surgery to increase a man's height is extremely risky and very expensive. It's not in any way comparable to losing weight. Height is preferable for Darwinian reasons as well, but if a man has everything going for him apart from the fact that he's 5'8", he's not a bad catch; if he's otherwise fairly masculine, it just shows that the testosterone was used for something else than height.

This incredibly risky procedure, is as expensive as this car.



What hypocrisy would that be? I tale care of my looks—and thus, I'd expect a girl to do the same. I'm fairly masculine looking as well—and because of this, I expect a feminine girl. However, since I'm not a perfect ten, I don't expect a girl to be that either and I have never stated that I want a perfect girl. True perfection is imperfect.

meem's photo could be seen as unusual (and I think it's sauna, not shower, at least this what I thought seeing it first time) but I see nothing sexual, seductive or attention seeking in it, not even the facial expression indicates any of this, it's not like she's showing boobs or ass but just face and shoulders .

The casual duckface photos casually seen on fb are way way more attention seeking than this one (if it ever been intended to be for attention but It doesn't look like it).

Tell this to the muslim feminists who aren't opressed and choose to wear a hijab or all the feminists who choose to be right-wing. Let's face it: Margaret Thatcher (I don't agree with how she ruled Great Britain, but that's a different story) was an alpha woman and Andrea Dworkin and her whiny support group were not. Many of the more bitter left-wing feminists aren't particularly fond of the women who actually are strong-willed, independent alpha women—who don't play the victim role and who'd gladly compete against men rather than blame them for everything.

I could walk around 24/7 in a bikini and it wouldn't make me any less of a feminist.

Exactly the hypocrisy that is following in the next sentence. So YOU are now setting the standard, for when someone care for his looks? Why should a woman, that doesnt care for her weight, not care for her looks? Maybe body weight simply is not important for her? Its as if I´d not create the rule "A men that takes care for his look has to paint his nose with pink lipstick." and then start with blaming you, for not caring for your appearance as I do, because of not having pink lipstick on your nose. Next sentence, the same again: "...because I expect a feminine girl..."

I dont know, have we lately agree to making you to the king of the world and giving us your rules for the standard of feminity? Does a woman loose her vagina with overweight? So whats that nonsense with now trying to tell woman with normal weight, that they wouldnt be feminin = woman any more? Even with 500 pounds a woman is feminin, simply because feminin means female and a woman stays female, anyway which weight she has. The usage of the word itself is mindless. And whats your explanation with you being masculine? Thats my cat as well, he has a dick, does that mean he cares for his appearance? ^^

The word that was fitting was "I care really, really much for actual fashion and designs, and I always agree to be the way some fashion-gurus actually tell me to be. And I want my girl to be like that as well."

The complete usage of the words "masculinity" and "feminity" is simply advertisment nonsense. You dont get more male because of your beard having another style. You are either male, female or third gender. But you cant get more or less male, by doing some fashion stuff. Specially when the use of the word gets perverted more and more every day. Every woman is born with hairs on her legs, but according to fashion-gurus I would be more "feminin" if I shave them. Ok, so less looking like a woman, makes me more woman like.... Ok, and next we remove a cat from her claws to make her more "catinin"... ^^

And then you go on with that perfect ten stuff and you not being perfect and so on... In which way? Your character? I mean if you are automatic talking about external appearance when talking about that point nonsense, you should say so, for many people when you talk about your worth as a partner, the last thing they think about is your external appearance.

You seem very self centered for me. When its about fitting standard, without questioning everything has to be acording to your standard. When it comes to fashion, its the same as well. And to make it even worse, you try to tell people, that they would get more or less male or female, only because of not caring for the actual seasons fashion. And when it comes to points nonsense you seem even more weird for me for you writing: "No I dont expect a girl to be perfect (which wouldnt work anyway because noone is perfect.) So at least she is allowed to be an existing human persons, right below a perfect fantasy woman, so I only want to have the elite of the existing women, but I am generously willing not to insist on my phantasy-dream standard of nonexisting perfect girls. ^^

I mean you are self centered, you are trying to manipulate people by telling them to loose their sexual identity, if they dont agree with you on your fashionstuff, but you expect that the best possible existing woman, the nearly perfect ones (perfect ones only exist in dreams), the ones every other guy wants, even social friendly millionaires, as a girlfriend. I wish you best luck, but I personal wouldnt whonder if that will not work. But the thing thats making me mad around here, that those people always start to blame others after a while, when they dont get the nearly perfect woman they want. I really hope you have lots of advantages beside your fashion-tick, because the nearly perfect woman you want, is the ones everyone else also wants and it will not be womans fault, if it wont work.

Have I writtten somewhere, that a feminist has to be naked? Youb simply still dont get it. Feminism is NOT about being a CERTAIN way. That what its against. Because if it was about behaving in acertain way, then you simply would change one kind of social slavery against another. Feminism is simply about accepting yourself the way you are and not to denie yourself to fulfill blindly social expectations. It doesnt mean that every woman has to focus on carriere. It means that IF you have the deed to focus your life on carriere, IF that makes you happier you should do so and accept yourself, and not live a life you dont want because of anyone else telling you. In the opposite, IF you dont feel happy at work and like to focus on family and homework instead, then thats the thing you should do. Simply accept yourself the way you are, as long as noone is harmed by that. And bare shoulder photos are harming noone, so if she wants to post that, its fine as well.

A muslimic feminist does not wear a veil, because someone tells her so, and does not wear no veil because someone tells her so, but simply wears or wears not a veil because of her wanting it to do that way. If YOU want to wear it: Then you act feministic by wearing it. If YOU dont want to wear it: Then you act feministic by not wearing it. There is not rule about it, simply because its about listening to yourself and what you want, not what a rule want. To obey rules, noone would have needed to invent feminism, there were enough already existing. ^^

Evidence, please?

If a woman puts eating unhealthy/too much food over looking good, she doesn't care about her looks.


It is to many potential daters. Obesity stalls fertility, which is why it's seen as unattractive in countries where there's too much food available.



Would pink lipstick make me look more masculine? No.



That's not the point. Estrogen gives you large eyes, a curvy body shape, large breasts and a small nose. This is feminine.

Excess testosterone makes you hairy, gives you bushy eyebrows and a large jaw. This is masculine.



Is a woman defined exclusively by her vagina? That's not a feminist thing to say...

We seek out feminine women because they're more likely to produce a healthy offspring; whether we want children or not, we're programmed to seek out women that are capable of creating strong, fine children.



"Feminine" is an adjective. Zooey Deschanel is more feminine than Andrea Dworkin and Justin Bieber is more feminine than Mariusz Pudsianowski.



Not sure what you mean by this.



I don't give a damn about what fashion gurus say. If I did, I'd dress like an One Direction member or some sparkling vampire. I sport a buzzcut hairstyle (I razor it completely occasionally) that's not gone out of fashion since WWII and wear rather neutral clothes. Testosterone make one care less about what te media thinks.



Masculinity and femininity is about hormones. The media, the fashion industry and Gillete didn't invent those.

I get more male from having a high testosterone level and I look even more male than I am because I also lift heavy and carry more lean mass than oter men with a similar testosterone level. Likewise, I wouldn't mind if a woman looked more feminine than she really was.



No.



You can look more male by dressing in clothes that highlight your muscles and make you look more v-shaped.



You'll look like you have more estrogen and less testosterone in your body—ergo, you'll look more feminine.



False analogy again. Men and women aren't two separate species. The amount of hair on your body is determined by your hormone levels.

Paper with high amounts of bleaching is more white than paper with low amounts of bleaching and women with high estrogen levels are more feminine than women with low levels.



This is naive. Women and men care equally about looks, except in high school where a guy can get laid by being one of the "cool" kids with rich parents and invitations to the coolest parties.



What does fashion have to do with it?



Actually a 5 would do if she had a really nice personality, was smart and didn't expect to mooch of my annual salary.



Since when did I force people to date me?



This is a straw man. I never said that.

I don't want a woman who's unattactive; who does not shave her armpits, does eat like a hippo, does dress like a clown and doesn't have curves and various other feminine attributes. It's a plus if she exercises, but it's not a demand I'm making.

I also expect a girl to be intelligent, as stupid people can be annoying and may pass their stupidity onto further generations.



Guess what? I never did that either!

Last edited by Kurgan on 10 Jun 2013, 10:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

Nobody said that the bikini was sexist or anti feminist (except for a few feminists themselves).

Wow.......I can't believe I managed to skim through this whole thread. A few points. Frankly none of them are very new:

1. Leagues don't exist.
I've seen WAY too many desperate aspie guys fall into this trap over and over again. Coming up with overly symplified reasons for thier failure. Real romantic attraction is so much more complex than that. The more you become slave to a percieved pattern (like the type these PUA guys make to sell books) the more lost you're going to get.

I've had a lot of dating success the past 8 months or so as well as plenty of failure. Most of my success came from openly defying conventional (gender standards) and being more comfortable with myself. Many women (dare I say most) would find me weird, annoying or even creepy but the right subset (usually non-judgemental neo-pagan feminist types but not exclusively) tend to be drawn to me either as romantic possibilities or (gasp) actual platonic friends........

It's not about finding your place in a league. It's about finding your niche. Be comfortable with yourself and the right people will be comfortable with you.

2. Being overweight does not make you ugly.
I have dated overweight women (or women who would be considered overweight based on some BS social standards) and usually my biggest issue with them is not that they are overweight, but that thier self esteem is so low because thier self image is low. Much like the guys on here who can't move past thier low self image and are constantly bitter and resentful because of it (DialA's victimization rants being a great example in this thread.) What they don't realize is that it's this attitude that they let hang over thier head like a cloud makes them unattractive. They can't accept that true beauty is in the eye of the beholder and that they themselves can be beautiful if they just believe it.

I'm slightly overweight, unkempt, neurotic and weird but to the right people, I'm also freaking fabulously awesome.

3. The "friendzone" is an ironic term.I've seen more than enough "Nice Guy TM"s use this term but the irony of it is that they aren't actually friends with these girls. Usually, they say "let's just be friends" as a way to let someone down without actually wanting to be friends for various reasons. Even if they actually mean it, the guy doesn't and he just gets bitter and resentful while pretending to be her friend or moving on because she won't sleep with him. Believe me, there are a ton of advantages to having platonic female friends. Thier worth and character shouldn't be judged based on whether or not they let you touch thier boobies. Which brings me to my next point........

4. Focus on make friends first
By expanding your social circle and building support outside of the romantic realm, you take a lot of undo pressure off of any potential romantic partner as well as expand your potential to meet someone who is compatible with you. My current love interest was unsure about me at first till I invited her to hangout with my group. Soon as she met my friends, she saw how I was around others and began to let her guard down around me. It also helps to have that social support when dealing with dating in general.

5. Most women aren't workout fiends.
The one's that are tend to make up another small niche. If a girl (an attractive gym employee for instance) prefers one night stands with muscular men, that's her preference. She is doing what she wants and gravitating towards her type. Meanwhile the desperate aspie guy is trying to get with her and failing becasue they are jumping into a field they are i'll equiped to compete in.

If you don't wish to be judged by shallow standards, stop going after shallow women. There is nothing wrong with being healthy for the right reasons. Picking up women isn't a good one though and superficial changes aren't going to make as big of a difference as you think.

Honestly, being muscular is far more likely to get you laid if you're after gay guys.

6. Cover Up, Meems!
My god we can see your shoulders. What is this, "Girls gone wild?"

^^So you're saying leagues don't exist, and yet there are shallow people out there and you are condoning their behavior, and at the same time you're telling others that they are awful for not wanting to be friends with people who have rejected them. Your post is full of double standards.

And again you are the king of the world, telling us what looks good. You didnt understand anything. When a woman dares not to care what you, the king of the world like in fashion ways, she is automatic not caring for her body? If you dont have long hair, you are also not caring for your body, because I am now the queen of the world and I like long hair. I AM NOW QUEEN OF THE WORLD, SO YOU ONLY CARE FOR YOUR BODY, WHEN YOU ARE OBEYING THE STANDARDS I SET AND I WANT LONG HAIR. ^^

Sorry, but you are simply arrogant, when thinking that 8 billion people have to set their personal standards for "caring for him/herself" according to what fashion you are in right now. If a person cares for her body, then she cares for her body. Only because a person dont care for what YOU care for, doesnt mean that a person wouldnt care for herself. What you do is the same as I did in the example: I try to manipulate you, by telling you, you were not caring for you, only because not caring for my personal long hair favory. Is that true? Are you really not caring for your body, only because not caring that I like long metal hair? Is the fact that I like long hair, in any way influencing the time you spend on your body? No...so anyway if I like it or not, if you care for your body, you care for your body. It doesnt depend on fitting MY standards. As it doesnt depend on fitting your standards. Only because of you not caring for my long hair stuff, it doesnt make you not caring for yourself. And only because a woman doesnt care for your slimstuff, that doesnt make a woman not caring for her body as well.

It only makes you looking manipulative.

Ok, but thats the problem of the potential daters and one that you can simply choose to have or not. So why should a woman care for a problem a men has, that he want to have? "Because you decided on purpose to have problems with woman that listen to their doctors, I shall now do dumb diets, because you dont find a partner after choosing yourself to create that problems?" I mean no man is forced to agree with "many". Its still your own desicion to agree with what others say or not, you are no slave. If you like to have problems, its ok, but to try to manipulate people because of you likeing to create your own problems, is really weird. Its as if I´d say, I only like boys without ears, the others with ears are ugly, and then demand that because of me creating that problem on my own, that all these guys that dont care for themselves and dont cut off their ears and so are so horrible ugly, dont care that I am only interested in boys that care as much for their body as I do.



Either you answer a question, or dont quote it, but answering questions that were not asked, to trying to be manipulative, is not working in a written forum. The topic my quote was about, was "caring for appearance". If you can set up rules without any explanation and blame people for "not caring" when they dont obey your personal rules, you dont explain either, then I can do the same. So are you not caring for your body, only because of not acting according to a rule, that is only based on my personal likings?

Again you are trying to change topic. You said you dont want a girl with overweight, because you want an feminin one. So where is the weight related answer? Beside the big breasts you mention that are highly related to your weight, and only minor to hormones? If you thought that these tiny little girls with huge breasts, have so big breasts because of them having so much hormones, better google for the word breast-enlargement. Slim woman have natural slim breasts, Keira Knightly, Natalie Portman and Mila Jovovich, that had no breast enlargement to fulfill the insane expectation on an society, that thinks that you can tell a body to remove every fat cell but magically, the breast shall double the amount of breast cells, are looking like normal woman their weight looks like. If you dont want fat, then say farewell to big breasts. And where have you got that nonsense from the eyes from? Would be pretty weird, if the eye sized would change, whenever you are pregnant. What you are talking about are make up products, and they are not bound to hormones.

Why should it be unfeminist to say that women have vaginas? ^^ What comes next, am I not allowed to say, that the average human has 10 fingers? ^^ Again the same: How is this answer refering to overweight? So is fat "unfeminine" according to the lifestyle way you use the world? I dont understand, because 2 comments above you wrote that the more a woman would look like according her hormones, the more feminin she is. The estrogen you mentioned is responsible for women having naturally a higher body fat percentage. The female hormones WANTS to keep fat around the hips and the legs. This is absolutely natural and the body does that because it is useful to produce healthy off springs, its not simply a fashion-gag, because Darwins law isnt interested in fashion. So first you explain, that its not some dumb fashion nonsense that you personal want a slim woman, but a natural biologic process caused by the female hormones, then again a woman shall not look like her hormones naturally want her to be...


No, "feminine" is a word with an exact definition. It means female. You can easily create with some crazy fashion addicts some new meanings to existing words, so if you want we can call a Burger now a table and a swimmingpool a sheep, but it still depends on every person on its own and not on you and some fashion magazines, if we agree with your new meanings inventions. I dont agree, because I hardly can imagine something more stupid then thinking about if Justin Bieber, that is a man, is more or less female (which he isnt in any way) then another man (that is also a man ^^) is female. A MAN IS NOT FEMALE SO TALKING ABOUT A MAN BEING MORE OR LESS FEMALE IS SIMPLY STUPID!

A dick is the thing that is hanging in front of your balls.

So you lied to me? You wrote about so much caring for your appearance, and then you write yourself, that you razor them. So as a good looking men, most females expect to have long hair as the bounty men in the commercial has. So why do you tell us, you would care for yourself, when you dont do that? Dont you know that thick long hair is a sign of youth and healthy?



My hormones CAUSE my leghair to grow. If my leghair suddenly stopped producing hairs, then my hormones would be totally in the ass and I was forced to go to a doctor. So its definitly not in any way linked to my hormones and I can refer to 4.000.000.000 women that will tell you the same. Sure, and painting fingernails, which is according to fashion addicts also feminin in the wrong usage of the term, is also caused by hormones. Better get to the doctor fast, there seems to be something wrong with my hormones, mine never had the idea to produce deep red acryl nails. O_o Oh and I also never knew, that my hormones should create eyeshadow in three different colours, causing "smoky eyes" effect. And my feet always seem to have a problem, so my doctor never mentioned any problems, but if the usage of the word "feminity" is not completly dumb but describing a natural hormon process, when exactly should I get the oh so feminin high heels at my leg? So puberty has already gone, and the stuff with the hair between the legs and the boobs functioned pretty well, but there are still no oh so feminin high heels growing on my feet.

[quoteI get more male from having a high testosterone level and I look even more male than I am because I also lift heavy and carry more lean mass than oter men with a similar testosterone level. Likewise, I wouldn't mind if a woman looked more feminine than she really was.

[/quote]
You are either male, female or third gender.[/quote]

No.[/quote]

Oh, did the "Maleometer" tell you that in the fitness room. o according to the Maleometer, how much maleness to you have right now? And in which unit is it physically measured? I mean if you can have more or less maleness, then there must be a unit to it. Is it Maleonewton? Or maleopound? Or are there different measurements in Europe and the US, so , millimaleos, centimaleos, dezimaleos in europe and in the US you have maleopounds and maleounces?

So you want her to be so good looking, which costs much money because your hormon theory is sadly completely nonsense, but she shall afford all that nonsense that you want on her own, but in the opposite she shall be smart... ^^ Or we go back to your "feminity is based on estrogen and more estrogen and less testosteron makes a woman sexy"-theory, which means you want a woman with high estrogen levels which means higher body fat, water inlays in the body, swollen feet, dry "sensitive skin" ^^, lower sex drive, long and strong menstruations, problems with REM sleep and cancer. And you say it was a plus if she exercises, which would rise her testosteron levels to rise, which you dont like according to another statement of you, because of it strengthening the skin texture, and so preventing hanging asses which is according to you very non feminity, because of being caused by testosteron, which is bad for the feminity of a woman. I am happy, that you dont need to see mine, so sadly I have normal testosteron levels, and my ass is pretty tight, because of that, but maybe after some pregnancies I will manage to have a more feminin backside and not any longer that testosteron caused tight ass. XD

I'm not calling anybody awful......... Which sends me back to the whole victimization thing. Taking a disagreement and reacting like it's a personal attack........ kinda like being rejected by a girl and taking it as an insult.

I am however, implying a large amount of misguided hypocrisy. If someone is going to judge others based on shallow criteria (whether it be physical appearance, how many people they've slept with or how they dress in a profile picture) they shouldn't be surprised (or insulted) when others do it to them. For the socially awkwards like ourselves, true success in dating happens when they reject those standards.

Most guys and girls (regardless of neurology) aren't cut out for one-night stands just as there are others that aren't cut out for serious relationships. Everyone has a different set of standards and what may fit someones "personal league" likely won't fit someone elses. Trying to force compatibility and attraction will only backfire.

I agree with all your points Geeko (yes, a lot of guys find overweight girls very beautiful, ask Tequilla, I simply don't for the very overweight) except point 1; leagues exist everywhere and in all social interactions, not just in romance, but that's another thread.

I'm not gonna dignify meems with any more responses, in fact I didn't even look at her reply to my post because I figured it was more vitriol blaming me, but I will kindly ask you to keep my name out of your posts. You don't know what I'm like in real life. To give you an idea, nobody in real life really knows that I have self-esteem problems. I don't walk around with a cloud above my head, quite the opposite in fact. People are always surprised to find out the stuff I've been through, because to most people I appear to be happy. Even my coworker told me a couple days ago, "man, you are never in a bad mood, even with all the stuff that happens to you!" Walking with a cloud over my head indeed. I see you still love to project.

I've already told you and meems and every other brick wall what my problem was. People don't look past my exterior. I'm a 5'9" super lanky man with a long, horse-ish face and messed up teeth, who talks with a slur that puts Rocky Balboa's to shame. For imagination's sake, on my looks, imagine Michael Jackson (the version from when he first started getting surgery) + Lionel Richie + Eazy-E + an underbite and a really skinny but oddly toned body. This outward appearance scares the crap out of people like you wouldn't even believe. For example, I managed to scare a little kid at my store by simply just smiling at her. It was a smile that came straight from the heart too. She was a cute little kid. So I gave her some stickers (it's part of our company policy to give stickers with our logo to kids) and smiled, and she ran away screaming. Now imagine that happening, not really running away and screaming, but hostile looks and "creep glares" as I like to call them, at least 10 times a day (mostly with people my age), and you have my situation in a nutshell. If I manage to scare little kids, who normally aren't that afraid of anything other than the Boogeyman, you can imagine how much my appearance scares people my age and older as well.

And again, there's a sizable discord between being told that I'm great and should have a girlfriend, and why the f**k don't I have a girlfriend and being turned down because of how I look outside.

Christ, if you're not willing to just admit that simply being comfortable with yourself isn't the way to go, why the hell am I even wasting time replying to you? While I am, mind kindly telling me WTF my niche is? Even the girls who are in my situation want men who are 9 or 10 on the looks scale. Even the girls that for some stupid ret*d reason most guys don't want either treat me as just as emotional punching bag or a creep. If I have a so-called "victimization complex" then I have one for a damn good reason.