I'm probably in the minority of Aspies to be like this...

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I am 31, and I am from Bossier City, LA. I was diagnosed with Asperger's in the early to mid 2000s, but I really have never done much research into how to deal with it up until the last few days, and I've really been in somewhat of a denial for years that I have it. Pretty much all of the friends I've made over the years are neurotypical, and I have been afraid for all these years to explain them my Asperger's diagnosis, because I am afraid of how they will react. I'm sure it may be obvious to some of these people who know of these traits in people that I have it.

However, I just read that most Aspies are afraid to hug, kiss, and show affection, or don't really understand it. For most of my life, ever since around the eighth grade, though I've been able to control it better over the past five years, I've been just the opposite. For about a year prior to the eighth grade, after several years of severe bullying, which began my depression I still suffer from, I was apprehensive to the women in my junior high who would force hugs onto me to mess with me (and even one girl would occasionally kiss me), but by the eighth grade, I suddenly began to be very forward. This one girl who was neurotypical would give me a hug every day at the beginning of class, which I began to go along with, and before long, I would try to kiss her on the cheek, and she would turn away, and say "Ewww!". However, I eventually began coming up from behind and kissing her on the cheek, which caused some concern, and that was the beginning of me getting really affectionate toward women.

However, my depression turned into anger, and I did some really bad things in my freshman year of high school, after years prior to the eighth grade of doing pretty much the right thing in school, and I got expelled for some threats I made, which I did right after Columbine. My reputation was basically ruined at that school when I went back after attending an alternative school, and even after I returned, I still had some issues with showing affection toward some women and making them feel uncomfortable, though I toned it down by my senior year.

However, I was hooked up with a date at my Homecoming my senior year who shared the same exact birthday as me, coincidentally, by a girl who was "wishy-washy", and even though this girl I dated had many issues of her own from what I've heard, I made my share of mistakes, which I feel were due to my inexperience with dating and my Asperger's (and also likely due to some of the things the wishy-washy girl who hooked us up was telling my date behind my back, according to my date). I did give her a hug toward the end when she was beginning to have concerns about our date, but that only happened because I was coaxed into doing so by the wsihy-washy girl who hooked us up after she told me my date was unhappy with me, even after I tried to ask her what was wrong. I really wasn't sure what to do in a situation like this. Then my date went off on me. I was devastated. As you'd probably expect, I didn't end up getting a date to Prom later that year.

I was really upset by how incredibly bad my senior year of high school was well into my adulthood, and I was a lot more focused than I should have been on trying to find love in my life. I would also get extremely depressed when I was turned down by a girl on a dating site or in public, which was all the time, basically, and I was extremely miserable. I had social issues in college, mostly at the beginning and when I dropped out in 2006, and some of the issues I had found myself in with women caused me to give up on college, and lose my grant.

I found a girlfriend in 2008 when I was 22, who was, as far as I know, neurotypical. I took it slow, not hugging or kissing her, for the first couple days, and then suddenly, she wanted to spend the night with me (I thought my mother, who also has a mental illness, though not Asperger's) was going to kill me, then suddenly, we were going all the way. (Sorry if that's too much information). However, though she sounded like she wanted to be with me a long time originally, I made a few mistakes starting about two weeks into it. The first of which, I really stupidly wanted my girlfriend to meet my best female friend from high school, and I said something when they met that made my girlfriend think I had feelings for her. I referred to her has the "Perfect Diva", which was more of a variation of a nickname I had for her a while before that in circles of friends, and my girlfriend suddenly started crying when the two of us were in bed that night about that, and the fact that I had brought a camera to the bar and was taking pictures of everyone, including my best high school friend. I did a couple of other off-color things in the coming weeks that weren't the kind of things that would make her think I liked someone else more than her, but were more of kind of offensive and insulting, though I was meaning them more, in my mind, as a joke, in an era when some other people played jokes like that on me. Then the third week, she told me she needed someone more like her, and who had more self-esteem. I was so devastated, and really felt like I blew an opportunity.

I really continued to try too hard to find love, including joining a college church group in 2009 not to worship God, but to find love. That ended up resulting in a really bad incident in 2010 at a local outlet mall with this girl when I had a conversation with a girl I met from my church group that I had, at one time at the church group, tried to tell how I wanted to date her that I did a horrible job of out of nervousness, who was working at a place in this outlet mall. While there was nothing in out conversation I said that should have been an issue to anyone that day at the outlet mall, I was really caught off-guard about 20 minutes later by some security of the outlet mall who said some very hurtful, ridiculous things to me about the situation with the girl, such as making a big deal about things that the girl claimed I was doing at the church group to make her and her friends feel unconfortable, and claiming I was banned from the outlet mall, and escorting me out. I ended up overdosing after this when I got home, and spending a week in the hospital. As gullible as I was at the time, I was really depressed, and worried I was charged with something in this. However, I found out from some people I trust, such as a cop I am friends with, that this incident was obviously a scare tactic, and I'm not banned from this outlet mall. However, I've had no interest in giving them my business in the seven years since this has happened. This incident was the day I really began being conscious, for the most part, about not being as affectionate toward women, unless I know them well, and know they don't mind a hug.

I was really depressed from 2010-12 after the Outlet Mall incident, and I got out and did little. I went back to college in 2010, but I was too open about my issues that I couldn't figure out how to deal with, particularly the outlet mall incident, and as confused as I was at the time, I tried to talk about it with fellow students and people, trying to feel better about the incident in some way, so I could put it behind me. However, nobody seemed to really give me the advice that would make me feel better, not even the college counselor. I dropped out of college in 2011, because I just didn't feel confident about being back in society.

I did very little out in public in 2011, then in 2012, I began to do more, but a lot of women who suddenly quit talking to me on dating sites got me really depressed that year, and then in September 2012, my vehicle died. I was really depressed after that, but then I got help on my own accord, and I began to bounce back. I got on the right medicine, and my family eventually got a new car, and I feel I've been more stable socially ever since I got help. In 2013, I went to my 10-Year Reunion, and had no problems with anyone then that anyone complained about. I didn't bring a camera, I didn't even give hardly any hugs to women (except a couple friends I've been quite close with), and it appears I was accepted very well at the Reunion, which put an end to my angst about how my high school years went. I had some very happy years from 2012-15, but I didn't end up being allowed to get out in our car after April 2014, due to reasons that were out of my control that had nothing to do with anything I did, and I've had some really bad breaks that were also out of my control since July 2016. Now I have no money, and I've accepted I'm really not in a position to have a relationship. However, times have gotten tougher over the past month due to my mother having an illness, and I'm beginning to suffer from depression again.

I feel like I don't have much of a future, since so many jobs are resistant to hire Aspies, as well as few opportunities here in Louisiana, and as far as relationships go, I feel like no potential partners without Asperger's can understand me, and I'm worried that most of the ones that do have Asperger's are going to be freaked out by how affectionate I can get early on in a relationship if I were to feel a relationship is blossoming.

I'm really sorry to type this long of a message, everyone. I didn't expect it to get this long.

Ok, a couple of things here...

First off, I don't much see the point of advertising your AS. Some here might disagree with me, and that's ok with me if they do. I think that an AS diagnosis simply helps you understand what's going on with you and possibly point the way to coping with it. It's also useful for parents in understanding their kids. I've noticed a trend among NT women to be especially contemptuous towards adult AS men. There is some merit to that, unfortunately. But, see, if you've managed to have had a sexual relationship and a gf for any length of time, you're probably ahead of the curve, especially by WP standards. Use your AS diagnoses as a way to understand yourself, not as a means of identification. Don't allow it to define you if you're already doing ok.

Next up...

Meeting girls at church. Absolutely NOTHING wrong with that. AT ALL. I'm a church-goer. Heck, I'm on staff. Oh, and yeah, I'm an actual BELIEVER and used to practice my mad apologetics skeelz on PPR right here at WP until I got bored with it. For our purposes here, I'm not JUST a church person. I'm a church SURVIVOR. Lemme clue you in on us Christians. We are flawed human beings, just like non-believers. Just like everyone. Some of us are only nominal Christians no more saved than those we say are "lost." We all need Christ, and I'd rather see lost, mean, bully nominal Christians IN church than not so at LEAST they might have a personal experience with the Holy Spirit in corporate worship and come to a saving faith through Jesus. And because we often allow these backwards people in our doors, they often bring their bad behavior with them. And that means you get holier-than-thou, self-righteous cliques and the rivalries that go with them. Smart leaders put these people to work on "committees" so they don't disrupt the greater church community, but they can be destructive in other ways. Like I said, I'm a SURVIVOR. I thrive in the eye of the storm, a quiet observer of turbulence and tumult always surrounding me. Maybe I'll tell my story another time. I've had tough times before. Last year was TENSE. This year is even worse. Yet I manage to navigate the storm and stay clear of the crap. What happened to you is merely an extension of that. I'm not the first to get burned and have to learn the hard way how to keep safe and aloof. You won't be the last. I'd advise you to either go back to that church and wait it out, or find a new church and be a bit more on guard. Surviving church cliques is a learnable skill. Get busy.

About that outlet mall incident:

This is connected to that church thing. The problem is really simple. You struggle at appropriate behavior. Easy fix. Observe others' behavior. Identify what works and what doesn't. Integrate what you learn into your own behaviors. You already have a lot of natural ability in the short term. You have to discipline yourself to stay consistent day-to-day. Find what people want to talk about, ask about those things, focus always on them, NEVER about what YOU like or YOUR interests. Once they become interested in you, feel free to open up A LITTLE. Fall back on that person as early as possible.

Story time: I just joined the YMCA last week. I want to complete triathlons and am ready to start training even though I'm at least two years out from even considering running a sprint. So I'm working out cardio on an arc trainer when my former supervisor steps up to the machine next to me. Naturally she asked about my kids and how my non-credit teaching is going. I sadly informed her that I'd quit that job due to lack of interest. I didn't bother complaining about the non-credit program and how I was treated prior to quitting. But I also made sure to spin that as a positive by pointing out now I have more time to teach high school and pursue other interests in the evening. I immediately bounced the convo back by asking about her summer. She filled me in on her vacation plans, so I pressed for more and more details. I mean, here I am, socially awkward, in the circuit room of all places, at the top of my target heart rate, having a casual conversation with a nice woman for over half an hour! Pouring sweat, smelling like a pig, almost wheezing, and carrying on a convo!! ! All before heading out to swim laps in the pool, my blinding-white belly hanging out of my trunks while I walk by attractive women in 2-pieces. They're prolly talking about the new creeper at the Y, but I can't care about that right now. I've got 10k's to train for and my cardio is STILL sh¡+.

My point is, you can't get bogged down in all that crap. So you lost the battle. As the MoI (almost) famously put it, "Keep Calm, and Carry On." I cannot be bothered by the Y snobs. Don't get bothered by those church snobs. Assess your offputting behavior. Correct it. My swimming is crap. Can't master the front crawl stroke, can't side-breathe, can't break myself of holding my breath, always end up hyperventilating, and I kick too much. So I watch YouTube videos and read blogs to figure out what the heck I'm missing. I can go 50 yards in just over 2 minutes with a brief rest halfway. Must. Keep. Improving. Now you must do the same. What are the problems? How can you fix them?

Car/job:

This is about independence, of which you are lacking it seems. You don't need me to tell you to get temporary transportation, a job, and an affordable beater at the first opportunity, and an emergency fund IMMEDIATELY after that. What I prolly SHOULD suggest is that you not publically disclose or identify as an aspie. I don't believe AS defines you like that. Therefore, it's none of any potential employer's business. Get to know firsthand as many employees as you can at every venue you do regular business with, then send in applications, resumés, CV's, or whatever is appropriate. Get busy. Get independent. You can do this.

Now for my final thoughts:

Revamp your strategy for meeting girls. Focus on casual relationships and acquaintances. Start at 0 and slowly begin to move the needle towards romance. Do NOT skip steps. Get to know as many girls as you can. Keep a diary (do NOT advertise this, it appears creepy. Keep this hidden and secret). Names, contact info, physical description, and key interests. Write down highlights of conversations so you'll remember where to pick up from last time. Try to meet an average of two new girls a week that you might have regular contact with. You'll have a dating pool of 100 girls within a year this way. Use what you know about interests to get to know girls better. Invite them to lunch after 2 or 3 conversations. Become aware of events or businesses that deal with those interests and invite them to an evening event that matches. She likes rollerskating? Take her to the rink. She liked art? Museum. Bike riding? Trail or bike-friendly park. Animals/nature? Zoo. Literature? Book signings. The emphasis here is on activities that facillitate interaction. No movies. Symphonies/operas/ballets sound like a romantic night out and are nice, but they don't really help. Dinner is ALWAYS good, just make sure you know what she likes. I strongly suggest you PERSONALLY scout out eating establishments BEFORE a date, oops, I mean "get-together" so you know she won't be disappointed. Even better if you go with something she mentions in casual conversation. However, don't let food be the only activity. Always have a plan and be flexible.

If anyone asks, you're just hanging out "as friends." Nothing serious. What you will find is a choice few women tend to be up for spending time with you more than others. Time to step it up. Narrow your pool to 3 women. After more/less 4 weeks, it's going to be obvious out of those 3 who you have the best chemistry with. Go exclusive with her. She's now your gf. If things don't work out, go to #2 on your list. Fail? Go to #3. Still a no-go? Start completely over.

Go back to your big list. By now you know who isn't interested, who you're not feeling it with, who the creeps, weirdos, and psychotics are. Eliminate those along with #1-3, start meeting new women. Repeat the process.

The trick to this working is never mention the word "date." Don't mention the word "girlfriend." This strategy will succeed because you allow relationships to "just happen" without obsessing over terminology. When you are exclusive gf/bf, it'll be obvious. She probably won't even know how she got to be your gf unless she became interested in you earlier on and purposefully pushed the two of you in that direction. NEVER fight that unless she's a creep or she's psychotic. Once you allow insanity in, she's extremelt difficult to dislodge. Nip that in the bud QUICK and avoid her like the plague. Whatever you do, do NOT laser-sight one single girl as your immediate gf. It doesn't work the best that way. A lot of people do this, but I don't see it as healthy. Just let it happen in its own time and things will end up for the best.

Good luck out there! And don't worry, you aren't alone with writing long posts!

Thank you so much for the advice, AngelRho...I began to feel after I posted this that I might have told the board more information about myself than all of you needed to know, and that a lot of you were turned off by my post, and I was about to take it down.

I agree that I probably would make a huge mistake by advertising my AS, which is why I've been apprehensive to do it even in my most confused of times after learning my diagnosis. Actually, a couple days ago, during the midst of trying to cope with how tough the last couple weeks have been since my mother was hospitalized, and then having to take care of her, I went with my father to visit a friend of his, who has a son who I went to school with, and I found myself trying to find a coping mechanism with my issues by telling his son "just how good he has it" that he can actually make a job work unlike me, and he became likely the first person ever from my high school days who I came clean about my Asperger's Syndrome diagnosis to. He told me he's had four jobs, and he hated them all. My father, when I mentioned what I said to him a little later kind of criticized me for that, telling me how my friend's girlfriend just left him. As for why I did that, that's just the mode I've always gotten in when a time comes in my life when I start digging a hole for myself when things start blowing up in my face, and I'm not sure what to do. I'll start taking just about any opportunity that I see coming my way to try to find some sort of way to do something I feel might help me cope (such as trying to convince someone to look at the positives of their situation), and hoping it will do some good for me knowing that I did a good deed. But I just feel that all this stress, as well as an issue currently with one of my medications that I'm not sure I should get into at this time, are causing a problem with my decision making.

As for church groups, I'm really unsure as to whether I should ever get involved with one again, though I'm more open to finding a church. I did have one person who has been a good, understanding friend on the message board of my favorite music group, the Oak Ridge Boys, tell me when I told him via e-mail in 2015, three years after I got to meet him and I felt comfortable enough telling him this story, the outlet mall incident story (which I told in a lot more detail than my summary on this page), and he told me, along with his explanation of how he agreed with my other friends on all of the lies that were told that day by security, that one of my biggest mistakes in the incident was joining a church group, though he didn't explain in much detail why he feels that church groups are such dangerous places. About a year later, a guy from the church group who I barely remembered talking to kept wanting to do some stuff with me, and I really didn't feel comfortable, since I really didn't have the cold heart to tell him bluntly I didn't want anything to do with anyone from the church group after the outlet mall incident, and after what my friend from the Oak Ridge Boys board told me about church groups. My explanation for not doing that was that "my mother didn't think it was a good idea", which was basically some of the truth when I asked for her (and my father by phone) opinion, but even THAT was something he told me a few days later he was offended by, considering that my mother and him "never even met". I guess you can't please everyone in life.

I never told any of the jobs I applied for that I was an aspie, but I tend to think they could tell that by some of my vibes. It didn't help that I really couldn't adapt well to either of my jobs. But employment sounds like it is worth another shot.

The relationship advicet mostly sounds like great advice and I will take that advice one day if I can ever get to a point where I can date again, but the only thing I'm not sure I agree with is inviting them to lunch after 2-3 conversations. With all the women who quit talking to me suddenly or cancelled on me back in the years I was dating, I'm not quite convinced that 2-3 conversations is enough. I feel more inclined to talk to a woman for longer, but there have just been so many women who just quit talking to me right away for whatever reason, which might be my forwardness, or something else I admit to that turns them off, or Lord knows what, I really don't even know if THAT would be the best solution.

I need to add these important points to previous post:

When keeping a dating diary and meeting new women, brief physical descriptions are a must. If you remember nothing else, you ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO REMEMBER EYE COLOR. If you ever can't remember while you're with her, look at her eyes again as a reminder. If eye color changes with clothing or ambient lighting, make a note of that. ALWAYS notice her eyes. This isn't a conversation thing, so don't bring up the fact you're studying her eyes. Don't obsess over it. I'm just saying look at her eyes enough to remember how they look. This is an ESSENTIAL exercise in dating. If you can't remember eye color, things will very likely fall apart early on. You MUST notice these things or you will certainly fail.

The other thing is about self-disclosure and getting a job. Having AS is NOTHING TO BE ASHAMED OF, and I'm afraid my previous statement about that might be misleading. What I meant earlier was that when it comes to dating or getting a job, they are all on a need-to-know basis. It shouldn't make any difference in getting a job. So why does a prospective employer need to know that? If that info stands in the way of getting a job, then simply don't mention it. AS is most important to those closest to you, such as close friends who you can trust to tell you what you said is inappropriate or that you come across as an @$$hole. We need good people who can help us. If you've been dating the same girl for, say, 6 months and you're on the verge of a meltdown, a brief mention of having AS and the need for quiet/alone time is just fine because she probably won't dump you for that. Also, by that point you might be talking marriage. So then you discuss that, tell her you'll need her help and ask if that's a dealbreaker. You aren't using AS as an excuse. You will make every effort to be a great husband. She likely won't care. But she deserves to be informed and to understand what being married to you will be like. If that's a dealbreaker, then end the conversation by suggesting you sleep on it and talk about it another time.

That's when you invite her out to a nice, fun-filled day at the zoo. Have her sit with you on a bench preferably close to an ice-cream stand somewhere around the tigers or the giraffe. As you wrap up your cold treat, subtly bring that conversation up. Tell her you love her and had really hoped things would work out. But because AS is a problem for her, hopefully she sees that there's no future in this relationship moving forward. You hope you can still be friends, and remind her how much the relationship meant to you both and how great things were. She will make an amazing gf and wife for some lucky man out there...just not you. Then you'll take her home, optional good-bye kiss, and she's somebody else's problem.

My point is that there is a time and place to disclose your diagnosis. Close friends, anyone you might lean on to help with socializing or learning skills you need before applying for a job. Employers are not supposed to discriminate based on disability from what I understand (someone correct me here), so there's no reason to disclose. Anything that might make you look like an entitled pain to an employer when you're not is unnecessary in the interview.

It would be no different if an employer asked me if I'm gay (I'm not, fyi). What does it matter? I work for a religious institution. 2, actually. So they want to know if my lifestyle is consistent with their faith (it is). So a possible answer might be, "I'm not attracted to women and I believe acting on a certain orientation is contradictory to faith. If you're asking if that will be a problem working for you, I assure you it is not."

If any other employer asked me that, even though I'm straight, married with 3 kids that DNA tests show are mine, I'd walk out of the interview, full stop. And I might even consider filing a lawsuit just on principle.

Back to AS, why is it important? It's nothing to be ashamed of. You can decide whether to disclose or not. Just be mindful of whether such a disclosure is relevant or might do you more harm than good. There's a time and place for everything. Why does an employer need to know this? If no reason, don't bother disclosing.

A better question for an employer would be whether there are any special accommodations you need to do your job. You still don't have to disclose a diagnosis. But you CAN say you need this or that to do good work. I'd say if that comes up, it probably means they want to hire you. That or they really aren't turning anyone away. So always be mindful of the subtext before outing yourself on things that really aren't all that important.

Interesting thread.

People feel differently about physical contact. I like it. I might appear startled if someone hugs me unexpectedly, even if I feel happy that they decided to do so.

Having a job and a car signifies a certain level of responsibility. I had to have a car to get my current job, even though I'll rarely drive far to do the job.

Rho, your plan sounds very practical. Also, expensive. It sounds like a lot of work, but you are talking about finding someone to partner up for the rest of your lives, so it merits that much investment. I should put so much effort into finding my next, better, job.

I, too, like to show affection towards people, but only to those I like. I really enjoy hugging, kissing and any other kind of physical contact, but only if I like the person and have a reason to have physical contact with them. So, does that put me in the minority of Aspies?

I guess I'm a typical Aspie then. Even as a child I did not like being touched. I think most of it comes down to sensory issues but for some reason I tend to get scared off even if people become verbally affectionate.
I handle friendships better now but I use to feel uncomfortable even if someone referred to me as their "friend"
Not that I have many friends.

Before I respond to rdos's post, I did add some more thorough to my response to idonthaveanickname a couple posts up, to better explain my habits on affection to the board.