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More Thought on Incels.

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ironpony
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11 Aug 2021, 8:39 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
There's no such person as an incel (lowercase) woman. Hence, Incel (uppercase) communities for women don't exist. A woman can get sex with a little more than a snap of her fingers: going to a bar, waiting to be approached, and saying yes. That's it!

And even incel women are still attracted to only the top 20% of men. It's evolutionary biology, no more, no less. It's literally impossible for them to desire the bottom 80% of men. Therefore, incel men are basically SOL, unless they turn to escort services like I did. I'm pretty sure the escorts I sexed found me disgusting. But they did a good job of putting up a facade of liking me, and they were good sports about my sexual quirks (like the way I French kissed them). So hey, I ain't complaining.


This may be true when it comes to relationships but if it's just hooking up, there are plenty of women women who will go for men in their league, even if it's a low league though, if it's just sex.



kraftiekortie
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11 Aug 2021, 8:39 pm

I’m not in the top 20% of men…maybe not even in the top 50%—yet, I’ve been successful, and lost my virginity at 17.



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11 Aug 2021, 8:53 pm

ironpony wrote:
Aspie1 wrote:
This may be true when it comes to relationships but if it's just hooking up, there are plenty of women women who will go for men in their league, even if it's a low league though, if it's just sex.
I think the opposite is true. Women are willing to go down a step or two for a relationship, provided that an undesirable man can give them a stable material lifestyle they want. But for casual sex, women want only the topmost attractive men.



Last edited by Aspie1 on 11 Aug 2021, 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ironpony
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11 Aug 2021, 8:55 pm

Oh okay, but I know women who have FWBs that are average looking though, so doesn't that disprove that theory then though?



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11 Aug 2021, 8:56 pm

Fnord wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Aspie1 wrote:
There's no such person as an incel (lowercase) woman. Hence, Incel (uppercase) communities for women don't exist. A woman can get sex with a little more than a snap of her fingers: going to a bar, waiting to be approached, and saying yes. That's it!
And yet femcels exist, which throws your hypothesis that women can always find a partner into question.
You can ignore him, because any claims he presents without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.


I know I can ignore posts, but I can't ignore posts and push-back simultaneously against the uninformed, demonstrably false and sexist notion that only men (or only straight men) struggle romantically.


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funeralxempire
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11 Aug 2021, 8:57 pm

ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I know women who have FWBs that are average looking though, so doesn't that disprove that theory then though?


Yes, you're looking at the reality you've witnessed instead of just repeating talking points that don't withstand scrutiny.


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ironpony
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11 Aug 2021, 8:59 pm

But if I witnessed an alternate reality, isn't that worth looking into, for incel men if they want to get laid?



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12 Aug 2021, 1:51 am

funeralxempire wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I know women who have FWBs that are average looking though, so doesn't that disprove that theory then though?


Yes, you're looking at the reality you've witnessed instead of just repeating talking points that don't withstand scrutiny.


We're not talking a studly hunk vs. the Elephant man. Those are two extremes.

In sexual selection, there is indeed a fine line between average and ugly. As a heterosexual man, you may look at two other men and think they both look "average," or even ugly, even though one has normal success with women and the other struggles miserably. Women are the choosers. As a man, you can't rely on your perceptions of how good looking you think other men are.

I didn't think Elliot Roger was particularly bad looking, but it's not up to me to decide. If the majority of women find him below average or ugly, our male perceptions of his looks is meaningless in his sexual success.

So, whenever a man says, "I see ugly men do X, and average men do Y," realize your perception of male attractiveness, of what you think constitutes average and ugly in your fellow man, does NOT equate to a woman's perception.



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12 Aug 2021, 2:05 am

funeralxempire wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
just as a public service, i must announce that no female out there will "screw just about anything." i am living proof. now there are many men that WILL screw just about anything, ambulatory or not, given the chance.


Don't femcels dispell that notion?

from what you just made me read and study about, i would guess they are precisely not the ones that would screw anybody, given the fact of my point above. they have standards, but i don't begrudge them that, they have a lot more riding on it than men do.


I'm not saying femcels would screw anyone, I'm saying the fact that they exist means apparently there's women who also run into the issue of no takers, so the notion that guys will f**k anything warm isn't true.

if they did NOT have standards, more men would consort with them. i saw this in the army when i was in, there were many jokes therein about the standards-suspending utility of mood-altering substances i won't repeat here. needless to say, there were women soldiers who wore "birth control glasses" [another army joke not transparent to civilians] who were still getting plenty of male attention. the only ones who were not, were lesbians, there were a fair number.



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12 Aug 2021, 9:23 am

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I know women who have FWBs that are average looking though, so doesn't that disprove that theory then though?


Yes, you're looking at the reality you've witnessed instead of just repeating talking points that don't withstand scrutiny.


We're not talking a studly hunk vs. the Elephant man. Those are two extremes.

In sexual selection, there is indeed a fine line between average and ugly. As a heterosexual man, you may look at two other men and think they both look "average," or even ugly, even though one has normal success with women and the other struggles miserably. Women are the choosers. As a man, you can't rely on your perceptions of how good looking you think other men are.

I didn't think Elliot Roger was particularly bad looking, but it's not up to me to decide. If the majority of women find him below average or ugly, our male perceptions of his looks is meaningless in his sexual success.

So, whenever a man says, "I see ugly men do X, and average men do Y," realize your perception of male attractiveness, of what you think constitutes average and ugly in your fellow man, does NOT equate to a woman's perception.


But they say women are more about personality than looks though, so if that's true, isn't the reason why Elliot Roger struck out was because of personality most likely? I mean for one thing, women like a guy with a great sense of humor who know how to kick back and have fun. I'm guessing Roger was not that type, or maybe couldn't even fake it?



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12 Aug 2021, 9:29 am

E.R. had seen multiple therapists since he was eight years old.  He was diagnosed with PDD/NOS, an autism spectrum disorder, in 2007.  He had an eponymous blog, through which he expressed loneliness and rejection.

His personality presented as autistic, and he publicly complained about having no friends.  As for any alleged "personality", he essentially had none.


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ironpony
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12 Aug 2021, 9:47 am

Oh I see. Well if someone had the same personality as Rogers, (no personality if that's what he had), would women still want to screw an autistic guy with all those limitations he had, if he was still better looking?



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12 Aug 2021, 11:47 am

ironpony wrote:
Oh I see. Well if someone had the same personality as Rogers, (no personality if that's what he had), would women still want to screw an autistic guy with all those limitations he had, if he was still better looking?
You would have to ask women, especially the women who knew him personally.  Obviously your hypothetical situation never occurred -- nobody was "screwing" him, which is what he was complaining about.

He is dead.  Let us leave him there, shall we?


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12 Aug 2021, 11:55 am

Fnord wrote:
E.R. had seen multiple therapists since he was eight years old.  He was diagnosed with PDD/NOS, an autism spectrum disorder, in 2007.  He had an eponymous blog, through which he expressed loneliness and rejection.

His personality presented as autistic, and he publicly complained about having no friends.  As for any alleged "personality", he essentially had none.





It's actually been suspected that Elliot Rodger had autism. According to sources, he was diagnosed with PDD-NOS back in 2007 and his search history once was "Can I buy a gun in California if I have autism?" which would imply that Elliot did indeed have autism.


I think at the time of shooting, the reason why the family didn't bring it up is because just two years ago in 2012, Adam Lanza who was diagnosed with aspergers, shot up a school and killed a bunch of kids and aspergers was getting some negative press in the media. So because of that, they didn't want to leak the fact that Elliot had aspergers because then people are more likely to associate aspergers with commiting violent crimes. It's bad press for aspergers if two deadly killers in a short period of time are associated with it.



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12 Aug 2021, 12:13 pm

Muse933277 wrote:
Fnord wrote:
E.R. had seen multiple therapists since he was eight years old.  He was diagnosed with PDD/NOS, an autism spectrum disorder, in 2007.  He had an eponymous blog, through which he expressed loneliness and rejection.  His personality presented as autistic, and he publicly complained about having no friends.  As for any alleged "personality", he essentially had none.
It's actually been suspected that Elliot Rodger had autism. According to sources, he was diagnosed with PDD-NOS back in 2007 and his search history once was "Can I buy a gun in California if I have autism?" which would imply that Elliot did indeed have autism.
Which part of "He was diagnosed with PDD/NOS, an autism spectrum disorder, in 2007" did you not understand?

There was no suspicion involved.
Muse933277 wrote:
I think at the time of shooting, the reason why the family didn't bring it up is because just two years ago in 2012, Adam Lanza who was diagnosed with aspergers, shot up a school and killed a bunch of kids and aspergers was getting some negative press in the media. So because of that, they didn't want to leak the fact that Elliot had aspergers because then people are more likely to associate aspergers with commiting violent crimes. It's bad press for aspergers if two deadly killers in a short period of time are associated with it.
Two years ago was 2019, not 2012.


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12 Aug 2021, 12:21 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Oh okay, but I know women who have FWBs that are average looking though, so doesn't that disprove that theory then though?


Yes, you're looking at the reality you've witnessed instead of just repeating talking points that don't withstand scrutiny.


We're not talking a studly hunk vs. the Elephant man. Those are two extremes.

In sexual selection, there is indeed a fine line between average and ugly. As a heterosexual man, you may look at two other men and think they both look "average," or even ugly, even though one has normal success with women and the other struggles miserably. Women are the choosers. As a man, you can't rely on your perceptions of how good looking you think other men are.

I didn't think Elliot Roger was particularly bad looking, but it's not up to me to decide. If the majority of women find him below average or ugly, our male perceptions of his looks is meaningless in his sexual success.

So, whenever a man says, "I see ugly men do X, and average men do Y," realize your perception of male attractiveness, of what you think constitutes average and ugly in your fellow man, does NOT equate to a woman's perception.


Elliot Roger's issues were most likely related to his personality, not his looks. Reducing everything to being about superficial appearance shows one doesn't even get it.


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